Beedster

Sounds like you might need to try a bass other than a Precision, although that's clearly sacrilege. Here's something close enough

Don't go custom order Warmoth, good necks 90% of the time but risky the other 10%, their customer service department are frankly a joke (can be summarised as "Hey, you're not from the USA so we don't give a f**k"). If you can buy one used, a much better bet (I picked one up for around £100 a few months back and it's glorious, one of the best necks I've ever played, would have cost well over £400 had I ordered and imported it direct from Warmoth however). You're also limited in that you can't really use roundwound strings on a maple board, at least not for very long. Add to that the fact that PUPs that sound great on fretted do not always sound equally great on fretless! So, you probably need to think about what sound you want, and also think about resale value if it doesn't work out; a TF will probably be easy to sell, a custom/hybrid less so.

Which assumes that your bandmates have the slightest idea of what a fretless bass normally sounds like

The great thing about the internet is that it enables us to research, try and then sell on gear very easily, and I LOVE it for that, as my Feedback Thread demonstrates What it took me too long to learn is the wisdom in YMMV, what works for other people - no matter how how expert, how experienced, how knowledgable and how authoritative in their statements - doesn't always work for me, or even apply to me. The downside of the web is that it made me very lazy; gone are the days when I would hit Denmark Street at 10.00am and stay until 6.00 A-Bing gear, now I just get the hots for something and push the button, knowing that I can probably sell it for what I paid for it if I don't like it (thanks BC). The web has also made us all impatient; an amp is released in the US and we want it here, now, and in the case of some of us, are prepared to take a huge risk that A) they like it and aren't about to throw the difference between new and used price down the drain, and 2) that it works fine and won't need to be sent back at huge expense. It's Mesa, it'll be OK, might even be great, but will also be expensive compared to similar units form other manufacturers, might have some early reliability issues, and will ultimately not be all that different from gear that can already be had elsewhere. Having said that, of course I'd love one. The Walkabout was a Gateway amp for me, in that like beer or weed, I soon habituated and wanted something that did the same but more. I tried pretty much every amp Mesa ever made, at least in the tubey space - M-PUlse 360 & 600, BB750, Bass 400 & 400+, Buster, D-180 - and never found it, which is why I've gone back to Ampeg, where I can't help thinking there is more of the WA on steroids to be found that at Mesa. So I'm just going to wait until the first used WD-800 comes up and pounce on that

Absolutely

Yep, and different states have different regulations/laws re these things, so it can get quite messy. I'd never buy anything from the USA that, if there were a problem, I couldn't get sorted cheaply and satisfactorily in the UK. Sending back is simply not an option unless you have shedloads of cash, in which case you'd probably but via Mesa Europe in the first place.

With that choice and all emotions re vintage instruments to one side, I'd go for the TF every time. The J-PUP brings a hell of a lot to a fretless Precision, and the J/P pair on the TF work really well. It's also very good quality for a non-Custom Shop model. Having said this, I know of a nice 70's FL for sale and can put you in contact with the seller if that helps?

Yep, on the I have to admit that aesthetics really get to me also 😉

Yep, that should perhaps have been number 2 now I think about it, put the PUP in the wrong space and most of the rest fails

I totally agree that circuits can make a difference, but not that they're needed if other factors, especially PUPs and head, are OK (when I used to use active circuits it was all too often compensating for one or both). I generally don't touch the controls at all these days, even on Jazzes, normally all controls fully clockwise, perhaps neck rolled back a little. Bridges can make a difference for sure, but again I think there are easier ways to get the tone you want via PUPs and strings. I play mostly flats and I rarely find any difference between bridges once action etc is sorted. However, I think what I should have also said in the first post was 'also in the case of roundwounds I've rarely noticed a positive effect'. I've found that a high mass bridge, to my ear at least, can make a bass with rounds sound quite a lot more harsh/brittle than a BBOT. The only exception is on fretless, where I've found a higher mass bridge can - but doesn't always - enhance the sustain and clarity a little. Yes, I suspect that putting cabs at the top of the 'Don't seem to matter' list was partly the beer's fault, and partly a function of the fact that I was thinking about some specific scenarios (having said this, I'd still keep cabs at 6th in the list). I think my reasoning goes back to using good heads through relatively average cabs at rehearsal studios over the years, which seemed more often than not to result in a decent tone (for example my Walkabout sounded great no matter what cab it went though). This contrast with the odd occasion when I've used poor heads through good cabs, but on reflection, given the direction of the signal path, that's perhaps not a fair test.

I realised this evening that, possibly for the first time I can remember, my (one) Ampeg/Mesa bass rig is worth more than my (five) bass guitars put together. This is largely down to my having spent about two years building, unbuilding and reconfiguring Fender-fit bitsas, usually from Warmoth, Allparts and similar parts bought used either here or on eBay. It also got me to thinking that I've now got a pretty clear system for my gear, that certain things really matter to me and that certain other things really don't. Thought I'd share the list Things that really matter: 1. Neck: the neck to me is the most important part of the whole system; if it doesn't feel right, I don't play right, and I don't enjoy playing. I'm a better player on basses with necks I like. I play 1-11/16" nut Precision necks on both Precision and Jazz basses. Jazz Basses are a different beast with a substantial Precision neck. 2. Strings: wrong strings, wrong tone and more effort required, making playing less fund. Nothing else in the signal chain makes up for it 3. Tuners: doesn't matter how good the tone and playability if it creeps out of tune. Amazing how many tuners can't hold tuning, even some quite expensive ones. Amazing how irritating an instrument going out of tune can be. 4. Amp head: wrong choice can make an expensive bass sound crap. A good choice can make a relatively cheap bass sound good. This is not the place to skimp on cost. Or weight. 5. PUPs: it took me a long time and a lot of convincing that PUPs define the tone almost as much as the head and the strings, but the right PUP for the sound makes playing effortless and puts a smile on the player and the band's faces. Things that really don't seem to matter: 6. Cabs: never seem to make as much difference as the head, differences between expensive and cheap never seem to justify the cost of the former 7. Circuit: with a decent bass, strings and head, I just don't use the circuit on any of my basses, might as well run the PUPs straight to the output jack! 8. Bridge: despite years of trying them all, the only thing that matters is that you can get the right action and alignment. Tone metals? High mass? Never noticed an effect. 9. Body wood. Still find it amazing that people talk endlessly about tone woods. Change any of the neck, PUPs, strings and the tone changes significantly. I've yet to find two different bodies that sounded significantly different when fitted with the same components, and I've done a lot of experimentation. So, looking at my current basses, I realise that about 50-60% of the total value is in the necks, around 20% in PUPs (which I tend to buy new as I've found too many PUPs bought used have issues), the rest split variously between bodies, tuners, bridges, circuits etc. As mentioned, I've five basses, three Precisions (one fretless) and two Jazzes (again one fretless). Total cost was a tad under £1500 for the lot. I'd put most of them in Fender MIA territory in terms of build quality, playability and tone, with two in CS territory (the two fretless). Makes you realise just how much we pay for the names on the headstocks. Having said this, I have to thank Leo Fender however for making it so bloody easy to mix and match parts of Fender-alike instruments

£350 for a completely unknown quantity in manufacturing terms and of equally unknown quality in playability/tone/structural terms? I agree with Bassassin

Folks Useful thread, thanks. I've some experience of sanding the finish off bass necks and refinishing with oil, with a decent degree of success. However, I have a lovely old MIJ Fender neck that a previous owner has finished with a very thick layer of varnish, and which I want to strip back to an oil finish. Can anyone recommend a product I can use to get at least the worst of the finish off, I suspect that sanding will be a very long and painful process given the thickness of the stuff! Cheers Chris

Very very true. I've been in that vicious cycle for quite a while under the guise of 'so much gear to try, so little time'/'didn't have this choice when I was a kid' etc. Ultimately, despite all of the differences and nuances we discuss here, one bass/head/cab is much the same as another in the grand scheme of things. The rest is just dopamine

Yep, two of those that sold were mine, which I listed at very good prices and which sold within hours of being listed. I'm surprised at some of the prices people are asking here at present, there's more than one example of gear listed for more than the same items can be bought new. OK, the retail market is struggling at the moment, but a lot of folks seem to believe that the same forces affecting retail don't affect the used market; the main driver of price is never going to be what the seller paid for it, but the current market price. The two rather nice used basses in this thread are being sold by a shop

And some

I doubt even they did