TimR

That raises the questions. Is it taught? How can it be taught? At what stage in a students education is it introduced?

Good question. Some people get feel naturally. Some need to be told what it is and then they get it. Unfortunately there are also those that will never get it. It depends on how well someone can listen and how open they are to trying new things. There is some discussion that even classical pieces 'swung', but there was no way to convey this on the sheet music at the time, and classical music no longer has feel. I can particularly remember having this discussion with two people. The first was a horn player (classically trained) who couldn't understand why when she played exactly what was written on the sheet music it still didn't sound good. I told her to use it as a guide. The music tells you what notes to play and when. Imagine reading a book out loud. The words and punctuation tell you what to say and the rhythm, but you still need to understand the meaning in order to read it with any emotion. It was a light bulb moment for her. The second was a drummer (marching band trained). We were having real trouble playing a tune. But he couldn't understand the concept at all, and wouldn't listen. Everytime I tried to explain about playing slightly ahead of the beat he replied that you should always play exactly on the beat otherwise the tune will speed up. We had to drop the tune from the set.

[quote name='woolleydick' post='557641' date='Aug 1 2009, 10:33 AM']Hi folks as an update, we finally traced the fault to a 4-way extension block. This unit, bought in the UK and of a reputable brand was a filtered type. The filtering was achieved by a capacitor on each socket between live and earth. One of these caps had shorted thus connecting live and earth. Now of course we do not know why it shorted, it is extremely unlikely that it did it all on its own.[/quote] An RCD fitted to that type of filter can sometimes nuciance trip as there will be earth leakage through the capacitors under usual working conditions. Normally it wouldn't be a problem, but when multiple devices are plugged in to it each with their own filters this can lead to high earth leakage currents. Often people will just take the RCD out without checking further for a real fault. Some types of equipment just have high leakage currents and cause problems when using RCDs, washing machines and fridges can play havoc with them. I am surpised that the fault current was still low enough not blow the fuse. If you do get a frequenly tripping RCD, use it to determine which bit of kit is causing the trip, by plugging each bit of kit into in turn until you find the offending article. Don't use the offending article until someone who knows what they are doing has checked it out. Shocks are an occupational hazzard to me, but luckily I've only had 2 'cup of tea' shocks in 15 years. That smell of your own burning flesh and feeling of galloping horses on you chest are not pleasant. I had an interesting gig where we were late on and the dep keyboard players amp kept cutting out. He had to keep his foot on the mains plug and everytime he moved his foot it cut out. We were then further delayed while I rewired all four of his mains plugs. After fixing the one that was showing problems I thought it wise to check the others and found they were all in as bad condition. Keep music Live not LIVE.....

That is why I referred to it as 'feel'. It depends greatly on the style and mood of the piece whether the beat feels pushed or behind. 'Dragging' implies to me that the whole tune is getting slower because someone is not keeping up. 'Rushing' implies to me that that someone is speeding the tune up. Playing behind the beat is not dragging, it is a technique used to make a tune sound more relaxed, and playing ahead of the beat is not 'rushing' its a technique used to make the tune sound more exciting. Good musicians will know whether to play ahead or behind, but again by how much is up to the drummer to set, (although a lot of fun can be had when the bass is behind what the drummer is playing and vice versa) and if they are not playing it right, you will probably need to talk to them and rehearse that passage. This is pretty advanced drumming and not many drummers get the concept. Again sweeping generalisations.

[quote name='TheButler' post='552843' date='Jul 27 2009, 04:38 PM']... We appreciate your efforts over the last few weeks, but we're can't really see it working out, and this is perhaps as much to do with the fact we have been together for a few years now and would struggle with anyone new, as it is to do with you. I'm sure you'll have no problems finding a new vehicle for your bassing - there are plenty of folks looking for guys like you - so all the best. ....[/quote] So they've asked you along to play with them and decided after a few weeks that you're not really what they are after. Maybe they thought from the begining that you wern't exactly what they were after but would give you a shot. I expect they already had a set sound, particular way of playing or even an image that they were after. After a few weeks of working with you they decide that you don't fit in. They gave it a shot, you gave it a shot and it didn't work for them. The positive thing is that they've suggested you will have no problem finding another band so it's not your ability as far as they're concerned.

[quote name='iamapirate' post='550696' date='Jul 24 2009, 11:12 PM']Now I have a question that is based on what this guy will probably experience: The lead singer/guitarist goes out of time. The drummer can't quite tell - but he knows something's gone wrong. The g-tard singer decides in his mind that he is right and everyone should follow him. The drummer's heard that he's the centre of the band and carries on. Who do you follow??[/quote] The drummer is the metronome of the band. Always move to follow the drummer. Guitarists and vocalists can be miles out and a lot of the audience won't notice. The bass and drums have to continue driving together, especially if te audience are dancing. If the drummer doesn't understand 'feel', then it can be very hard to play anything. This applies to funk and rock equally. Its a sweeping generalisation to say that 2 and 4 should always be dead on the beat, there are plenty of tunes where the beat is implied and no one plays dead on the beat. Drum machines generally have no feel.

[quote name='iamapirate' post='545016' date='Jul 19 2009, 11:23 PM']I think that after 7 pages, we can sucessfully conclude 5 things: [b] 1) Some people care about the band's appearance on stage when they see a gig 2) Some people don't. 3) Some people Have a uniform/dress code in their band and try to make an effort 4) Some don't - although this doesn't matter to some people as they don't care (see 1)) 5) For the sake of the people that do care we should all make an effort when playing live[/b][/quote] 6. Most people will look at a band photo and decide whether to listen to or book them based solely on that image. Think SuBo!

[quote name='OldGit' post='542088' date='Jul 16 2009, 11:29 AM']Ah sorry I really meant that the concept is easier to agree on rather than the details.[/quote] I still find it strange that anyone would think of performing without at least discussing what they are going to be wearing. This is what happens if you get your image wrong. Possibly.... [url="http://www.rockandrollconfidential.com/hall/index.php"]http://www.rockandrollconfidential.com/hall/index.php[/url]

[quote name='OldGit' post='541808' date='Jul 15 2009, 11:34 PM']It's vastly different, and a lot easier, in a functions band though.[/quote] The principle is the same as this thread demonstrates. I've played with two other bands this year and witnessed the exact same discussions. A pub band and a thrash metal band. The difference in a function band is that you need to look conventionally "smart", but even this leads to arguments as to what is smart. Are polo shirts smart formal wear and acceptable at a wedding? The common factor is that you dress to give a cohesive feel to the band. You wouldn't have the drumer playing a waltz with the bass player playing straght 4 so why dress at odds. The thing that everyone seems to get wrong is not meeting with the clothes long before a gig to agree the look. Too many gigs I've turned up having had long discussions on what to wear. Usually a the practice 2 days before the gig. Only to find on the night that one person's version is different to anothers. Often two members have a strong conflicting ideas of what the look should be. Don't get involved, as long as one person has a strong idea (usually the leader) the look will work. Be careful of being too general in instructions. Beige suits seems pretty straightforward, but as we've seen even that can be misinterpreted. I played in a band where the instruction was to wear a single bright colour shirt. I turned up in a red shirt, the other three coincidentally all turned up in blue. So even that needs a certain amount of co-ordination. In the metal band, for one gig I was told to wear a black t-shirt with the name of a band on it. I just asked the drummer to get me a t-shirt that was similar to his. Another we were to wear Marvel comic t-shirts, again I deferred to the drummer. If you fit in with the rest you will feel comfortable, especially if you've all met beforehand and everyone has said how good you look, or told you what doesn't work. In the video the drummer is too different. A skinny fit v-neck t-shirt would still show his muscles and blend with the suit and dress look. Just because he is half hidden behind the kit doesn't mean faded jeans work.

We've had this discussion endlessly. In the end I persuaded everyone just to buy a smart striped shirt from Next as per their own taste and wear black trousers and shoes. It works at weddings, pubs and hotels. We've worn evening dress on special occasions when asked. We used to wear all the same colour shirt, but things started to get uneasy when people started 'losing' their shirts, and bringing a blue one that they thought was close. We had 5 different shades of blue all in different styles and the drummer insisted on wearing a short sleeve one. All or nothing, no halfway measures, otherwise it looks like you've not made the proper effort as the "Cream suits" shows. We also have screen printed t-shirts with logo. We have them in red and also in black, some in long sleeves, some short sleeves. We wear them to arrive and set up in and occasionally for charity freebies as advertisement. I've also been involved in heated discussions where one member wants to wear them for paid function gigs. Hmmm - no don't get me started.

I watched your youtube clips. My 2p. You look good in the suits look for Guitar and Bass as per you Troubador vid. BUT Matching suits and shirts and Drummer should get trousers that match your suits and a short sleeved shirt to match. Might be easier if you all wear the same short sleeve shirts, no-one will tell as it'll be under your jacket anyway. Although plain white v-neck t-shirts might work better. Forget ties. Shoes as already mentioned. I'm not sure what the singer is wearing on her feet, or whether its a bag on front of the stage but I think whatever it is is a distraction.

Unless you are running through a PA with a dedicated sound engineer, it is very difficult to manage your effects well. Each effect subtly changes your place in the mix and can have a big effect on the other musicians' sound as well. An effect well selected in home or practice studio will need careful use of EQ to make it sit well in the mix and depend heavily on the room acoustics.

Assuming all you want is a headphone amp with guitar input and line in to mix your bass and ipod together: [url="http://www.musicstreet.co.uk/ctech-pocket-rockit-bass-guitar-headphone-amplifier-p-2361.html?osCsid=llt5c4ruh0ca6t0p1jogou8fa1"]http://www.musicstreet.co.uk/ctech-pocket-...a6t0p1jogou8fa1[/url]

We don't go out for less than £50 each, which is generally what a pub will pay. But we also do gigs where we get £300 each. We price to the event. Once you know the type of event, the venue and the number of guests you get a good idea of what to charge. If you want the gig then you have to price competitively. If someone is willing to pay £3k+ for a band, they will have a huge hotel with separate rooms for meal and dancing, several hundred guests etc. If someone can "only" afford a function room and 200 guests then its likely that they will only have £1000 or less to spend. If its a 30th birthday in a social club then its going to be less than £500. You just have to be a bit streetwise. You don't start at the top. By the time you're charging £1k+ you will have already built up a client base and have loads of people recommending you. Unless you join a £3k band or have a lot of contacts, it takes some time to get to that stage. You're not competing with a disco either. People either want a band or they don't. Usually people who want a band will book a disco as well (unless you can supply a DJ as well )

Also I [b]SUSPECT[/b] that as the 300W is specified into 4ohms that the combo probably uses an 8ohm speaker. So you may only using 2/3 of the power or less. Whereas the 100w is specified into 8ohms and the Hartke uses an 8ohm speaker. There is very little on the web or in the manuals though. The different speakers will also have different sensitivity. Never go by Wattage alone, look for SPL figures in dB.

According to this they should all be 250K [url="http://www.fender.com/support/diagrams/pdf_temp1/basses/0131800A/SD0131800APg3.pdf"]http://www.fender.com/support/diagrams/pdf...0131800APg3.pdf[/url] Did you definitely order the 60's jazz bass parts? You may have A and B written on the pots. eg A250K and B250K?

The top pot and the middle pot are volume from the bridge and neck pick-ups respectively. I am guessing that they should be the same value. I've never had a Jazz but it would make sense. The third pot closest to the jack with the cap is the tone control. Watch out when soldering. If you leave the iron on the pot for too long when soldering to the body you will fry the pot. This is incredibly easy to do!

[quote name='Eight' post='512454' date='Jun 12 2009, 09:30 PM']It might sound daft - but turning thirty has been a big deal for me. Not coped that well with it really. Somehow everything seems a bit more urgent now... a feeling not helped by another member of family dropping dead earlier this year I guess.[/quote] Hey, don't worry. Time is a great healer and these BIG 0 numbers are always a time to question where you're going in your life. I just hit 40 last month and joined another band where I'm the youngest. Day job, two kids and two bands and regular cardio-vascular to keep the middle age spread at bay and be fit to run around a stage!

Just to clarify the Make up gain of the compressor. The effect of the make up gain is to 'expand' the signal. Note in the picture posted above how the bottom part of the signal below the threshold appears stretched vertically. This has the effect of lengthening the sustain of the note. The gain is not 'added' to the signal it 'multiples' it. E.g. with a gain of 4 the lowest signal of 1dB would become 4dB and the loudest signal of 10db would become 40dB. While compressors are often used to stop the loud bits being too loud, when used correctly they also allow greater control of the dynamics to the sound occurring below the threshold. Essentially be careful how much compression ratio you apply and then how much make up gain you apply. A higher threshold, less compression and less make up gain gives better sustain and dynamics.

[quote name='greyparrot' post='498291' date='May 26 2009, 08:53 PM']Yes, thats how i understand it, but im sure a compressor should not have any impact of the tone?? it mearly is designed to keep the sound even by cutting or compressing the loudest DB's and that in fact can lower the volume ot the overall sound, then you have a make up gain volume to bring the sound up to its correct volume. The down side in this is that by doing that it can also increase background noise levels, as you are capping the loudest parts, and bringing the volume up to even the tone. Why a compressor should have an eq knob, and then suck out some of the tone of the signal seems a little strange? or have i got it all wrong? dp studio compressors that i know work compleatly different to bass compressors? GP.[/quote] A compressor is not the same as a limiter, but many people think it does the same thing. From the Ashdown blurb... "This approach towards Compression is necessary for bass because a Fast Attack is required to catch the initial transient and high frequency content of the bass note whereas a Slow Attack is required for the low frequency or fundamental waveform of the note to ensure the waveform is not distorted. If a Full Range compressor is used for bass then a Fast attack will distort the low frequency waveforms whereas a slow attack would fail to catch the initial transient. This is also true of the Decay/Release portion of the compression, a fairly fast decay is ideal for the high frequencies whereas a slow decay is best for the low frequency content." Compression will affect the tone if you use radical settings. Using ratios up to 1:2 is going to be fine, but its also being sold as an effect, so settings up to 1:10 cater for those who want to shape their tone radically. I guess the EQ is there to redress any tone shaping that the two different compressors do. Compression is always a bit of a misnomer, really it should be thought of as an expander, it increases the dynamic range within the quiet to loud passages and is only supposed to 'limit' the very loud peaks. If you have noise present in your system before the compressor you need to ask why. Its a direct process, not a loop effect and should be one of the first processors the signal runs through. There's a sticki wiki [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=337"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=337[/url] I am fairly new to the forum so don't want to cloud what has been written there, which is correct, but looks at it from the veiwpoint only of it squashing the loud bits. It also touches on the fact that some high end single band compressors add the unaltered high frequencies back in.

[quote name='Boneless' post='497948' date='May 26 2009, 12:59 PM']I have this comp. It actually was my backup, I had one brand new that I even trying selling but no one was interested And... it's mediocre. It affects the tone quite a lot, adds hiss, doesn't seem to compress that much, and I'm not won over by the comp's logic: the two bands actually "boost" bass and treble respectively. as well (if I actually understood how it works), so, at my current setting, with bass and treble both at 1 o'clock, there is a bit of a mid scoop.[/quote] I tried one and was quite impressed considering the price. There have been posts in the past about it not coping with the higher output active basses. That was supposed to have been fixed. Turning down the input level might help. The five controls are not as straightforward as first seems. The low comp affects the ratio of the low frequency compression. The hi comp affects the ratio of the high frequency compression. The EQ balance affects the mix of the two bands after the compression. So fully anti clockwise its all bass and fully clockwise its all treble, but that obviously will depend on how much compression you've used on the lo and hi. The hi and lo frequencies, release and threshhold are all pre set. The input and output levels are for matching the input and output - quite straightforward.

[quote name='Hot Tub' post='497408' date='May 25 2009, 05:37 PM']PMSL!!! "We grow all our watts locally." [/quote] What?

I'd strongly agree with interval training. Learn the first 5 frets on E,A and D as a minimum. Then learn the first 5 on the G string. Then learn up to 7 on all 4. It doesn't take long if you break it into chunks. Learn the rest up to 12 in small chunks, but once you have the first 7 the others will be more obvious. It is not necessary to know what you are playing backwards as you play it. ie As long as you play the interval you don't need to know what the note name is on the fly. You will at some stage need to tell someone what note you are playing and also be able to pick it out, as you say, when the sheet music/chord chart/other musician asks for it. When reading music I wonder how many people read the interval and how many decipher the notes to their names. If I'm playing in C and see part of a C scale, I'll recognise it and play the scale rather than think "Oh Yes, CDEFG... now where are those notes on my bass." I know where all the Cs are and the rest are just intervals up.

[quote name='Kongo' post='496969' date='May 25 2009, 12:16 AM']Trace Elliot still kicks ass...and your back if you lift it too much! [/quote] I found that, over time, the groovillium in my Trace had reacted with the anti gravity paste and reduced its effectiveness. Not only did the amp weigh more than when I bought it, it became much harder to bring on the funk.

Well you've learned your lesson. Don't get a musician into the band unless they are as good or better than the rest of you. Don't split and reform that's childish and doesn't work in the long run as it makes you all look stupid. One person needs to sit down and tell him what the issues are. Don't do it by email,text or phone. Ask him whether he thinks the issues are solvable, does he want to solve them? Practice, Lessons, AA etc. Put it on the line. He either fixes A,B and C or you will have to find another drummer because he is holding you all back. Don't do it as a group, it'll all get nasty and look intimidating. A word of warning though, is a bad keen drummer who can make practices and gigs better than an excellent drummer who misses practices and can't make gigs? Find someone else first!!! (basically what bassbloke said )