risingson

Pros: Good money Flexible hours (you're working for yourself) Good fun Get to see the world if you're clever enough about booking gigs Good experience playing live music Working through agencies can be a good thing for regular work (not all the time though) Cons: You might end up feeling like you're wasting your time playing over people's music. In fact I guarantee you'll have nights like it. If the crowd or venue is inhospitable or indifferent to your music you're likely to suffer a bad night Can be sporadic dates, especially in Jan/Feb when not a lot happens Waiting around (although whether you're a pro musician or not this will never change) You need to be able to keep your cool in every situation People will try and mess you round with money. In my opinion, a suitable stop gap to make sure you've got money coming in but not a full time vocation. The best piece of advice for you: sort out a contract that outlines pay, stage, space and P.A. requirements/soundmen for larger venues, catering (within reason, i.e. whether or not you'll require food, soft drinks), whether or not you're happy to play at venues with sound limiters, expenses for petrol and travel costs, accommodation, damage liability, etc.

www.stringbusters.co.uk should do them.

Lovely!

[quote name='JayPH' post='1235994' date='May 18 2011, 05:15 PM']When i was looking at Fender Basses in Dawsons recently I asked one of the lads what was the difference between the MIM and MIA basses and he said "A few Miles". He said that the American ones tended to be setup better from the start but you can setup a MIM to play just as well.[/quote] I wouldn't pay a single bit of attention to the guys in Liverpool Dawsons, they don't know what they're talking about! I popped in a few days back and tried a number of Fenders they had in. Played a Marcus Miller Jazz in there, the intonation was so bad by the time you got to the 12th fret of the bass it was almost a whole semitone sharp, and the Jaco Squier in there had a neck bow so bad it was very difficult to play. When I pointed this out by demonstrating this to him, the assistant told me that 'you have to put a bit of work in yourself to get the bass you buy set up properly'. He also went on to explain that there was 'no way of swapping out the preamp in the Marcus Miller', and when I pointed out that there were indeed companies like J-Retro that sold the MM plate mounted preamps that you can just drop in as replacements, he seemed totally baffled by it. I don't expect the setups on basses in stores like that to be perfect, but I would at least expect a store assistant to be aware that if you're going to be paying upwards of £900-1000 on an instrument then it should be in their interest to pay a bit more attention to how that bass guitar plays. Instead he tried to fob me off with a barrage of misinformation. Not good at all.

[quote name='skej21' post='1234743' date='May 17 2011, 07:23 PM']What's a Fender? [/quote] Something people regularly complain about despite being a blueprint to everything we enjoy about our instrument

[quote name='chipmunk_jr' post='1234504' date='May 17 2011, 04:20 PM']Every band you seem to see live, there bass players seem to play fenders. I've played a couple and I cant see what all the fuss is about???? Ive played much nicer basses for a lot less money.[/quote] Go and play something else then. Your opinion is exactly that... your opinion. No doubt if you gave me a list of [u]your[/u] favourite bass manufacturers then there is a good chance I would say the same thing, but then that would be [u]my[/u] opinion. It's not worth the discussion really.

The problem with sound limiters is that they're rarely calibrated properly and therefore get set off way below the required level, or sometimes not at all. Bass guitar sets the overly sensitive ones off very quickly so be weary. We've now stipulated in our contract that if you must have a venue that has a limiter then it's not our concern should be set them off... and we're not an overly loud band either by any means.

[quote name='burno70' post='1234433' date='May 17 2011, 03:27 PM']Cheers for the detailed resopnse! We've worked with Glasswerk before but will definately look up the others you mention. Thanks![/quote] No problem. Glasswerk can be a bit funny and it's worth reading their T & C before committing to anything with them. If they work for you then cool, but there are certain restrictions you might not want to flout with them.

[quote name='burno70' post='1234362' date='May 17 2011, 02:44 PM']That could be were we are going wrong - what would you recommend?[/quote] I would recommend getting friendly with promoters in town who are interested in putting music on for the joy of doing so. There has to be a degree of legwork on your band's behalf as well to ensure people are coming down to your gig because it will highlight that you're worth putting on a bit more regularly and also you'll be making them money on the door. If you have a look at promo companies like Kong, Me & Him, Glasswerk, Wax & String and find out their contact details, get in touch with them and have your music ready on Bandcamp, Myspace etc. Once a promoter finds that you're drawing a good crowd, putting on a good show and being reliable and not messing around by turning up late and not bringing required gear then with a little bit of luck you'll start to stand out. Also, look outside of Liverpool. The gigging community in the city is quite insular and I've seen loads of bands get stuck playing the same old gig month in month out. If you're willing to travel then you should be looking to try and get over to Manchester, Leeds, Sheffield as well and doing the same thing there. The pay to play schemes are rubbish, and it's always worth remembering that there are people out there who put on gigs for the love of it and not as a two-bit way of squeezing money out of you. Ultimately the money has to be made somewhere though so most of the time it's up to you to be promoting hard to your fanbase to make sure you get a good turnout.

[quote name='burno70' post='1234330' date='May 17 2011, 02:24 PM']Sorry for derailing the thread - where is good to play in Liverpool at the moment? My band is struggling to get gigs. Pay to play is really killing us. We are an originals band but not particularly well supported - unfortunately. Any suggestions (Sorry Ead - I hope you don't mind!)[/quote] The Kazamier, The Shipping Forecast, The Masque, Static Gallery, The Academy, Mello Mello, Magnet, Heebies do band nights sometimes as well. The pay to play thing is easily avoided if you know who to speak to promotions wise.

[quote name='silddx' post='1233447' date='May 16 2011, 07:03 PM']I listened to the interview again. He's really criticising the monetary system surrounding education for sending him students who are full of sh*t. One wonders why he doesn't boot those students out if he detests that system so much. Maybe he's resentful he has to be a part of it.[/quote] He's resentful he has to do it in the first place IMO. I think he is an incredible musician, astounding in fact but he's clearly very bitter.

[quote name='Mr Fudge' post='1233641' date='May 16 2011, 09:13 PM']What's your favourite humming noise? [attachment=80138:frpurcell.jpg][/quote] Hahaha

We're playing there tomorrow night and played there about 2 months back. The back line in the back room is actually quite good, Blackstar stuff and a good Orange bass rig. It depends what the night is but it's usually a good laugh. It's not exactly the number one spot for live music in Liverpool but it's a good place to play if you're in the back.

[quote name='Bilbo' post='1233204' date='May 16 2011, 04:03 PM']I am interested in some of the responses to this as I am alway interested to hear what people are actually playing and in what ways they seek to improve themselves as players. I have always found that there are a lot of players who fill themselves up with clever party tricks that others, players and non-players alike, heap praise upon them for. Like that phase in the 90s where everyone was into Flea and learned all the BSSM tunes in an effort to sound like him. The motivation for doing that was not primarily musical, it was social. 'I want the kudos that Flea has'. 'If I can play Flea parts and he is winnign all of the polls, I must be as good as him and am equally deserving of praise'. We all like a bit of affirmation, me more than most, but I think, for many, it can get in the way of the real learning. I think BM is basically saying, in a way that is completely at odds with his brother's pseudo-intellectual presentation, is that he finds a lot of kids more interested in seeing themselves as the next 'young lion' or prodigy than they are in being the best player that concerted study and hard graft can make them. At each stage in our learning, we are only able to see a portion of what we are and what we have the potential to become. If we are sufficiently deluded, we can easily fall into the trap of believing we are better than we think we are and it takes a teacher to break that delusion, carefully but firmly. BM was being interviewed not giving a lesson or masterclass. A bit of tough love, I accept, but I think he has a point.[/quote] Branford Marsalis exists in a genre of music that has less and less happening for it in the broadest of senses. Fewer and fewer players are groundbreaking, because there's almost no ground left to break. Maybe he's venting his frustrations over the loss of a time when jazz was the musical renaissance and these sorts of players were coming out of the woodwork. There are plenty of good jazz sax players out there but their talents are derived from people who spearheaded a type of music not heard before, i.e. Parker, Coltrane etc so they are not truly 'remarkable' or 'unique' players, they're simply taking their cues from those who innovated.

[quote name='BottomE' post='1233102' date='May 16 2011, 02:42 PM']Lots of variables in this and assumptions. Is Branford Marsalis a decent teacher? Who knows. Has he had a batch of sh** students? Dunno. Because of his elevated status and undoubted ability has he become a snobby twat too distant from the abilities and foibles of mere mortals? Maybe he was having a bad day. We live in a world where the destination has become more important than the journey. That much is true.[/quote] +1, like I mentioned just because you're a good player doesn't make you a good teacher, in fact sometimes the opposite.

Part of being a student is the ability to take on board constructive criticism and learning from it. If you're there to have your ego massaged by your teacher then you're getting lessons for the wrong reasons, worse still is if your teacher is entertaining this as a viable means of passing time in a lesson. It's the inherent problem with a lot of musicians; it is so easy to develop an ego once people start telling you you're a good player, and from then on music becomes this self-serving means of satisfying your ego as opposed to something that is truly remarkable. Branford Marsalis is not helping himself here though. I've seen this video before and I would wager that at one time or another he will have been the same kind of student that he describes, he also sounds quite bitter. Everyone needs a degree of support to boost their confidence from a peer, and whilst I agree that such commendations shouldn't be given out at the drop of a hat, it is important to inspire confidence in a student if you're a teacher. Marsalis clearly lacks a degree of patience. Even the best players don't make for the best teachers.

You tried Allparts?

Mine was really great, lovely crowd, nice marquee... the only slight hiccup of the night was the power going down first set, turned out a switch got knocked. At the end of the night once we'd finished, the organiser attempted to have a whip round with the guests to keep us playing (another girl suggested to me that we were stupid to pass this suggestion up as everyone at the party was in her own words 'inordinately rich').