SumOne

The Aggrolites are worth a listen:

In my lawsuit arguing that multi-fx don't generally need XLR: I put it to the jury that: a) It's fine, and possibly preferable for buffered instrument or line level signals to go through unbalanced cables up to about 25 foot, and not much of an issue beyond that unless really long distances (unlike mic level signals that do definitely need balanced even at short distances) . DI XLR for distances from instrument/line level pedal to Cab is probably not necessary or preferable: I call forward expert witness #1 "when the cord length is under 10 feet, unbalanced cables actually have a stronger signal than balanced cables. This is because at this length, any distortion is unlikely, and the simplicity of unbalanced cables can work wonders when there’s no detriment coming from potential distortion. For instance, mastering studios typically use unbalanced cables ranging between three and ten feet in length.".........."If you’re using a longer unbalanced cable on a loud device like a guitar, there won’t be a difference at all (vs balanced)" Witness #2 " most people have the impression that a balanced connection is superior because it is more resistant to external signal noise sources. While this is true, it does not necessarily mean that the balanced line is "better" than a single-ended cable"......"Under 10 feet unbalanced cables actually have a stronger signal than balanced cables. Great for low-level/gain signals like instruments"....(unbalanced is) effective at cable lengths up to 20-25 feet" b) Using XLR has a potential risk from phantom power Expert witness #3 'Wikipedia' "Phantom powering can cause equipment malfunction or even damage" Expert witness #4. Line 6 LT/Floor Manual "IMPORTANT! Never connect the Helix device's XLR outputs to a device whose XLR inputs have 48V phantom power enabled! c) There is no harm in using the DI XLR for pedalboard to belt pack for IEMs or home use but it isn't necessary or preferable for those short distances, a higher volume output (instrument or line level) via un-balanced would potentially be better. d) Expert witness #5 "The FOH guy" prefers to use their own DI box, this is usually the case. My concluding remarks to persuade the Basschat jury to rule in favour of not really needing an XLR on a multi-FX pedal: Cable distances aren't usually large enough to matter for multi fx buffered instrument or line level signals. Modern mixers can take instrument or line level inputs where interferance isn't usually an issue (unlike mic level). If there are long cable runs to mixers where a balanced signal would be beneficial you are probably playing at a festival or music venue - they will want to use their own DI to their mixing desk. If you still need your own DI then most Amps have them. In a situaltion where none of those things above apply (and how often is that the case?) then a seperate DI box is better than it being built into a multi fx unit because it can protect against damaging phantom power. Having a seperate DI box isn't an issue as they can be bought for as little as £11, they are small and tough, and passive ones don't even need to be plugged into power. ......Case closed!

I might be wrong, but I get the impression having DI XLR on pedals is a feature that isn't actually needed in real life very often, at least it hasn't been for me. Music venue, Festival, Studio: They have their own DI, mixer etc. Home use: Unncessary unless you somehow have a massive home studio with long cable runs. And worth considering that "when the cord length is under 10 feet, unbalanced cables actually have a stronger signal than balanced cables. This is because at this length, any distortion is unlikely, and the simplicity of unbalanced cables can work wonders when there’s no detriment coming from potential distortion. For instance, mastering studios typically use unbalanced cables ranging between three and ten feet in length." https://www.epiphan.com/blog/audio-cables-balanced-vs-unbalanced/ ) Gigging band: Most players use Amps/Cabs that you wouldn't have any benefit sending a balanced signal to, if also going to a mixer/PA then the most Amps have pre/post DI with XLR . If going to a mixing desk with a low impedence signal (mic level) then balanced cable is pretty much essential as a lot of gain is applied in the pre-amp which highlights unwanted interferance noise, but for a Bass guitar, modern mixers can take instrument (or line) level inputs so it isn't such an issue. The only situation where I think I could need it is if I was in a band that used its own mixing desk/PA that is over 6m away and I didn't have my Amp to use for its DI XLR (Edit, on second thoughts - it could also be useful if wanting to send a balanced signal with Amp/Cab sim direct from the pedal to the mixer/PA >6m away, and different clean signal to the real Amp/Cab) but that's only needed if there are long cable runs and noticable interferance. Even then, the Stomp has balanced cables (just they don't have XLR connectors), and the Core is buffered so noticable interferance is less likely. I dunno, it just hasn't ever seemed like an issue to me, perhaps it is for others though. I can see it would be needed if playing stadiums with a mixing desk a long way away, I'm not at that level quite yet though! If it turned into an issue fo me then I'd buy a cheap passive DI.

You mention that an XLR essential, that does limit things quite a bit. It rules out the Boss GX 100 and GT 1000 Core, Mod Dwarf, Helix Stomp and Pod Go and Effects, Ampero, TC Electronic Plethora, Headrush, Valeton GP 200 LT, Zoom B1 four & MS-60B, Tonex. In fact, the only <£500 ones I can think of that have it are the Valeton GP 200 and the Zoom B2-Four and B6, Mooer GE 250 & 300, Harley Benton. I would question why an XLR is essential as personally I don't think they are, and it seems companies like Boss and Line 6 and TC Electronic are in agreement with me whereas cheaper brands like Zoom, Valeton, Harley Benton do have them....read into that what you will! If it really is needed they can be bought for as little as £13. https://www.gear4music.com/PA-DJ-and-Lighting/SubZero-Passive-DI-Box/1SDA

My favorite lately is the Boss GT 1000 Core: Positive: Sounds good, compact, well built/reliable, gapless preset switching (with trails beween presets), lots of effects blocks per preset (26), 3x parallel paths (which seems overkill but can do things like dynamic split paths for compressors), low power use, 2x fx loops, 2x outputs. Negative: It is quite expensive, the interface isn't as good as other multi-fx. I don't think there is another multi-fx as powerful and compact (perhaps the Mod Dwarf?), it's a blessing and a curse with lots of stuff potentially going on that can only be found and adjusted via menu diving. The interface isn't very user-friendly and it has potential for very complex signal chains but only 3x footswitches and a small screen so it is best used as a preset device - that takes a different mindset to having a pedalboard full of individual pedals you adjust on the go. I know exactly what tunes I'll be playing in a set though so using presets is fine with me. Alternatively, things like the TC Plethora or Line 6 Effects are more like the traditional pedalboard 'stomp this footswitch for this effect' approach which I'd prefer if I was in a band that does more spontanious stuff with effects.

Harsh, but this is the solution not only to this dilemma but other Bass related ones (sore back etc) and potentially more serious non Bass related ones further down the line too. I'm sure Yoda or some other equally esteemed religions figure would have an inspiring saying about the difficult path leading to the best destination.

The closer of that Blackheart Man album is quite emotional

This has probably been posted before (perhaps by me), but this is an absolute classic that can't be listened to too much:

^^^ I like his videos, very informative. The latency is worth knowing and most reviewers don't go into that sort of detail. 8.6ms (@128 frames) is okay, 16.5ms (@256 frames) might be a bit much. Apparently 10ms is about where it's noticeable.

Gojira FX should make one with that design.

Ibanez SR 300

Nice one, thanks for that. It looks like a great pedal but I think I'll play it safe and go with Boss.

The mod Dwarf looks like a great bit of kit (And Juno have just one in stock, £417). My dilema is this or Boss GT 1000 Core (which Scan are doing for £549). The thing that is edging me towards the Core is the long track-record of Boss for quality/reliability, and I'm pretty certain Boss will be around for years to come for updates/support etc which is possibly not the case for Mod. Have any Mod users here had reliability issues (other than the things I've read in this thread)? I have an MPC and DAWs that I use for processing Bass/Effects at home so the pedal is only needed for live use where reliability is probably the #1 thing I need.

It is a tough decision, in the last year or so there seems to be a lot more multi-fx choice that give Line 6 a run for their money and start to make individual pedals seem a bit of a costly specialist thing of the past - like having a classic car.

I'll probably go for the Boss GT 1000 Core (Again! I briefly owned one but sold it when I incorrectly thought I wouldn't be doing live stuff for a while - I have other ways of doing effects processing at home). It seems reliable, compact, sounds good - has decent compressor, EQ, drives, amp/cab sims and IRs (and more), can split the outputs (i.e. clean to Amp, Amp/Cab sims signal to PA) and for my particular need I can easily have a preset with a footswitch switching between a split path that does Reggae type stuff on one path and ska/punk on the other (with enough spare effects blocks to do things like have different compressors for each path), or there's gapless switching between presets.

The Ultrawave does look good, 3 seconds to long-press footswitch from one setting to the other isn't ideal for me though, and getting midi control adds to the complexity and cost. On reflection I think an all-in-one multi-fx is going to be the best option for me.

Nice! I look forward to the video. It looks like a great pedal - ticks all the boxes. The £729 price tag is a bit unfortunate as it is about £400 more than I was hoping to spend, I guess you get what you pay for though.

Lack of hardware controls puts me off the SA One Series a bit. Menu diving on a Zoom MS-60B is a pain, but at least it is a possibility without attaching to a phone or Laptop. I did own an Aftershock for a while and got rid of it because although it says it can do every conceivable type of distortion I didn't feel any were quite as good as just an individual pedals. Convenient though, and good for the EQ stuff so I might give it another go. The Ultrawave looks interesting as it'd mean a seperate compressor isn't needed, I've been put off by the fact that every demo shows it doing really extreme foldover and synth and ring modulator type sounds and I just want a fairly standard tubescreamer type distortion, I assume it probably can do mild too though?

That's a good call. I did own one and still have the Neuro app installed so had a quick look on it and there is a lot of EQ adjustability per preset, and a long-press on theh footswitch can change from one preset to the other. There is one for sale on here so I might go for that, or perhaps the Ultrawave that's for also for sale here as that has the EQ and drive and also a compressor.

Thanks for the suggestions. I like the form factor of the Tech 21 flyrig type pedals, it's a shame that none other than the VT Deluxe seem to have programmable EQ including mids. The Zoom pedals are undoubtedtly the best value, I have found myself (particularaly with the MS-60B) scratching my head and clicking through menus to get into A/B mode or scrolling through A-G or whatever it is to get back to where I want to be and trying to remember which preset is which, or figure out what is unexpectedly on/off in the signal chain though. That is user error but I'd prefer something more foolproof for live use 'stomp this button for this sound, the other button for the other sound'. The Valeton GP 200 LT is a contender (£229 Andertons), could click up/down between EQ and drive presets, it also means I wouldn't need a seperate tuner or compressor. Probably not much better than the Zoom B1-four but the coloured footswitch lights and screen might make it a bit more foolproof.

Surely it's like saying 'I only need one car/bike/pair of shoes etc. to get from A to B'... yeah, you can go for a hike in high heels bit it isn't going to get the job done as well as walking boots, (depends on the job through I suppose!).

The lists are all different, no one is trying to prove anything - just letting people know their personal favorites, for fun.