EssentialTension

[quote name='andy.' post='588076' date='Sep 2 2009, 10:13 PM']So what kid of sound do they produce? Is it a P or J sound or something totally different?[/quote] I'd say neither. But anyway it depends where in the bass they are fitted (i.e. neck or bridge) and how you play - because as I said they are very sensitive to what your fingers do. Try searching Dark Star pickups at YouTube. There's quite a few and quite a variety of sounds.

[quote name='alexclaber' post='587882' date='Sep 2 2009, 08:06 PM']Ed Friedland on the subject: "To my way of thinking, the difference between a P and J bass goes way beyond the physical. Yes, P bass - fatter neck (usually), split pickup, chunkier tone, less highs. J bass - slimmer neck, easier to play, dual pickups, more note definition, more high frequency. But... I think P or J bass is a lifestyle choice as well. Committing to the P means taking on a set of preferences, and inherent parameters. You can't or at least shouldn't try to play a P bass like a Jazz. That would be missing the point. The P bass is a fat, chunky-butt animal that likes to take up space. It demands a high level of attention to what you play, because every note hurts - or helps. There ain't no takin' it back with a P bass. You better mean it, or be very good at making it work. You can play fast on a P, but it's not nimble like a Jackrabbit, more like a Grizzly doing 60mph to catch something to eat. Slap on a P? Sure, it's chunkfunk, think Boz Scaggs "Lowdown". The pop on a P is not as sharp as a J. It's like getting sliced with a serrated steak knife. Ouch! Use only when you gots to cut through some tough meat. Classic P guys... Jamerson, Rainey, Rocco, Bob Glaub. The J is a sleeker machine. Being a Jazz guy means having a little more wiggle room. It takes up less space in the mix, so you can get more active without squashing people. With great power comes great responsibility. Just because you CAN move around, does that mean you should? And if so - how to, how much, and why? The J is a bit skinnier, so you have to learn how to use that texture to fill it up, and how to play it fat when it needs to be fat. Soloing? Sure. Slap? You bet. Passive it cuts like a well honed Buck knife. Active with a good pre amp, more like a barbers razor. Classic J guys... Jerry Jemmot, Larry Graham, Jaco, Marcus... Some people make a choice early on and stick with it. Their entire style is built around that early decision, whether it was conscious or not. You may know some of these people. Players that would no sooner pick up the other axe than they would deliberately eat rotten food. There's honor in this I think, it certainly makes your life simpler when it's Friday night and you're trying to decide which bass to put in the bag. I think it behooves (love that word) a professional bassist to have both and spend time cultivating the characteristics of each instrument. You need to make each one speak it's native language. There are some gigs that just naturally call for one or another. Not to say you couldn't switch around. You learn alot about the nature of the P and J when you try to make one do what the other does naturally." I think he sums it up very well! (Though I play a weird custom instrument that pretends to be a J but is really a P at heart). Alex[/quote] Nicely put - both Alex and Ed.

[quote name='andy.' post='588034' date='Sep 2 2009, 09:50 PM']Cool, would you recommend them? Do they sound good in different styles? How high are they to the strings? The pic im looking at makes them look really high. [url="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v371/Hammon/Dark%20Star%20Basses/Juan3close.jpg"]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v371/Ham.../Juan3close.jpg[/url][/quote] I would recommend them but they are not everyone's cup of tea. They are high to the strings and commonly you will need to lower the pole pieces. They look like humbuckers but are actually single coils with massive magnets. What looks like a second row of pole pieces is actually screws which lift or lower the actual pole pieces. The magnets are strong enough that if the string is too close it will choke in the magnetic field.

Yes, warm old school sound with a wide frequency range, high output, and sensitivity to what you do with your fingers (or pick). I had two in a Dearmond Starfire which I miss a lot. The Dark Star pickups are a re-engineering of the 1960s Hagstrom Bisonic pickups which were fitted to the original Guild Starfire (as used by Jack Casady of Jefferson Airplane): and were also used by Phil Lesh (Grateful Dead): and Berry Gordy of the Allman Brothers Band had a Bisonic in a Fender Jazz known as the Tractor Bass: Fred Hammon who did the re-engineering and named the pickups after the Grateful Dead track Dark Star has a website [url="http://www.hammoneng.com/"]here[/url]. The new Lakland [url="http://www.lakland.com/chisonics.htm"]Chisonic[/url] pickup attempts to create a similar sound with a different engineering approach.

... and long straps too.

You don't even have to use a pick to play rock guitar let alone bass.

[quote name='Jean-Luc Pickguard' post='587644' date='Sep 2 2009, 04:35 PM']My uneducated guess would be an 8 string John Birch Rick copy[/quote] I think that's correct.

[quote name='BurritoBass' post='587688' date='Sep 2 2009, 04:55 PM']Fender Precisions all the way! I like other basses but it always comes back to P-basses for me[/quote] +1

I always want a Precision, I rarely want a Jazz. You'll have to decide what you want.

Depends partly on what I'm playing and who I'm playing with but I'll say Fender Tony Franklin Fretless Precision. I can't put it down.

[quote name='Dr.Dave' post='587181' date='Sep 2 2009, 09:14 AM']I think it's cheesy and a bit comical too - certainly not deep , meaningful or challenging. and the problem with that is......?[/quote] Actually no problem, I quite like a bit of cheese but I didn't like that particular cheese.

[quote name='Jean-Luc Pickguard' post='587043' date='Sep 1 2009, 11:07 PM'] So do I - I have gigged with that one, but I haven't had the boules to borrow this one for a gig.[/quote] The purple heart one reminds me of the one Rob Davies in Mud played in the seventies: I'm guessing it was a John Birch.

I prefer the shell pink.

I've seen a DVD interview of Pastorius (with Jerry Jemmott) where he says, IIRC, that he always practised on fretted making sure that his left hand finger placement was right on the fret so making his muscle memory a very good foundation for fretless.

[quote name='OldGit' post='586908' date='Sep 1 2009, 08:57 PM']As a young snapper the words meant a lot "If you want to be a singer or play guitar, Man you gotta work or you won't get far It's never too late to work 9-5"[/quote] I was there too and I thought the lyrics were cheesy. Sorry.

[quote name='OldGit' post='586893' date='Sep 1 2009, 08:48 PM']Sorry to go against the flow here but hold your head up and Gawd gave rock and roll to you were outstandingly brilliant rock pop songs in their day.[/quote] I'd be happier with [i]Hold Your Head Up[/i] than the other one.

[quote name='thebeat' post='586854' date='Sep 1 2009, 08:25 PM']Now, sorry if this causes any offence to either; a) the vertically challenged amongst us, or Argent fans, or c) vertically challenged argent fans...but i'm sorry, not only is the song itself absolute sh*te and verging on the comical, but the guy who plays bass on it looks like a demented Munchkin on speed....i speak of course about the Old Grey Whistle Test Vol 2 version in all it's pythonesque glory You should really have look if only to re-affirm just how important image is [/quote] I've got that DVD and you're right.

[quote name='Clarky' post='586866' date='Sep 1 2009, 08:33 PM']I quite like the really hammy Kiss version on Kiss Alive III! And Gene Simmons didn't have too much of an image problem, or height problem in those stack heels [/quote] I've never understood how anyone could take Kiss seriously. Or take them at all in fact. Sorry guys. IMHO.

[quote name='bumnote' post='586859' date='Sep 1 2009, 08:30 PM']Jim Rodford, also played with the kinks, currently playing with the zombies[/quote] Ah, the Zombies, with original bassist Chris White, they were great. Check out [i]Odessey & Oracle[/i]. I suspect though that Chris White may have co-written [i]God Gave etc[/i]. Never mind.