TimR

[quote name='molan' post='922765' date='Aug 12 2010, 02:11 PM']Wow - so this one bought a few major issues out of the woodwork then! Looks like the band have now split based on the responses to an NYE gig Views were so polarised that it made one key member decide that he'd had enough, this prompted others to raise a few things as well so it looks like not only are we not doing the NYE gig but we aren't going to be doing any more gigs together now. . .[/quote] Ouch! That's a bit rough. My conversation went a bit like: OK we're in a function band but no one wants to do summer because that's summer holiday time so that's weddings and summer balls out then and no one wants to play Christmas and NYE either. When exactly do you expect to do these functions then.

[quote name='molan' post='922268' date='Aug 12 2010, 07:49 AM']I must admit that the band views on this have been really split. Couple of us think it would be fun to be out playing on a NYE instead of sitting at home watching Jools. One person said he'd much rather be doing exactly the reverse! Two people saying £175 minimum. The gig is tops of 40 mins drive for anyone so not a big hassle in that regard. I have a distinct feeling that some ban members have aspirations above the band's capabilities and that this is going to be an ongoing battle. . .[/quote] That's exactly what happened to us. The next year I bought up the subject in June and we had a discussion about exactly what people wanted and expected. I said I wasn't happy that certain people didn't want to be playing on potentially the best night of the year. I'm in a band to play and turning any gig down is ridiculous. OK, I want to get paid a realistic amount but some gigs pay well some don't and you take the rough with the smooth. We came up with a figure. Bearing in mind that the keys player said he would play for free and the sax wanted lots. You can't please everyone, but I said we could gig without sax if she didn't want to play - besides its more money for the rest of us . So when the agent asked us that year I was in a better position to negotiate a price with the agent. Some still moaned even though I'd got them what they had asked for. We did the gig and everybody said they would definiately do it again if asked. This is CASH as well I don't even get £175 for working a 10 hour Satuday O/T in my day job after I have paid TAX.

I don't think that the number of people in the band is relevant. Unless the restaurant specifically want your band they would probably be happy with a three piece. Are you pros? What would you normally get for playing there on a Sat night? A lot of people think that NYE is a golden ticket to charge lots. A lot of clubs/pubs make practically no money in Jan/Feb and need the Christmas/NYE events to make enough to cover this. I'll echo the comment above. It's mid August now, only 4 months to NYE how many enquiries have you had or are you likely to get? I had the same argument with my band over £160 each plus free meal (on a normal Fri/Sat we would have got £80 each and a staff discount), they turned it down and I spent NYE that year watching F.....g Jules Holland on TV.

It's August now. Just keep a record of everything you spend and receive. Keep receipts and write it all in a book. By the time January comes you will have a fair idea of what sums are going to be involved. When you know then ask an Accountant. The IR can't ask you for anything until the TAX year is complete anyway. Can they? I just kept a list of all the gigs I had done and how much I got paid for each one. If you also keep a list of all the rehearsal dates and how much the rooms cost. Put reciepts for gear in an envelope. You can easily do a googlemaps for mileage at a later date if it comes to that. You'll probably then find out how much your hobby is actually costing you.

What's the line up? Blondie had Guitarist + Keyboards, ACDC two guitarists. Live and Let Die - Wings had a full orchestra.

IME they mean that the verses, choruses and mid sections are in the same order as the original. Keyboard and guitar patches are the same and solos are note for note. Put the songs on your iPod in a playlist and listen to them everywhere you go until you know them inside out. Then pick up your bass and learn the bass lines. I was once in the situation where I had learned a bunch of tunes as requested note for note. We came to play one of them and half way through the first verse the guitarist stopped us and said I wasn't playing it right.. Me: "Well that's how it is on the original" Guit: "No, it goes like this" <plays notes very fast> Me: "OK then - play that again, slower" Guit: <plays notes again very fast> Me: "Hold on - I'll get my iPod out." <play tune on iPod> Guit: "Oh OK, but that's not how we play it." Me: " " We ended up doing it as per the original and it wasn't the only tune that I "changed" that night.

[quote name='flyfisher' post='917242' date='Aug 6 2010, 06:01 PM']I'm not convinced. The venue owner is putting on a show for the public. The public are paying him, not the band. The band's contract is with the venue owner, not the public. Does the venue owner require temporary bar staff to have PLI? Having said that, I agree that things could get messy, but I suspect that's because the insurance industry likes it that way so they can sell olverlapping policies to everyone instead of a simple, comprehensive policy for the venue itself.[/quote] Temporary bar staff are being employed by the venue - that is clear cut. Who are you, the Bass player, being employed by? Is the venue paying you or "The Band". What is "The Band". Do you have a leader? Is he paying you. It all gets very messy and when there is a problem and you are going to get sued - people will point fingers and get very slippery. [quote name='flyfisher' post='917242' date='Aug 6 2010, 06:01 PM']I understand your point, but surely ownership of an item doesn't make you liable if someone else 'steals' it and harms someone with it? Are you liable if someone steals your car and kills someone with it? if so, then the world really is going mad.[/quote] Did you take all precautions necessary to prevent this happening or did the venue take all precautions necessary? Do you want to be paying a lawyer to determine this or would you rather your insurance dealt with it. Our company car insurance only covers people employed by the company to drive our cars or people who have been named to drive them. This reduces the risk to the insurance company and keeps the costs down. No doubt the venue could get insurance that covers every band but the insurance would be expensive. Some big venues do - others say you must provide it. When was the last time a pub asked to see your insurance certificate? [quote name='flyfisher' post='917242' date='Aug 6 2010, 06:01 PM']Yep, that's a fair, though different, point. If the band has contracted with the bride and groom then non-appearance would be a breach of that contract. It's not a PLI issue though.[/quote] Agreed. That was just a general insurance point.

The venue insurance covers the venue owner from damage that the venue owner does and hopefully any of the venues employees. As you are not technically directly employed by the venue owner you will not be included on his insurance. I suppose they could but that would make their insurance pretty expensive and difficult to manage. Hence the post I made earlier about making sure that THE WHOLE BAND is covered, not just the person taking out the insurance. The punter will sue the venue who will be protected by their insurance who will then come after you. What happens if someone climbs onto the stage and throws your mike into the audience and hurts someone? Do you want to be arguing over whose fault it is or just pass the problem to your insurance company's lawyer? If your van breaks down on the way to a £20,000 wedding do you want to be arguing with the Bride and Grooms insurer? For the sake of £100 you save yourself a lot of hassle and money.

[quote name='TimR' post='916778' date='Aug 6 2010, 10:25 AM']I was insured with music guard. BUT again the insurance is only for the person with the cover NOT the band so each member needs their own insurance. If you just want liability insurance they do "liabilityguard" only £19 a year. [url="https://www.jltonline.co.uk/secure/faq.asp?product=LiabilityMusic&promCode=&question=3"]https://www.jltonline.co.uk/secure/faq.asp?...&question=3[/url][/quote] Did some more digging as I need to renew and ideally insure my band as well. I would speak to them as they will extend the insurance to "Associates" ie other members of the band, roadies etc. Obviously at cost

I was insured with music guard. BUT again the insurance is only for the person with the cover NOT the band so each member needs their own insurance. If you just want liabilty insurance they do "liabilityguard" only £19 a year. [url="https://www.jltonline.co.uk/secure/faq.asp?product=LiabilityMusic&promCode=&question=3"]https://www.jltonline.co.uk/secure/faq.asp?...&question=3[/url]

Watch that the insurance covers all of the band and not just the person named in the insurance.

[quote name='flyfisher' post='915962' date='Aug 5 2010, 01:50 PM']Yep, you've got it - we're a band of mates playing for fun and managing about one gig per month, mainly at private parties and other events rather than the regular 'pub circuit' (although we have played pubs). Plus, I'm the 'outsider' really in terms of how long we've all known each other, so it's not really my place to sack anyone. I know of farmfactory but we usually use rehearsal facilities in Hertford.[/quote] Is that Chris Foster's place Graphic Nature? He's usually pretty open and relaxed have a word with him.

[quote name='bigjohn' post='915828' date='Aug 5 2010, 12:25 PM']... Have you thought of asking him to come and jam, just you and him? That would provide a decent time and place to work on him without making him feel bad.[/quote] As I suggested earlier and I've just realised flyfisher is in Hertfordshire. A big county I know but are you anywhere near Welwyn? Here's the rehearsal studio I mentioned earlier that does a 'single' musician rate. [url="http://www.farmfactorystudios.com/"]http://www.farmfactorystudios.com/[/url]

[quote name='Lord Sausage' post='915153' date='Aug 4 2010, 05:07 PM']This is quite a sweeping statement! Do you have foreign evidence to back up and compare this with (perhaps its all the world). How do you know this is a problem with all genres all over the country. In the majority of bands i've been in we've always pushed to improve each other or just sack bad uns.[/quote] That depends on if you are in a pro-band or a band of mates doing it for fun. Sacking a mate is a difficult thing to do. There have been several threads here asking how to do it. Do we - Disband and form again - sent a text - etc... This sort of thead doesn't seem to come up in the more 'american' Bassplayer forum. It's definitely an English thing. In general we're more reserved and afraid of upsetting people's feelings. (Unless you're from Yorkshire that is )

Good skills!

[quote name='silddx' post='913825' date='Aug 3 2010, 01:21 PM']I think I now know where Alex Claber got his inspiration from for his column in the latest BGM [/quote] Cant you paraphrase it for those who haven't seen it?

I have the 5.1 but I run it with one 211Pro which is a louder cabinet than the 410! I suspect it is either a gain structure, EQ, or Speaker issue. I've cut and pasted this from the warwick forum: [quote]I've giged a room of 300+ people with no PA support with my Pro FET 3.2 and 2 x 211 Pro cabs no problem The gain and master volume structure "problem" is well documented here. They aren't an underpowered head - but the way the gain structure and the master volume curve works leads many people to believe that they are. This is why they redesigned the gain and volume curves on the new Pro FET 3.3 and 5.2 heads. They seem much louder, but they're not really - just that the volume comes in earlier. So - there are two things with your 3.2 that can help you get the most out of it: Firstly - the gain. Don't worry too much about the clip LED. It does come on prematurely. What you need to do is play with it a bit, and find where you actually can hear some audible clipping rather than relying on the clip light. It's normal with these heads to see the clip light quite active when the gain is set properly. That is - adjust the gain past the point where the light comes on, but if you hear some audible clipping (very easy to hear when it does happen) pull it back a little. You can go quite a long way past the clip LED before actual clipping occurs. Secondly - the master volume dial uses a linear taper pot, rather than the new reverse logarithmic pot used in the 3.3 and 5.2 heads (and also what most other manufacturers do). What this means is that at halfway on the dial with your Pro FET 3.2, you are actually seeing half of the amp's power. With the new 3.3 and 5.2 heads, at halfway on the master volume dial, you are seeing more like 85% of the amps power. What this all means is that you can safely push the master volume dial on your Pro FET 3.2 further to get the full usage out of your head, and you'll notice a volume increase much further around the dial than the newer 3.3 head. So - don't be afraid to push the gain (listen for clipping rather than relying on the clip LED), and remember that you can use a much wider sweep on the master volume dial to get the equivalent of "halfway" (which really means 85-90%) on the 3.3, 5.2 and most other manufacturers amps. Play with these settings and I'm sure that you will find that the 3.2 isn't underpowered, and actually can be a very loud head.[/quote]

[quote name='gicut58' post='912699' date='Aug 2 2010, 12:42 PM'][quote name='TimR' post='911117' date='Jul 31 2010, 12:06 PM'] Jim Rodford of the Kinks stood in and played a couple of numbers with my band once. I think I will be sharing the stage with him at the end of August. He's in the headline band, we're third from top.[/quote] - John Verity's band? He and Jeff Dakin helped me out with two or thre songs a couple of weeks ago at my local, the Anchor - and incredibly nice chaps they are too. Other than that I was in the crowd when Shakin' Stevens and The Sunsets played the Heavy Steam Machine in Hanley, Stoke, so many moons ago..... Fantastic gig [/quote] It might help if I got the right one - John Dalton. Its a standing joke that everyone around here has played Bass with the Kinks. John Dalton has retired now so I've no idea who "The Bass Player" for the kinks will be. I'll find out at practice tomorrow. I can't wait the excitement is killing me. If that's not tenuous I don't know what is.

A quick google unearthed this. Quite Interesting. [url="http://home.provide.net/~cfh/pickups.html"]http://home.provide.net/~cfh/pickups.html[/url]

[quote name='Doddy' post='912225' date='Aug 1 2010, 08:28 PM']... I don't think that stamina should be an issue. I know lots of drummers who have been playing for 30-40 years and can still play for hours with no problems. If they've got their act together they'll be fine. ...[/quote] I'm playing with a 60 year old drummer at the moment no problems. What I meant by the stamina is that he's not played for 20 years.

[quote name='Marvin' post='911838' date='Aug 1 2010, 01:00 PM'](There's also the fact that too much symbol bashing f@cks about with my ear 'oles).[/quote] The cymbals are quite bad for that too.

If he hasn't played for 20 years has he still got the legs to play the bass drum? If he's not practicing at home it will take a long time to get them back. Even a straight 1 and 3 should be good enough for rock though. I played with a drummer for years who only listened to rock and could only play rock. Its very hard work when you are having to play extra to cover when trying to get music to funk and groove and the drummer doesn't get it. In the end I burned out and lost my temper with the whole situation. Let myself and others down. I should have quit a long time before it got to that. He needs a practice kit or to spend time on his own in a studio. Our local rehearsal rooms will do evenings for £5 for solo players if you ring that night. Maybe check you local rehearsal rooms and suggest you both go down and jam 1 night a week?

I have personally met Mark on a number of occasions in an unrelated field. I didn't know he was a member of this forum. Next time I see him I'll talk to him about it. If anyone wants to PM me I can probably answer a few questions.

[quote name='gary mac' post='910931' date='Jul 31 2010, 08:12 AM']1973 or 74 at Waltham Abbey town hall, a sort of battle of the bands thing. Sporting a Roger Glover stylee hat and crushed velvet loon pants. First number was Deep Purples Space Truckin'. Epiphone semi acoustic bass. Selmer Goliath 4 x 10" cab. 50 Top amp[/quote] [quote name='essexbasscat' post='910982' date='Jul 31 2010, 10:01 AM']My first gig was at Loughton, about 5-8 miles from Waltham Abbey and that Selmer stuff was all over the place at the time Relise - enjoy that first gig !! hope it goes well T[/quote] Enfield Town a mates 17th birthday party in his house. Dire Strates - Money for nothing. It was in the charts at the time. A 3/4 scale bass through a borrowed home made amp and cab. I've never played that tune since - until my cousins 40th last year when I jammed it with a couple of guitarists and a drummer. Strange times.

[quote name='Spike Vincent' post='910587' date='Jul 30 2010, 07:48 PM']Kim Wilde nearly ran me over once.[/quote] She lives close to me. Both my Dad and the guitarist in his band used to often play with her dad Marti Wilde. Jim Rodford of the Kinks stood in and played a couple of numbers with my band once. I think I will be sharing the stage with him at the end of August. He's in the headline band, we're third from top. Elvis Costello's keyboard player Steve Nieve bought a Elka keyboard from my dad. He sent someone to our house who paid in used £5 notes. They had suffered catastrophic organ failure at the gig the night before. The brother of a guy who I work with is married to Shena Easton's sister. I have been on Blue Peter. That's not tenuous I'm afraid. It actually means I am famous so don't know if this counts.