TimR

[quote name='Adrenochrome' timestamp='1423217108' post='2682241'] ... I think many bass players like that new 'sproingy' sound, ... [/quote] Yes. Sproingy. That's a good onomatopoeia. Exactly why I changed strings. In the end I think I could only hear the sproing when playing solo. Which happens very rarely. I might see if I can get a sproing FX pedal.

[quote name='Nicko' timestamp='1423216248' post='2682230'] As far as I can tell if you get a lot of crap building up on your strings it affects the vibration of the string. So even if your scale length is correct when you fret the string the effective length of the sting appears to be altered - resulting in unwanted/atonal effect. Other than that damage to the winding at the fret or bridge will result in poor intonation. [/quote] Nice one. Thanks. Once again this forum brings a new aspect to bass playing I had never considered. I'll double check my intonation with a tuner but my ears seem to think it's fine.

[quote name='Lozz196' timestamp='1423080904' post='2680553'] I like the sound of dead Roto Steel Rounds, so as long as they hold tuning, they stay on my basses as long as possible. I keep tinkering around with flats, but I also prefer the feel of the Rotos under my fingers so Rotos it be. [/quote] I used Rotos for years but thought they died very quickly. I'd say three to six weeks before they lose all the top end piano type sound (zing?). I'd change them every three to six months as by then they'd sound completely dead. I'm wondering if it is the pickups though. I'm now playing an active bass with Bass Center Stadium Elites. I've no idea how long they've been on (maybe over three years) but they still sound fresh. What do you guys mean by intonation going out? I've never noticed this effect. .

[quote name='chris_b' timestamp='1423146454' post='2681391'] Why all this effort to define a professional musician? The term professional in the context of being a musician relates to earning a living not to ability. Professional musicians get paid to do what they do, exclusively. Semi pro musicians have a day job and play as a hobby for money. Very good players are better than good players and fantastic players are better than that. They may or may not be professional musicians. One of the best guitarists I've played with spent his life working in a factory. [/quote] It's just a thought experiment I think. Hence you can have both unprofessional professionals and professional amateurs.

[quote name='BigRedX' timestamp='1423141372' post='2681281'] But there are so many jobs, especially "creative" ones where experience and proven ability far trump any qualifications (professional or not). [/quote] Most professional qualifications require a level of practical training and competence. There's people with degrees, then the professional qualification is gained some years after that. But there are routes through with just practical experience. You don't need formal qualifications, unitil the 'professional' bit. But that's an interesting aspect to the discussion specifically because it doesn't exist in music. It's pretty much becoming clear that 'professionalism' is what we're talking about, not just about earning money.

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1423139454' post='2681223'] My cricket club has had a number of professionals over the years. They get paid to play cricket. They get referred to as "pros" or "professionals". Yet they do not belong to any professional body... [/quote] Quite. As Dad says. What the dictionary says, what we use in defferent contexts, and what the law says are all very different points. Which is why there is no real definition of what professional actually means. Musician may be a profession, they may regard themselves as a professional, others may regard them as professional, the dictionary may describe them as professional. It's a funny term. In certain circles a musician who earns money from playing isn't regarded as a professional. A school teach is a professional. There are recognised career paths and examinations to becoming a professional teacher. Is the guy busking in the street, for coins into his hat, a professional? (London professional musicians busking with permission excepted)

[quote name='Conan' timestamp='1423132269' post='2681066'] Bloody semantics again! We all know what we mean, and what others mean - but we still find things to argue about! [/quote] There's no argument. We don't all know what we mean. We all have different definitions in addition to the dictionary. There is no professional body for musicians. Just like there is no professional body for plumbers. You are either a plumber or a musician. The term professional is a misnomer.

[quote name='Jazzneck' timestamp='1423126661' post='2680974'] .. I ask for a list of songs we're going to do and his answer was "bollocks, we'll wing it!". ... [/quote] I love gigs like that. You know you're going to be in a pair of safe hands. No drama queens.

Dad, The point I was making is, within the world of business, just because you do something as a job doesn't make you a proffesional. It may fit the broad dictionary definition but I don't think that's relevant. To be a proffesional you have to have an additional proffesional qualification rather than just do something for a living. Often you see adverts for flats to rent "Seeking Proffesionals". I'm guessing they're not looking for proffesional refuse collectors.

[quote name='BILL POSTERS' timestamp='1423089397' post='2680746'] There are people who would prefer to call them Technicians. Although they are usually the ones with the qualifications. [/quote] A degree in engineering gets you a BEng. That make you an engineer not a technician. You can have a degree in accountancy and be an accountant but until you get chartered status you're not considered a proffesional. I think there's a list of proffesional people who can sign passports. Musicians aren't on it

Maybe not funny ha ha but certainly funny weird. "I'm a lesbian and I have cancer. Can I sing a song?"

[quote name='The Badderer' timestamp='1423083418' post='2680602'] ... [/quote] There are a lot of overly pedantic keyboard warriors who should think before they post and ask for clarification before wading in to the attack. Like any forum really.

There are people with degrees in engineering who are engineers by proffesion. It's their day job, they make all their money from it. But they don't have the proffessional qualification that a CEng does. This would probably go for all the craftsmen builders, plumbers, electricians. They do it as their main job but they're not technically proffesionals. They still hold the proffesional qualification when they are retired. There are poffesional qualifications for a musician. Eg DipABRSM, LRSM, and FRSM.

We are, of course, confusing 'pro' with 'big name'. As is evident there are hundreds of thousands of proffesional musicians. Only a handful of big names. I chatted with a big name who was at a party that my band played at. He even stood in for a couple of numbers. He played well enough considering he was unprepared. My guess is he was probably extremely good at playing his bands own material but just as good as the rest of us at standard covers. Nothing magical that he could just play anything. I suspect I knew more tunes than he does as his sole music output is playing in his band at Butlins etc. On the other hand I've played with pro musicians who just have an encyclopaedic knowledge of tunes. My dad isn't a pro but at 75 has probably played almost every tune ever written. You get to a point where you just know what chord should come next. Music isn't very mystic once you've got some sound experience and theory knowledge.

[quote name='tinyd' timestamp='1423040854' post='2679784'] I agree. My guess is that many pros would say something like "get the best bass you can afford and then practice a lot" whereas many posts here are in search of the perfect sound. This is not very scientific, I know, but the fact that the "Bass Guitars" and "Amps and Cabs" forums here have 21,000 topics whereas "Theory and Technique" has 2,000 does indicate that most people come to this site to discuss gear. [/quote] It's like a dieting forum: How do I lose weight? Proper answer - eat less, exercise more. Forum answer would have hundreds of sub forums all dedicated to various pseudo scientific theories because everyone knows the answer but it's not a quick fix. It takes too long and requires some dedication. New gear is the quick fix but in a month's time you'll be searching for more new gear once the new gear effect has worn off.

[quote name='Count Bassy' timestamp='1423042717' post='2679806'] Well a mixture here: We do Mustang Sally. The singer hates it as he thinks it's beneath him (but the audience love it). On the other hand the singer wants to do Sweet Child Of Mine, which we've just started learning, but I think its a bit dull. On the other other hand, I definitely want to do Radar Love. To be honest I don't quite understand why it's on the list - IME you hardly ever hear it being played in pubs (possibly because it's not straight forward) And on the other other other hand the saxophonist/pianist wants to do Free Bird which I also really like and again, round here at least, rarely gets played these days (20 years ago, yes). [/quote] That's the rub for me. I've not heard bands play those tunes in about 10years plus. Bands DO evolve their setlists. Ours is constantly evolving. If we're bored with the tunes it shows when we play them. You should also be able to gauge audience reaction to them. If people go outside/sit down/ go to the bar in droves, it's time to chop them. Do bands really just trot out the same setlist year in year out and wonder why their gigs are drying up?

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1423005461' post='2679599'] I did a few pro gigs late last year and the pro session bassist had a random hired amp and cab, and his beloved Stingray which had a warped neck and a disgusting action. He knew this, even had it looked at by his trusted tech, and yet it's his main bass. He loves its tone and that's all that really mattered to him. He turned up, plugged it in, sound checked. Got on stage for the show, put in his IEMs, and played great all night. [/quote] Pretty much as I'd expect. I've done enough dep gigs to know you learn the music (assuming no dots or charts), turn up, plug in and play. Get paid and go home. You know what questions to ask beforehand and, just as importantly, which questions you don't need to ask. There's a lot of people on the forum who don't think much before asking questions and would be better off practising the instrument rather than spending time obsessing over gear. I was once told to "Play everything. Get out your CD collection and learn the lot." I suspect most of 'us' on the forum only learn tunes we have to for our band's setlist. Then we only get the bass out for band rehearsals or gigs.

[quote name='xilddx' timestamp='1422994661' post='2679338'] .. who actually had the time and inclination to contribute, say, 200 posts a year, what do you think we would learn from them that is not available from other sources, including each other as members? And another thought, are there things they can learn from us amateur/semi pro members? [size=5][color=#ff0000][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]Without going into WHY they are [b]NOT[/b] posting here please! [/font][/color][/size] [/quote] That they're just like we are in our day job. We find a way that works for us and get on with it. Sometimes we get a good boss with a good project locally, sometimes we don't. I think we put these people on a pedestal when really they're just ordinary guys/girls with an unusual job. I know lots of pros, I also know lots of builders who worked on some prestigious projects, they've been to paces and seen things normal people have never/will never see. It's all the same. .

[quote name='ubit' timestamp='1422816525' post='2677144'] Well I play bass and sing lead vocals, so do I get the prize for doing most in the band? [/quote] No. You probably have to do lights, sound, set it all up and drive the van as well. (Although not all at the same time...) .

I don't surf the net with headphones on. I surf silently. To listen to a tune or watch a video I have to go home or upstairs and try to find a working set of earphones or turn on the PC. The phone internal speaker is just about good enough to watch a non music video.

[quote name='paul h' timestamp='1422831594' post='2677421'] What irks me most about this insistence of bands covering turgid, dull, old man rock is that it means missing out on literally thousands of really great songs. I wish we had more of a tradition of "top 40" bands in this country. At any point in time there are dozens of great songs in the charts which would be awesome fun to play and would go down well pretty much anywhere. But alas we can't because some doddery old granddad always asks for Sweet Home Alabama! [/quote] Anyone would think we only play All Right Now 30 times in one night and have no other material. I did a survey here just before Christmas. Only a few of us on the forum play it. In fact contrary to the popular belief amongst us, there's hundreds of songs we all play with little crossover. If we all played the same 30 songs that would be different. When we play it people sing along. They don't walk out the pub. That indicates to me thaf they enjoy hearing it. Don't forget we're musicians playing probably the same set every week for a few months. That would give anyone quite a skewed view of some tunes.

[quote name='mep' timestamp='1422822167' post='2677228'] I agree too. Why are you playing that old dad rock tune for. Bin it and find another song. [/quote] Because our audience are old dads? .

Ziggy is worth putting some work on. It's a great line and not that hard.

[quote name='cybertect' timestamp='1422543426' post='2673911'] Quite so - a thread a couple of lines below this one: [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/254531-alright-now-what-do-you-do-in-the-verses/"]Alright Now - What do you do in the verses?[/url] [/quote] I have just contributed. Thanks.

I have purchased a cowbell for £6. It sounds awesome and I don't look like a spare part. Everything needs more cowbell.