Hector

[quote name='Bassjon' timestamp='1418559876' post='2631124'] Wow, thanks everybody! The John Goldsby book is fantastic - if a little advanced. Hector, I find those Mooney books put different chord substitutions in each chorus - sometimes the II-V secondary dominants, sometimes the tri-tones etc. I am looking to add the chord tones one at a time to get them in my head. I understand the idea of walking jazz, I just have trouble applying it! [/quote] Those substitutions will come in handy for sure, but maybe put them on the back burner for a while. Sounds like you don't know enough language. Here's a tried and tested method: 1. Identify a chord sequence you have trouble with. 2. Find a tune with that sequence in, and transcribe a walking line you like over that sequence. 3. Learn your transcribed line thoroughly (be able to sing it over the chords, learn to play it all over your instrument) 4. Work out the theory behind that line, and learn it in all 12 keys. 6. Write some variations on your transcribed line and learn those thoroughly too. 7. Repeat for the same chord sequence a minimum of three lines for each situation. 8. Do this for any chord sequence you struggle with. The secret is that there is no secret - it's all there on the records. Walking a good line with a solid time feel and appropriate note choices should be your top priority. Edit - Also just to say, but try to focus in getting blues, rhythm changes and one or two often-played standards together (all the things, stella, autumn leaves etc)

Yeah man, I love that book and his columns for Bass Player magazine. John's such a great player too, check it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9p-GYUAPg0

Welcome to Jazz! Feel free to PM me if you ever have questions. Wondering what you mean by this:[i] "[color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif] to jumping straight to songs made up of the choruses where the chords change every single time![/font][/color]" [/i]? I would recommend getting the absolute best teacher money can buy (even if you have to travel a bit), and listening to a lot of records. Start working on your ear straight away too - try to play along with records, and pick out chord progressions. Learn your intervals by ear, and practise playing melodies by ear. You'll need a book on walking bass for starters. That's the most important part of your role as a bass player in a jazz setting. I learnt with this: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Building-Walking-Bass-Lines-Builders/dp/0793542049 There are a few other books out there on walking bass that people recommend, but I can't personally vouch for them. I would focus principally on working through this book, as the techniques used in it are invaluable, and the chord progressions are of the sort that come up all the time and should be memorised (Blues, Rhythm Changes). Take it slow and really master each bit before you move onwards in the book, it's tempting to move onwards but you've got to internalise it all. If you can only get one book, the walking bass stuff is most essential. Start just with that and practise some walking over standard chord progressions (there are play alongs on youtube). You'll also need a decent book on theory, and this is basically the standard reference text, and is well worth getting (I'm always digging up new stuff in here): http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jazz-Theory-Book-Mark-Levine/dp/1883217040 Other books that really will help are: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Putter-Smith-Improvisation-Muscians-Institute/dp/1423477715 (How to structure your practising, and how to get sounds a particular chord-scale relationships in your head) http://www.amazon.co.uk/Serious-Electric-Bass-Complete-Contemporary/dp/1576238830 (Will give you lots of ideas about shapes of various scales and arpeggios on the fingerboard) http://www.amazon.co.uk/John-Goldsby-Technique-Tradition-Musicians/dp/0879307161 (First half is biographies of great players, gives you an idea who to listen to - which is the most important bit of developing as a jazz player - and the second half is instructional. A "nice" book with a deceptively large amount of information) If you're wanting to start soloing, David Baker's books on Bebop are excellent as a starter to that particular style too.

We're not singing from the same hymn sheet. In a way, I agree with your thinking that you need to take technical advice from people who are properly qualified. But here's my take: Who do you play the bass for? Who's your audience? Past that, who pays your fee? There are certain things expected of you as a bass player, and you gotta deliver them or you'll quickly find yourself playing alone or with schlubs. If you're not going to listen to anyone's opinion unless they've been playing the bass for a long time then you're going to miss a ton of useful advice/feedback from the people who are actually the ones you should be trying to please and the ones who may or may not hire you. There's a reason a lot of bass pedagogues say to record yourself playing as much as you can, because when you're playing you're often not in the best position to judge your own performance. There's absolutely nothing wrong with the observation from a singer (Betty Carter or not) that your time feel isn't even enough and that, based on pervious observations by that singer of other bass players who sound great, it's perhaps to do with two-finger technique rather than one finger. You might have to take some opinions with a pinch of salt of course, and you might have to take that thought to the shed and work out your own spin on it, but you better be thinking it over. To have a singer directly tell you what they're looking for in a bass accompanist, and advise how to get there is absolute gold! That's how jazz used to be done, these kind of apprenticeships, with more experienced players sharing wisdom on the stand, regardless of which instrument they played.

I totally dig what you're saying - a great revelation for me was that I didn't have to pizz so effortfully to get a big sound (especially the E string). I wasn't such a fan of this: [quote name='The Jaywalker' timestamp='1417704243' post='2623247'] Definitely a better plan than accepting a bass lesson from a vocalist! (although to be fair, Betty was a pretty intimidating presence by all accounts) [/quote] Still has ears doesn't she?! Not to mention she had a long career with some great bassmen: Sam Jones, Dennis Irwin, Christian McBride, Dave Holland to name just a few. You might expect her to have picked up a thing or two about playing bass. I don't want to be confrontational about it, but it's not really that fair of you to belittle her opinion in that way. There's no one size fits all solution to RH technique. Lots of players use a variety of techniques, and it depends on what suits the music. Someone like John Patitucci is a prime example: everything from one finger pizz to both fingers perpendicular to the strings like electric bass. It's about getting the notes out, and every player should have a few different styles of pizz available. That said, it is commonly found to be easier to get a consistently good sound and feel with one finger. Perhaps that's why people like Oscar Pettiford, Ray Brown, Mingus and contemporaries used one finger, or perhaps it was a product of the sorts of setups at the time that made alternating two fingers tougher. There's also the fact that getting more meat on the string when you pizz can help to pull a bigger sound with a stronger fundamental.

[quote name='fatback' timestamp='1417645547' post='2622727'] Been watching some right hands lately myself and notice that Ray Brown seems to try and play as many of his notes as possible with his index finger, presumably for fat tone. Mingus is crazy that way; I don't know how he plays one-fingered so fast. But it must be worth the effort. I wonder whether part of the 'end of fingerboard' thing isn't about keeping that finger vertical. [/quote] I read a really interesting interview with the late great Dennis Irwin, where he spoke about being told not to use two fingers when walking by Betty Carter: [size=4][i][font=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]"Playing tempos and plucking the string with the index finger when walking. One night after a gig at Ronnie Scott's (in London) she says. "Listen, babe, it's getting' uneven." She played on her arm with her single digit. She said to look at these old pictures of Ray Brown, Pettiford, Mingus, even their solo stuff. Paul Chambers and LaFaro were the first cats to (solo or play with two fingers). "[/font][/i][/size]

Thanks for the tip Sarah, will check it out! I would also add that I strongly recommend Effortless Mastery by Kenny Werner, which had a big impact on me.

[quote name='bagsieblue' timestamp='1417383107' post='2619894'] Can you elaborate on this please Hector? - I can't grasp the concept (genuine question by the way). [/quote] No problemo. I was talking about practising specifically, but it goes a bit deeper. The idea is to stop caring about how good you are. Because then you're in the best mental state for playing or practising. An example applying to practising is structuring your practise time effectively. It can sometimes feel like there's an overwhelming amount of things to learn, and not enough time. I used to feel a lot of subconscious pressure to be a great musician 'right now',and as a result would rush over what I was practising in order to practise more stuff. I was really harsh on myself, and this made practise sessions a lot more fraught and stressful than they needed to be. But mastery of anything, especially music, is about depth not breadth of knowledge. I switched to practising fewer things, but with more focus. I got a little kinder on myself. I started telling myself almost constantly that it was ok if I wasn't playing that particular exercise to a great standard yet, that I would get it in time with more practise. I even did deep breathing exercises to help me relax. Letting go of my fear of not being a good musician allowed me to practise in this way, and there's no rush to be great immediately - no more problem with sticking at something till I really nailed it or kidding myself that I had learnt something well enough when I hadn't. Worrying less abouy being good and being content to practise in a way which seems slower at first really helped me progress. Really made a difference for me, and I enjoy practising now - each session I feel relaxed and happy, practising with calm intent and patience. It's really rewarding. I hope that helped explain a bit? Not really talked about it much with anyone, so hard to explain properly in writing! Edit - Just to add: you must strive for perfection. Don't think I'm saying it's fine to lackadaisical or sloppy. Acknowledge your weaknesses and mistakes, but work hard to eliminate them. You just gotta be kind to yourself in the process, it takes time!

Hey kyboo, good to hear from you - thanks for the udpate! New version seems to work very well, although it's a BIG step up in terms of difficulty....having a hard time hearing the relationships of the individual intervals to the key rather than to each other. I know what I'll be doing in every 5 minute gap for the next year or so

A lot of cramping is psychological. It's often your mental state that contributes as much to physical discomfort as your physical discomfort does to your mental state. One thing you can do is to take lots of deep slow breathes and try to calm yourself down a bit - try thinking to yourself how easy you're finding it. It sounds weird but you can sometimes think it into being so. Annoyingly, focusing on the fact that you're getting cramped up will make you even more tense! Try to think of the pain signals from your body as a warning light on the dashboard of your car. You think "Oh, I probably ought to see to that" and you will take action to consciously relax, but you're mentally still somewhat detached from it (which prevents your reflexive tensing up). Often good technique comes when your body is most comfortable. It's an odd comparison but you hear reports of people who have lost limbs suddenly being in shock and not feeling the pain. Some report initially looking at the damage as if it was on somebody else's body. Aim for that level of detachment from your discomfort. (Disclaimer: don't saw your hands off). I also find that practising the passage at full speed with a metronome at half speed (i.e. metronome clicking every other beat) seems to make the phrase feel different and more comfortable/relaxed. Try counting it like that when you play it too, feel that half time beat.

Why not change insurer? You pay them for a service, and they service they give doesn't satisfy you. p.s. I use Allianz but can't recommend them as I've never had to claim. I do think they're pretty reasonable though.