Beedster
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[quote name='randythoades' timestamp='1390554621' post='2346645'] Thanks for this. I realise that it is a different concept and you are right, this was probably the guts behind my question. I am just not sure how it would fit dynamically. I have physically played the songs at home on DB and trying to play the same lines doesn't quite work both in sound or feel for that matter, but in some ways that was my point. At the moment I prefer playing the DB over the bass guitar and wanted to almost pick one as my go to instrument, but didn't want to upset the dynamics of the band as they play off and relate to the electric bass. Rock and pop groups with a DB isn't something I have seen often, hence my curiosity. Perhaps this is a question I need to raise seriously with the others as it will have more effect on them than I perhaps realised at first. I suppose I can take both to a jam and give it a try. Will test their skill as players (and mine) to see if they can cope with the dynamic change and see how it goes for a couple of weeks. I just like the idea of being different. [/quote] It's pretty easy to make a DB sound like an EB through use of appropriate strings, PUP and amplification. You're spot on though, the key question is whether it adds anything. As the folks above have made clear, even in the most DB friendly genres, there are likely compromises to be made in making the switch, and those compromises build the farther away from 'DB-friendly' is your band's music. However, there are no rules, this is music not science, so do what works for you.
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FS/FT: Fender Roscoe Beck IV 3t sunburst immaculate **GONE**
Beedster replied to Beedster's topic in Basses For Sale
Thanks for the positive comments folks. I appear to be very much in the minority in thinking it's not the perfect bass -
[quote name='Happy Jack' timestamp='1390499587' post='2346118'] But when say that you would "modify" your lines, be ready for some pretty radical modification. IME trying to play electric bass lines, even simplified ones, on a DB frequently just doesn't work.The physical demands of the DB and the very different tonal qualities mean that you often end up playing something really quite different. [/quote] Ha ha, yes, our attempt at the Stones' 'Miss You' is probably a good example of the above However, with the right strings, the right action and the right PUP it was nothing like as hard as I thought it would be to play some rock/pop. Wild Nights, which I imagined would be pretty hard to play, was actually surprisingly easy, and For What It's Worth was outstanding, actualy worked so much better on DB (I'm not necessarily saying it sounded good mind!). For me the key thing was that if I wanted the DB to sound like a [i]real [/i]DB, which for me would have meant higher action, mic or bridge PUP, different strings and a different style of playing, I doubt I could have done it. When we gigged the above set, the DB probably sounded more like a electric fretless (it was also going through a Walkabout), just looked a lot better
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Yep, we used to do a set of originals (alt-Americana apparently), and then a set of pop/rock, tracks we did included Fans (Kings of Leon), Round Here (Counting Crows), For What It's Worth (Buffalo Springfield), When You Were Young (Killers), Wild Nights (Van Morrison), Dancing In the Moonlight (Thin Lizzy), Bad Things (Jace Everett), You Can Bring Me Flowers (Ray Lamontagne), I could go on. I found a mag pickup at the end of the fingerboard made life a lot easier in terms of both amplifying the instrument and getting a sound that fitted with the tracks.
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[quote name='geoffbassist' timestamp='1390426666' post='2345436'] This thread is awesome, thanks for the great info Simon. [/quote] It's going to be very useful I'm sure, not just for recording but for live sound also. I sold my old DB recently and was telling the new owner about a gig I did a few years ago. It was in a long and relatively narrow old '50s ballroom. The sound-guy didn't have a clue and all he was getting from the DB was feedback. The guitarist popped to the toilet and when he came back out I was playing away with the drums, 2nd guitarist and singer, and although the soundguy had cut the DB signal while he tried to work out what to do, the guitarist came back to the stage saying that the bass was actually cutting through loud and clear out front in a way that it certainly wasn't on stage. We did the gig with the DB unplugged and, whilst my hands were pretty f*****d by the end of it, and whilst I had to really concentrate, folks at the gig - a few musos included - appeared to really like the sound. It was the night I realised that DBs weren't designed to be heard close up, but to be heard a distance from the instrument. As Si has made clear above, it's getting the balance between that optimal distance from the instrument and the acoustics of the room that's the challenge for live and recording. And whilst it sounds very scientific, I've no doubt that it's an art in real terms.
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[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1390411027' post='2345171'] I doubt it, but we'd have a lovely cup of tea, and shoot the breeze for hours. It would be fun! [/quote] Si, I'm moving back down south soon so if that could be arranged, I'd bring the Ginger Nuts! C
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Hello mate, pics attached now. I've tried to show the colour against a white background. [url="http://s80.photobucket.com/user/Beedster/media/IMG_1787_zps8821ffe2.jpg.html"][/url] [URL=http://s80.photobucket.com/user/Beedster/media/IMG_1788_zps807a62d2.jpg.html][IMG]http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j199/Beedster/IMG_1788_zps807a62d2.jpg[/IMG][/URL] [URL=http://s80.photobucket.com/user/Beedster/media/IMG_1789_zpsce1dc74b.jpg.html][IMG]http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j199/Beedster/IMG_1789_zpsce1dc74b.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
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[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1390398078' post='2344905'] Mic postion interesting points/rules of thumb/ stuff to know:- The larger the instrument the further away from it your mic needs to be to capture the entire sound of the instrument, rather than an aspect of the total sound that eminates from the part of the instrument your mic is closest to. This distance from an instrument that a mic needs to be from it to capture the entire the soiund of it evenly is the boundary between close micing and distant micing an instrument. In any room as you back off a mic from an instrument the level of the direct sound picked up from the instrument drops at a rate of 1/dxd (so if you move twice as far away the volume drops by a quarter). At some point (unless you're in an anechoic chamber) the level of the reflections from the room boundary become louder than the direct sound from the instrument. This is called critical distance. In order to capture a decent recording the mic needs to be within the critical distance, specifically a cardiod mic needs to be within 2/3 of the critical distance, whilst an omni (or a fig 8 for that matter) should be within half the critical distance, otherwise the recording will sound like its from miles away from the instrument, down a well. [/quote] As I've said before, everything I learned in two years of Electronic Musical Instrument & Recording Technology in the 1980's I could have learned in one weekend round at Si's
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Went for over £500
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Looks marvellous, so what does it sound like? -
FS/FT: Fender Roscoe Beck IV 3t sunburst immaculate **GONE**
Beedster replied to Beedster's topic in Basses For Sale
[quote name='Thunderbird' timestamp='1390334649' post='2344231'] Lovely bass but just out of curiosity what is a c64 bass? I googled it but it just came up with home made Commodore 64 computer basses lol anyhow GLWTS [/quote] Thanks, clue's in the first post above -
[quote name='Jebo1' timestamp='1389818078' post='2338339'] Basses are built to be played. My 66 Fender has cigarette burns, a stain from a pint glass and a bite mark! Buy it, play it, love it (and get insurance!) [/quote] I'd love to know how it got the bite mark Laurie, wasn't my local lass by any chance http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-mid-wales-25679166 -
FS/FT: Fender Roscoe Beck IV 3t sunburst immaculate **GONE**
Beedster replied to Beedster's topic in Basses For Sale
[quote name='wateroftyne' timestamp='1390329999' post='2344158'] ...super Jazz... [/quote] You know it's a funny thing, but I've known about the Roscoe Beck for about 10 years and it's only really now - with immaculate timing - that I think of it as a Jazz! I'd always seen it as a sort of half-way house between Jazz and Precision, the best-of-both-worlds Fender (which to be honest, it is). This had been both reinforced by its looks, which to my eye are more Precision than Jazz, and its reputation. But yes, having played it several times now, Michael's spot on, this is a - possibly the - 'super Jazz' It certainly does a lot more than Jazz Bass, but that's where the core tone is centred, and all other tones are either side of that. I must admit part of me wants to stick on some La Bella Jamersons and check out the neck PUP in series to see just how vintage a Precision tone I can get, but of course the problem with doing that is that I'm likely to lose some of the very versatility that I bought the bass for (although even as I write I'm thinking about it some more....). So yes, Super Jazz is about right -
FS/FT: Fender Roscoe Beck IV 3t sunburst immaculate **GONE**
Beedster replied to Beedster's topic in Basses For Sale
Many thanks Gareth, the Precision above looks lovely. Re the Reggie Hamilton, I just prefer the shape of a Precision to be honest. I used to dislike Jazz width necks but I've found that they're easier to play Precision than on a Jazz, so perhaps there's something about the way Jazzes sit or balance? This is one of the reasons I went for the Roscoe Beck, it's not quite Precision shaped but neither is it a Jazz body-wise. It actually sits really nicely. Anyway, this may all be moot as two gentlemen have offered me c64s at reasonable prices so the Roscoe is definitely for sale at £1200 which is what I paid Michael. I played it for an hour today and have to say that if you like Jazz Basses, this bass is about at good as it gets. I've linked below to some Talkbass threads and it's clear that a lot of folks believe this to be one of the best basses that Fender make (made, now discontinued) as well as one of the best Jazz Basses full stop. Read on..... [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/roscoe-beck-jazz-anybody-out-there-got-one-854531/"]http://www.talkbass....got-one-854531/[/url] [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/fender-roscoe-beck-iv-874824/"]http://www.talkbass....beck-iv-874824/[/url] [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/fender-roscoe-beck-576261/"]http://www.talkbass....oe-beck-576261/[/url] [url="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f8/fender-roscoe-beck-v-7684/"]http://www.talkbass....oe-beck-v-7684/[/url] And some thoughts on the bass from the man himself [url="http://www.jollybeggars.co.uk/bassforum/rb/"]http://www.jollybegg...k/bassforum/rb/[/url] -
[quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1390305823' post='2343731'] Line Audio CM3 (sdc) (~ £125 new) ADK S51 MK5.2 (ldc) (~£165) Heil PR-40 (ldd) (~£200 second hand if you look hard) NoHype Audio LRM-1 (ribbon) (~£105 new) That would be a flat small diaphragm condensor, a large diaphragm condensor, a lovely large diaphragm dynamic, and a hand assembled long ribbon, depending on the sound you want they could all sound great on a bass in the right room, in the right position. The ribbon would possibly be abit too boomy on a lot of db's, and is a figure of 8 pattern mic, so you need a nice souinding room for it, it will sound killer on the right bass though, especially if you are looking for a vintage sound, amazingly smooth sounding mic for vocal too. The ADK is a cheaper LDC that definitely punches above its weight The Heil PR-40 is out of your price band, so you could pick one up second hand, and if its not be mistreated they are fantastic mics, really exceptional at the low end. The CM3 is a seriously well kept secret, extremely flat, and a rather wide cardioid mic, its tiny, yet brilliant at capturing the real sound of a source in a room. I've had tremendous success recording all sorts of things with these, if you could fashion a gooseneck to attach to your bass the CM-3 is so small you could put it anywhere (not that I would advise recording DB from that close with any mic if at all avoidable). [/quote] Good info. Do you rate the Samson VR-88 Si? Chris
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FS/FT: Fender Roscoe Beck IV 3t sunburst immaculate **GONE**
Beedster replied to Beedster's topic in Basses For Sale
[quote name='Beedster' timestamp='1390263012' post='2343468'] So, I'm looking for trades for one of two basses, and I'm not after anything but these [b][u]so please don't offer[/u][/b] 1. A c64, likely with cash from me depending on the condition of your bass (if you don't know what a c64 is you haven't got one!) 2. A passive Fender P/J, ideally with rosewood board, probably with cash my way unless it's something very special I might go for a straight sale if something along the lines of the above two instruments comes up for sale in the meantime. [/quote] Sorry to restate it but I really do not want anything other than the above two instruments or possible a straight sale. -
FS/FT: Fender Roscoe Beck IV 3t sunburst immaculate **GONE**
Beedster replied to Beedster's topic in Basses For Sale
[quote name='GreeneKing' timestamp='1390301444' post='2343667'] That is a special bass Chris, very nice. Shame it's only Fender P/J's you're interested in. [/quote] Certainly is Peter, thanks. To be honest I will probably be up for a straight sale, as the chances of a trade for either instrument I want are, I guess, relatively small. No great rush either way really. Chris -
I've been looking for a very versatile passive bass for as long as I can remember. At heart I'm a Precision kinda guy who on occasion finds the single PUP a little limiting. I'm also a Ric kinda guy who finds that whilst Rics can do one or two things really well, they just don't work in certain genres. So, aware of the reputation of the Fender Roscoe Beck as quite possibly Fender's best ever instrument - certainly it's most versatile - I saw Michael's thread a year or so again and it got me thinking. Then he withdrew it, and then he listed it again [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/213753-fender-roscoe-beck-iv-sunburst/page__hl__beck"]http://basschat.co.u.../page__hl__beck[/url], and I still resisted. After a couple of weeks of reading outstanding Talkbass reviews and talking to various folks, I though 'sod it. let's do it'. So, what happened? Well firstly I was absolutely blown away by the sheer range of tones you can get from this bass, a range far more consistent with an active bass than a passive bass. Second, the build quality is absolutely superb, far more in line with what I'd expect from Sadowsky USA than Fender. Third the playability is outstanding, the only instrument I'd put in the same league as a Modulus Flea in this respect. The neck is quite simply outstanding. Lastly, it looks absolutely gorgeous. So why am I letting it go? Well, I just don't think it's the bass for me, it's that simple. I A-B'd it against an MIJ Precision and an old Faker 4001 and if I'm honest, whilst these two basses are hugely limited in many respects, I just prefer the core tone of both. So, I'm looking for trades for one of two basses, and I'm not after anything but these so please don't offer 1. A c64, likely with cash from me depending on the condition of your bass (if you don't know what a c64 is you haven't got one!) 2. A passive Fender P/J, ideally with rosewood board, probably with cash my way unless it's something very special I might go for a straight sale if something along the lines of the above two instruments comes up for sale in the meantime. Please refer to Michael's FS thread for photos and info [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/213753-fender-roscoe-beck-iv-sunburst/page__hl__beck."]http://basschat.co.u...page__hl__beck.[/url] Note that it comes with tort and whit pickguards, all case candy etc. Even the case is beautiful! Little tease pics from Michael's thread here... [attachment=152935:Roscoe.jpg] [attachment=152936:Roscoe 2.jpg][attachment=152937:Roscoe 3.jpg][attachment=152938:Roscoe 4.jpg] Chris
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[quote name='Rio' timestamp='1390179510' post='2342419'] Hi Beedster After the 1st of Feb I will be able to drive and pick it up from where ever it is and pay cash or bank transfer or however you like. I only joined this forum to enquire about the project mix I thought it would email me to notify a response to this thread but obviously it doesn't If you do want the sale call or text as I do not check this site regularly. Thanks mate Rio [/quote] Hi mate, apologies but it sold late last week, good luck finding another Chris
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[quote name='silverfoxnik' timestamp='1390120928' post='2341549'] I'm amazed this hasn't gone yet, especially with the Badass II thrown in! [/quote] I totally agree Nik. Gonna have to withdraw it as I'll be unable to post for a few weeks anyway, so it might end up being a keeper after all -
It is a rather Kylie-esque 38mm, suitable for those not man enough to play a real Precision
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[quote name='silverfoxnik' timestamp='1390041409' post='2340740'] BUMP for a very nicely priced and well spec'd P bass! Goes without saying that Chris is always a pleasure to deal with and what's more, after this sale, he's almost certainly going to be on Mastermind this year with his specialist subject being 'Buying & selling P Basses on Basschat'! So if he says it's a good 'un, it's definitely a good 'un..! [/quote] Nik, you're a real gent, many thanks. Looking forward to perhaps catching up in person once I'm back in the SE? Mastermind rejected my application on the 'unfair advantage' rule BTW
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These may need to be assimilated -
[quote name='Steff' timestamp='1389971578' post='2340155'] Chris you beat me to a lot of stuff I wanna buy. This is not fun any more! If I ask the girlfriend, she'll say I should thank you though [/quote] Ha ha, sorry mate, but I'm glad your girlfriend is grateful [quote name='sifi2112' timestamp='1389972059' post='2340172'] I agree Stef ... and I thought Chris had to get rid of stuff due to impending move lol ! [/quote] Fair point, the reason I want some small 'uns is because I'm going to have to let my very tall floor standing TDLs go as part of the move, and that hurts Anyway, I didn't buy these after all folks for the most stupid of reasons, I don't like black
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Despite what is evidently a lot of variation in the efficiency of amps and cabs, I think a bit of common sense has to be used with wattage ratings. Whilst in [i]some [/i]situations and [i]some [/i]styles of music 30w might be enough, you only have to look at what most players are using in most situations to know that it [i]probably[/i] won't be. I'm not for one second suggesting that the folks who have gigged with 30w are not getting great tone and volume for their needs, and I'm sure that they, their bands and their punters are very happy with that tone and volume, simply that the folks who can gig successfully with 30w are in the minority in terms of the types of music and venues they're playing.
