TimR

It's sometimes difficult to pitch an advert right. We need a singer. I'm conscious of putting out an ad that says: "We're a bunch of 40something guys who've been in various bands but never gigged together. We've had 2 rehearsals and have 8 songs that are sounding good but need a singer to go any further. Hope to be gigging within a month of finding right singer." All truthful but wonder how many takers we would get.

[quote name='Chrismanbass' timestamp='1347272906' post='1798577'] Bought one of those for my band and ended up having to buy normal par cans to supplement it in the end as its not really powerful enough on its own good piece of kit in terms of the space it takes up however if you buy it i'd suggest buying two as one really isn't powerful enough to light a band we use four of these to supliment it which gives us a good range of options at venues however if i had my money back i would've bought 8 and 2 T- Bars [url="http://www.decks.co.uk/products/LED_Par_Cans/LEDJ/LED64_Floor_Can_Black"]http://www.decks.co....Floor_Can_Black[/url] the bottom line imho is that you very much get what you pay for (i know its very easy to spend others money) however if you buy stuff on the cheap then it will look cheap [/quote] Yes, that's what I have. T bars were £25 from Maplin (£29 deal at the moment) and 2 each side are fine. As I say trick is to get them high and at the right distance from the band. Too close and you get dark areas, too far away and they're not bright enough. As I say, I may get 2 more to sit on the floor, particularly at the back for drums. Experimenting with what you have is always the key thing. If you put them in one position and don't get what you expect, move them around, then go stand at the back of the venue with someone standing on stage. Time spent doing this at your first gig pays dividends. Mine were definitely less than £85 though!

Regarding recording. The hardest part is getting the scratch track down. Offering the facilities to do a multi track recording in whatever format for the band to take away and overdub/remix at their leisure is a good bonus.

Wouldn't they get in the way too? I use 4 led par cans on two stands, one stand either side of the stage. The trick is to get them up as high as you possibly can so they shine downwards. All set on automatic sound to light. I used to run them via a DMX mixer but it was more hassle than it was worth. I am considering getting two more par cans and putting them on the floor next to the monitors. At £50 each they're cheap really.

[quote name='flyfisher' timestamp='1347189884' post='1797776'] At this rate we'll soon see famous bassists being given a country's highest honour in recognition of their contribution to music. Er, hang on . . . . . [url="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-19532151"]http://www.bbc.co.uk...t-arts-19532151[/url] [/quote] Nope. Nothing in there about him being a bass payer. Think he played piano at the Olympics.

SpinyNorman is right, to some extent. I'm sure there were band leaders - I'm guessing Glen Miller who toured with their own bands and wrote their own material.

Strictly speaking I suppose you are only covering a tune if it has been previously recorded. I suppose in the case of Cilla Black/Diane Warwick they are both recording a tune written by someone else and each of them could be considered as the original recording artist. It always makes me laugh when people say they do Hard to Handle, but the do the Black Crows version, not the Otis Redding version. A quick glance at wiki tells me that loads of artists have covered it and Otis didn't write it alone. It's all semantics. A song is a song, doesn't matter who wrote it as long as they get some credit or, more importantly, the person recording it doesn't take the credit. Regards the playing someone else's tune is lazy comment. There are very few good singer/songwriters out there that can perform songs to their best. Some songwriters even write songs with someone in mind to sing the song. Imagine if every west end musical starred Tim Rice and Andrew Loyd Webber in the leading roles!

Jimi Hendrix played mainly covers IIRC. Does it matter? Loads of 80s tunes were covers of 50s tunes and loads of 10s tunes are covers of 80s tunes. My dad said my grandad used to complain that 50s tunes were versions of tunes from the 20s. If I hear that line "We take a tune done by someone else and make it our own." I'll scream! I think if you make a statement that you write all your own material then that's one thing. Even if you do rearrange a song written by someone else. Plenty of bands do it, some don't even change the original arrangement and you wonder why they bothered to release it. If you're a covers band, it just means you don't write your own material. I think it's still a covers band if all you do is rearrange the tunes. The Worzels, Hayseed Dixie etc make no secret of it.

So are we now blaming the relaxation of performance licensing for a glut of places to perform and too much opportunity? So now really is the chance for good bands to start to charge decent rates? If i can keep an audience of 100 people in a pub why should I play the Coach and Horses for £200 when the White Lion will pay me £250.

It's quite remarkable how many pub landlords only do it for the beer, only open the odd Saturday night, only serve the beer they like and don't expect to get paid.

[quote name='Jambo10' timestamp='1346529228' post='1790346'] Last night, ourselves, along with 2 supports (punk band and rock blues band) did a charity gig, 4 hours of solid live music. ... [/quote] Seems an odd mix - who were you Hopi g the gig would appeal to? What sort of music does your band play? How much do you usually charge? I think if you want to raise money for charity you're usually better off doing a regular pub gig, donating your fee to charity and passing round a bucket.

It's always difficult when you are asked to leave a band, it's also just as hard to ask someone to leave a band. I've been on both sides of the fence. It may seem hard at the moment but you shouldn't really take it personally, or like has been said a few times on this thread, it'll eat you up for years. The best thing is realise that you don't fit in with their current plans and move on, don't harbour a grudge, tell them if it doesn't work out you're still available. If you were in a band and another successful band headhunted you for a major tour, what would you do?

Landlords also know which weekends will be traditionally quiet. First few weekends after the new year before pay day. Last weekend of Summer holidays - people with kids getting ready for school, the shops were manic with last minute "my shoes are too small" and "forgot to get new shorts for PE" coupled with universities going back and holiday prices for people without kids dropping to somewhat less extortionate prices.

[quote name='Doddy' timestamp='1346634700' post='1791466'] .... and it was £7 to get in! [/quote] There's your reason right there.

Oh god! Well I suppose it's a creative use of autotune if nothing else. At lunchtime I heard Tom Cruise and a bunch of others singing a Whitesnake cover. From a film. Truly awful.

[quote name='Beer of the Bass' timestamp='1346591653' post='1790877'] Take this with a pinch of salt, as I've no covers band experience, but it seems that some of the best received covers bands I've seen have been the ones who react quickly and include a couple of this months (or even this weeks) hits in their set. It doesn't even seem to matter if the style is totally inappropriate, as forty-something rock dudes doing Lady Gaga or whatever can make for an entertaining night. If Pulp, Ocean Colour Scene, Oasis and the Stone Roses (which could be 10-20 years old depending on song choice) are the more recent stuff in your set, this might be worth a try. [/quote] You're right. That and they're not responsive to their audience. If the pub is full of 18-30s play recent stuff. 30-50 70s and 80s, 60+ and play 60s music.

Fair point but that's mainly families. Drinking canned beer? I'd rather poke my eyes out. People who want to see live music will come and see live music. I think FaceBook and forums have a place in this with people staying in and chatting on line rather than meeting strangers in pubs.

Bands are getting louder. I can just about take an hour of being played at. CDs mean that the dynamics of tunes are being reduced songs are either slow and quiet or fast and loud. As performers we need to up our game to get people to sit up and say, that sounds good I'm staying here till the end. Add dynamics and over emphasise the existing ones. Playing the same old tunes because that's what the punters want is one thing but there are loads of tunes out there that nobody plays. The bands that play in St. Albans are very good at doing this and I suspect that getting gigs there is hard. Might have something to do with Hertforshire University Arts being located very close.

Agree in writing songwriting credits and make a simple recording as soon as you've written the song, or sooner.

Well if you're continuing in that vein. Friends of mine were approached to be signed. Great, they loved the image, that they could all play well and read, the only snag was their music was cr.p. The label had a writer, all they had to do was drop all their tunes and play what the label provided. Or Another band that were signed to a restrictive exclusive deal and kept out of the studio for a long time; 3 years+. While another band who looked and sounded very similar were given all the breaks.

There will no doubt be other issues that as a friend they may feel that they couldn't talk about. Friends are often odd and won't say things for fear of upsetting you. I was chucked out of a band due to not having long hair. To this day I still meet long haired musicians who seem to think that their long hair is a very important aspect of their lives and think not having hair must be a real worry for me. Looking back, the image was only part of it. A lot if it was due to my attitude which probably didn't come across in the way I'd hoped. Also my playing wasn't quite as good as I thought and not as good as one of their other friends. Anyway the 'interest' ended up being a loser and the bands music went downhill, my playing wasn't great but I helped rein the mad guitarist back (I suspect this was part of why they got rid of me). The fan base drifted (I had a big circle of friends who stopped going to the gigs). People bring different things to bands apart from image and playing ability. The big part of a band is the hang. They may have trouble integrating another bass player, they may not. You shouldn't have much trouble finding another band.

Maybe you should get some strippers in too.

I think if you are drawing a good crowd you can go on an estimated £2/punter. So if you're playing to 200 in a pub at least £400. If you've only got 50 people in the audience and you're asking £250 you have to try to justify why/how the landlord can pay you £5 a head. If you can justify that on the strength of what they are spending then charge it.

Quote all gigs on an individual basis but base them on a standard rate. Factor in repeat gigs and ability to pay. Eg if you'll get a residency from a pub then it's worth doing 12 for £250, if it's a one off wedding at a big venue a lot more. So no such thing as mates rates. If you want to do the gig you drop the price accordingly. £300 is a lot for a 3 piece playing in a back garden, not a lot for a function room of a hotel. My band are happy as individuals to play for free but not happy to be taken advantage of. When you drop your price by £300 for a mate and then find he's put £300 on the bar you start to feel like you're paying for his guests drinks!

Yes. Drums and bass is a partnership. You both have to listen to each other. If it's a one way street and the drummer just insists on playing what he wants it can get very frustrating. You're spoiled now. Once you play with a drummer with good ears and feel you can never go back. I played with a bad drummer for so long I began to doubt my ability as a bass player. Depping for 3 bands was all it took to convince me to quit. I've since been told that the wrong person quit....