TimR

Ha. The wrong drummer can kill the gig. I lasted over ten years with one believing it was my playing that was poor. Then I depped with four bands and realised what the real problem was. Time to leave the band...

Although according to Wikipedia Keith was his Godfather and only gave him his first drum kit and they never actually sat at a kit together. There you go.

Ta Da! Roger was interviewed on Radio 2 a few years ago. Apparently Zak spent time with Keith learning drums when he was very small. They've tried other drummers but all tended to be "four to the floor merchants", "Zak is perfect for the band".

New song from "The Who". http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-29374342 Could be interesting.

That should be entertaining advert. Wanted - Bass Player: must be willing to travel and have own 5 seater mini van.

Some people just don't have any empathy. I went through a similar thing when my mum was terminally ill and ultimately died. One of the guys in the band just had no idea and kept having a go at my 'attitude'. I wasn't really focused on the band for some strange reason. I would chill for a bit and wait now that things have calmed down. Air your concerns about the travelling and work out whether the rest of the band really want to make it big or they're just going with the (hopelessly misguided) singer. Then go on without him. Anyway, good luck this afternoon.

That's because even at a pro level musicians are in it for the music first and money second but it's such a fine line that the money has to be enough. No one wants to pay to play. We do two sets of an hour. Then we have an hour set up and and hour breakdown. I played on Sunday afternoon for £30. Works out £6ph including my travelling. However, I usually spend a good portion of my Sunday afternoon doing the weekly shop and scratting around for something to do. The £30 is usually more but we had some band operational costs (website etc) to pay this month. I'm not keen on less than £80 for a Saturday night.

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1411502521' post='2560221'] ... Perhaps I should have taken up violin so that I could blame my performances on the fact that I can't afford a Stradivarius [/quote] As you've mentioned Stradivarius twice now... http://basschat.co.uk/topic/163896-violinists-cant-tell-the-difference-between-stradivarius-violins-and-new-ones

[quote name='steve-bbb' timestamp='1411483271' post='2559921'] that would make bobby vega's J worth about 3p per gig [/quote] That's really my point. The bass is a tool. It wears, you replace parts (pots, strings, nuts, machine heads, frets). Will a cheap bass last 10 years? Is it a cheap bass if it lasts 10years? I think it's about return on what you paid for the bass rather than absolute value.

This is a fantastic thread that goes someway to answer your question (or not): http://basschat.co.uk/topic/231907-what-does-it-mean-to-outgrow-cheap-but-good-for-the-price-basses Cheap is a difficult quality/quantity to define. I've gigged a £400 bass for ten years. Is £400 cheap? £40 a year, maybe £2-£3 a gig? Don't know.

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1411315282' post='2558348'] ... Good point. Actually All of our tracks are either a w@nkfest for the guitarist or the keys-man. Right now all the good bass lines are already being done on the keys. I recon this is due to them not having a bass-man for a while. I've started working on the solos and bass-lines, so I can justify winning them back to the bass. If I don't then I'll be stuck on I, 3, 5, 3 (e.g.) forever. ... [/quote] Lesson #457: This is the common MO of all keyboard players. You may have some work to do to "re-educate" him on Left hand technique. Good luck, this may well be why their old bass player died.

[quote name='UglyDog' timestamp='1411315325' post='2558349'] What's the point of doing it at all if you're not enjoying it? [/quote] Certain parts of playing can be a chore but we hope the benifits outweigh the downsides. You know that bit in a gig where three songs in a row go belly up, the next song is all roots and you're thinking "Beam me up Scotty, I've got some wallpapering at home I should really be doing tonight." That's when you smile and dig deep.

You can often tell whether the bass line is a bass line played by a bass player or by a guitar player. Guitarists just don't groove. A bass player playing roots properly will groove. IMO anyone finding playing root notes boring has missed something or is lacking confidence in their abilities. I'll play as many root note songs as the band want, I can play something 'interesting' in other songs. People frequently complement me on my playing so I must be doing something right.

[quote name='Grangur' timestamp='1411228143' post='2557721'] ... If I were to walk into a pub though, and we were on stage, I don't think I'd stay to buy a drink. ... [/quote] Have they gigged with a previous bass player? It's a great opportunity for you to learn to use your ears. Which is what it's all about. When you step into a gig situation and a song misses a chorus or an extra verse appears or the drummer stops the song early, these are the skills you need. If the keys and guitar are overplaying and competing for space then they've not developed their ears and you probably need to tactfully point it out when you finish the song when it happens. Just do this on one song a practice or you'll get their backs up. Just a gently "I think the bit in the middle sounded a but messy, can we go over what we're all playing there?" Also listen carefully to the others while you are playing (bass players do this very well and IMO it's why so many bass players become producers) work out whether the songs are being played as a band and rather than playing whole songs from top to bottom, you may have to pull apart small sections. That's the difference between home practice, band practice and band rehearsal. As alluded to the quote you raise. Very few bands 'only' rehearse, most get the home practice done, maybe spend two or three run throughs in practice then 'rehearse' by playing the tune top to bottom. Then after the gig decide if any tunes need more practice time (home or band time).

Ears.

I'm another one who wonders what all those extra knobs are for. Gain until the light comes on. Volume until you're as loud as the drums. Play.

Either. But I find with a steady band it's very hard to maintain a good musical relationship with them. They're will always be a difference of opinion on what tunes to play. Unless you have a strong vocalist who can sing anything and wants to sing anything and the rest of the band are open. I've found a year to eighteen months and things start to get a bit of a grind.

I thought FM had most of the artistic input and control over the final arrangements.

Although what is the problem with how long they take to set up? It takes me 2 trips to the at and less than 5mins to set my bass gear up. Then I'll do the lights which is another trip and another 5mins. That's a lot quicker than the drummer. So I could either arrive much later, or as expected, at the same time as everyone else, set up then disappear until 'sound check'. Our 'sound check' is done during the first song. We just do a very rudimentary operational check of the PA.

Yes. I agree there are two types of PA. 1) 200w vocal PA that every vocalist should own and bring to the gig for their own use. 2) Full PA capable of running instruments. My view has always been in case 2) that one person should own the PA and the band should hire it from them. Any breakage from misuse or accident should be paid for by the person misusing it. Any accident from band funds. Any wear and tear paid for by the owner. The problem is; someone has to store the gear and go out and replace leads and other bits that wear out. It can quickly becomes a thankless task and 'expected'. And with the best will in the world shared gear doesn't get treated with the same respect and looked after as well as personal property.

The drummer and I usually arrive at the gig an hour before we are due to play. I think he takes his time but less than 30mins. Out of the six drummers I've played with in the last 2 years, only one has tuned up at the gig. He was also the least proficient player. The tuning may well be a confidence thing. When I tune my bass, I do it silently and quickly. Several times before we've been due to start the guitarist has been very insistent that I tune up, just because he hasn't seen or heard me do it.

Queen got rid of their original bass player because he took the spotlight away from Freddie. John was picked because he blended into the background.

When you read interviews from the other members they're very careful what they say. They avoid contact with him. The clear message is that he and Freddie were very close and he was devastated when Freddie died and went into depression. The most recent interview alludes to him being in a 'fragile' state. Very, very sad.

[quote name='gafbass02' timestamp='1403472956' post='2483089'] Yep, Robins nest. I'm pretty sure those factors, especially the low ceiling are pretty big contributors. But mainly the balloons. [/quote] Contributors? You haven't broken any rules. No doubt if it had sounded bad you would have moved the speakers. You cannea break the 'rules' of physics.

A few things come to mind there. 1) sloping ceiling. 2) distance of speakers from side wall, wall behind band and wall behind audience.