Hector

Fairly interesting so far, will be nice to see where it goes. Thought dissing Stan Getz was really funny. Liking the peer review/evaluation stuff, nice to hear different people's takes on the same tune. Dreading getting my peer review feedback though!

Really pleased your hands are doing ok Steve! When I was first buying basses, I played a whole shopsworth before being left with two: one had a beautiful feel, the other had a beautiful sound. Man, I still remember how excited I was when Malcolm Healey told me he could profile the neck to get good feel on the good sound bass. My 18 year old self was stunned and Magda and I have enjoyed a happy musical marriage ever since!

A nice way to provide a sense of motion through a ii-V-I is to use guide tones: [url="http://www.simonpurcell.com/media/GuideTonesforImp.pdf"]http://www.simonpurc...TonesforImp.pdf[/url] (page 3 is wicked, some of those chromatic resolutions are really nice, and provide a good sense of motion through tension and resolution) You could also try using some chord tone enclosures: [url="http://www.simonpurcell.com/media/C.pdf"]http://www.simonpurc...com/media/C.pdf[/url]

Just a heads up for everyone: due to the recent events in Boston, Gary's course is being postponed for a week until 29th April.

Awwwww yeahhhh! Been signed up for this since sometime last year when it was first made available. I don't really have the time, but that's not gonna stop me studying with Gary Burton........

http://www.bapam.org.uk/documents/1_Dont_cramp_your_style_web.pdf I do these before gigs or long practise sessions, seems to help in general. Would interested to see if people have more hand-specific warm-ups?

Was once feeling extravagant and treated myself to the Rolls Royce of clip-on tuners: [url="http://www.petersontuners.com/index.cfm?category=168"]http://www.petersontuners.com/index.cfm?category=168[/url] I wanted a clip on to just pop on the bridge, and didn't want to have anything extra in my signal chain. Works beautifully! Well constructed, good display, tracks quickly and very accurate. It isn't the cheapest option, but being in tune is worth it.

I've really gone and muddied the waters here! Just antagonising to get back at fatback for once trying (nearly succeeded!) to convice me to give in to gut string temptation.... Hah, but seriously really sorry for derailing the thread a bit - do love to get the anorak on and chat about the nitty gritty. Owen, to summarise: 1. Arco technique will help with your pizz, in as much as your left hand will be in good shape (but it won't do much for your RH of course) 2. Practising arco will make it easier to hear if you're in tune. 3. I find a drone in the background whilst practising scales very helpful for good ear training - PM me if you want some. 4. Some have had success using a tuner during practising to fine-tune intonation. If it works for you, go for it. The logic is sound. 5. I like nice little numbered lists.

[quote name='fatback' timestamp='1365688486' post='2042943'] Have to disagree about the tuner. I'm not saying use it as a continuous reference (I wouldn't be looking down there anyhow) just use it as an occasional check. So it's not eye training, it reinforces the judgement of your ears. Like with any training, you've got to have feedback to tell you when you're right or wrong. Yes a drone will do as a reference, if you can stand it, but even that's not too helpful apart from 4ths and 5ths. I totally agree that good technique is everything. Of course. [/quote] I use a tuner to get the open strings in, for sure on gigs where I might not get quiet time to tune to a reference pitch. But beyond that I'm not sold. A continuous reference would be more helpful, as you can fine tune every note in real time. A drone would provide feedback on intonation in this way. It's directly training intonation using just your ears and hands, no need to mix this process up by involving staring at a tuner every now and then. Why would drones not help you with anything other than 4ths or 5ths? Using them you develop your ear and recognise intervals. Playing with good intonation of course has lots to do with muscle memory, but it has just as much to do with your own internal sense of pitch and your ability to have in your head the sound of the note you want. Really playing in tune is more involved than electric bass where you can just chuck your fingers in the right place, on upright you need to really clearly hear the notes you're trying to hit. But anyway, I've said my bit and am perfectly happy for us to agree to disagree.

[quote name='Hector' timestamp='1365026226' post='2034439'] After getting finickity about my action, and on the advice of teachers who know better than I have made a change from Spiro Weichs to D'Addario Helicore Hybrids E-D and a Zyex G (Larry Grenadier much?). They've only been on a few days, so still settling in, but initial impressions are that I'm incredibly pleased - especially the response of the Zyex G. Getting a huge even sound all over the board. Updates soon. [/quote] Two gigs in the last week with old musical acquaintances, two sets of compliments on my acoustic sound. Very pleased. They still need to darken up, but sounding like a whole new bass. Had a rehearsal in a space I usually dread (really dead sound) and typically needed an amp to cut through. With the new set up, seems the amp is no longer needed. p.s. Steve really sorry to hear about your hand woes - really hope things work out for you.

[quote name='fatback' timestamp='1365600353' post='2041620'] Oh dear, I have to disagree, much as I respect Mr. Spangles and Bilbo. Taking on arco too early nearly made me quit. Firstly, there's something fundamentally unwise about learning left and right hands at the same time. No. 1 learning principle is to separate tasks out. A couple of years working with left hand and pizz, and now bowing seems much more straightforward. Secondly, if you want to get gigging fast, arco will slow your progress down and seriously delay your debut. On the intonation front, I perfectly accept that arco will be a great help. But to learn to play pizz in tune is not hard if you use a clip-on tuner on the bridge. Not always, just for checking. Good ear training too. None of the above probably applies if you're twelve years old and don't have a band nagging you to gig the thing. [/quote] I'm going to respectfully disagree in turn, and hope I won't cause offence in doing so. I stress that it's just my opinion and I'm just some bloke. Had a period of my life where I plaedy pizz only, and desperately regretted it after seeing huge benefits in my playing (95% pizz gigs) after a return to the bow. Thus I have some thoughts gleaned from my personal experiences with the dark art of the bass, but they're just that. It's personal to the player in many ways. Playing arco from the start may be a steep learning curve (what isn't about picking up DB to start with?!), but it will be better in the long run. If you're not playing primarily arco gigs, there's no need to be Rabbath-level on the hairystick, but it definitely helps with other aspects of playing. Practising scales with the bow leaves your intonation very exposed - especially when playing over a drone. I'd actually advocate this instead of using a tuner, as that's not proper ear training. It's eye training. I see learning to play in tune as associating muscular control with what you hear. Having a information from a tuner, I believe, hinders the formation of this link. (This is also why I think you should learn tunes without using a real book etc, as it should be about ears and hands only and my best playing undoubtedly comes when my nose is out of the page.) Arco playing also helps with left hand strength, best benefits when playing scales very slowly. So much of tone production really comes from the left hand. I'm also of the opinion that regular playing in arco opens up the sound of a bass (at least it's what I noticed after coming back to arco). Obviously this is very hard to test empirically, can't really extract it from other benefits like my left hand. But it does maybe tie in with the idea that basses as instruments tend to age well and mature in sound over the years - I think somehow arco aids this process and has more of an effect in the short term. That's my 2p take it or leave it!

[quote name='oggiesnr' timestamp='1365027608' post='2034457'] I'm at the stage where I can either work with my hands or play bass. When the weather gets warmer it may get better, if not there's going to be a bass for sale as I have to earn a living. Steve [/quote] Steve steve steve steve steve, let's not be too hasty here. What's up?

After getting finickity about my action, and on the advice of teachers who know better than I have made a change from Spiro Weichs to D'Addario Helicore Hybrids E-D and a Zyex G (Larry Grenadier much?). They've only been on a few days, so still settling in, but initial impressions are that I'm incredibly pleased - especially the response of the Zyex G. Getting a huge even sound all over the board. Updates soon.

Speaking of JP and NHOP, this is a favourite of mine: http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/article.php?id=9884#.UTniWxxSi9U I generally also love Red Mitchell's playing, so any duos with him are worth hearing. A quick scour of various other forums turns up these threads: http://forums.allaboutjazz.com/showthread.php?t=36640 and http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f7/bass-jazz-guitar-duet-recordings-710894/

I've only had about an hour to adjust today - been a bit of a busy one. Doesn't seem to be too much of a change with my right hand to be honest, feels pretty natural. Might be different for you though - I did tend to pizz higher up on the board (part of my motivation for changing action, although there were also serious LH considerations....), so my RH is probably doing pretty much the same thing as before but at the end of the fingerboard now. It provides less opportunity to dig in a bit perhaps, but I quite like it. Not sure about the volume question really, hard to tell without a side by side. Doesn't seem to have had a much of an effect on volume, but that could just be this setup allows my bass to speak more (e.g. pizzing lower on the board, which helps my sound project a little better), or accommodates my technique better.If anything, she sounds a bit richer to my ears. I wouldn't necessarily say that lower action = less volume, but it does seem to be a good heuristic. Regardless, if there is a slight dip in volume, it's not immediately noticeable, so as far as I'm concerned probably doesn't outweigh the physical benefits of lowering string height. Basically, I dunno. Sorry, I'm not very helpful! Will let you know after the next gig once I've had a bit time to be more analytical.......

Just got my bass back, a real dream to play.

Hello my ursine friend. I would recommend, if you are short on time: never practise anything for technique that can't be used musically (i.e. no simple digital exercises, even if you have a basic mechanical thing about hand motion to fix, try doing it whilst also playing something actually musical) and not to be concerned about playing for a relatively short time - even a little bit helps. Try to play a little bit each day with a metronome (PM me for some exercises if you want) and spend a little bit of time each day learning music by ear. Those two are key, I think, to being a "solid" player, a musician's musician.

One DB, one 6 string electric for hashing out 3 note-chords/pretending to be a sax player (sounds great in the studio too!), and one 4 stringer for the basic meat and potatoes playing. Couldn't be happier with my little family.

[quote name='JPS' timestamp='1360688938' post='1974748'] Thanks guys for all the great suggestions. Transcribing it is then! Never consciously done it before, obviously copied and absorbed things over the years but never sat down and studied licks in this sense. Love Pino's playing, however, not so familiar with his stuff with John Mayer. Any particular recommendations? Thanks again. [/quote] There's a live DVD ("Where The Light Is" I think...?) that's pretty good. Lots of clips from it on youtube.

Matt is spot on. Here's a process I use, which seems to work: 1) Pick a player you like. 2) Pick a lick/fill of theirs you like but don't already know - as simple or as complex as you like 3) Learn it by ear - really learn it, concentrate on playing with the same feel and intent behind the original 4) Try and pick it apart to see what notes it contains (relative to the harmony it is over), and play it in all the keys 5) Use it as many different situations as you can - so much that people who play with you a lot give a knowing smile when they hear you play it, but not so much that they rolls their eyes 6) Modify it a little - change the odd note here or there, change the timing a bit. Make it yours. You can try modifying it to fit situations it wouldn't normally fit (e.g. changing notes to make it minor not major etc.) 7) Rinse and repeat Personally, I think Pino Palladino's playing with John Mayer is very tasty. But I also think that what makes your playing your own is choosing for yourself what to assimilate.

Cool lesson Scott! I've been playing around with this today, taking the pattern up a further minor 3rd, so Dmin7, Fmin7, Abmin7. Nice tritone sound

My action has been at a whopping 12mm uniformly for the last few years. Amazing tone (get lots of compliments in that department), but doesn't half put a strain on the hands. More and more these days I find, much like I think Bilbo did, that I can't execute some of the things I'm hearing (especially in the higher portions of thumb position). More often than not, I find that playing sounds lovely, but takes so much exertion from myself that things need to change. I've finally decided to lower the string height. Can't wait!

What I've always found to help is taking the "dry" stuff in doses. If you wanna be a solid player, you've got to do the time, simple as. But it doesn't have to be a chore. I will often practise scales/arps for 20 mins out of every half hour, and have a cup of tea/coffee (whiskey if it's been trane changes). For me, it certainly helps with my crappy attention span, and absorbing information like that is tiring (a working brain has a very high metabolic demand, and using it tires you out) so good to give the brain a bit of a rest. But it's also fun (I think essential) to intersperse technical/theoretical work with stuff like playing along to records, either trying to work out specific lines or just jamming along - always great for your musicianship. I'm a bit strange in that I find timing/metronome exercises very relaxing, so will do those as a way of calming down in between doses of theory as well.

Great, well once I've got that adjusted and maybe got a shim under my nut I'll be a real hit at the next gig!

[quote name='FLoydElgar' timestamp='1347924856' post='1806848'] @Hector A massive fan of Edgar Meyer His playing is spectacular!!!! Listen out for the Solo's they do its awesome! [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j526fXDhBLc[/media] [/quote] Yeah! I was gonna post that track, but wasn't sure it strictly counted with the classical vibe of this thread. Edgar's solo entry makes the hairs stand up on the back of my neck.