alexclaber

[quote name='EssentialTension' post='1234637' date='May 17 2011, 05:54 PM']If an amp doesn't sound good flat then I wouldn't want it.[/quote] But what is flat?

The QSC PLX in my Gator 4U shallow is 13.25" deep from the rack rails and fits perfectly so your M6 should. The SKB shallow cases are aimed at rack effects whilst the Gator ones are deep enough to fit compact power amps and have rear rack rails to handle the weight.

I've had a Gator 4U shallow for ages - it's a bit over 13" deep from the rack ears. How deep is the M6?

[quote name='waltsdog' post='1228258' date='May 11 2011, 11:35 PM']My settings were gain about 12 o'clock (no clipping) and volume about 2 o'clock with the 2 cabs in a maybe 200 capacity room (albeit a very odd shaped room) everything else on the amp is dead flat. The bass is a passive dingwall abz on standard strings.[/quote] 12 o'clock and 2 o'clock is absolutely fine. [quote name='waltsdog' post='1228258' date='May 11 2011, 11:35 PM']Last gig I used just the midget in a small room maybe 50-75 capacity, cab up on a stool about 2ft running gain at 2 o'clock and vol up around 3 o'clock.[/quote] 2 o'clock and 3 o'clock is fine too! [quote name='waltsdog' post='1228258' date='May 11 2011, 11:35 PM']...I always want to keep the gain as low as possible rather than adjusting to the clip light.[/quote] Why do you always want to keep the gain as low as possible? It's there so you can use it. Turn it up to the max if need be. If it sounds good, then it is good. Ignore any flashing lights, use your ears! At a bassbash some time ago chris_b and I were messing around with some Barefaced cabs and his Thunderfunk, using his Lakland 5, which has fairly middling gauge strings and action and he's not someone who plucks softly. Despite that when I played I was about twice as loud as him, which means that the amp needs 10x the gain to get him as loud as me. If you pluck softly he could easily be twice as loud as you, so that another 10x gain. Between you and me there could be a gain difference of 100x. That's a lot of extra gain for the amp to add but fortunately most amps have that range. The Midget can easily handle a gig that size if given enough power! If you need more output, turn up.

Light touch? Low pickups? Quiet pickups? Thin strings? Low battery?

Yes, my point is regarding both physics and psychoacoustics. Lots of cabs sound good when you're so close to them that your ears are distorting and compressing and hiding their flaws. Lots of cabs sound bassy when you're close enough to feel the air moving in the immediate near-field. It's the cabs that can fill a venue with sound and still sound big and deep when cranked up when you're standing far enough away for your ears to hear them accurately, they're the ones that sound truly heavy. And with my preferences for massive sounds it takes a stack of generic cabs almost as tall as me to deliver that kind of performance. I hate wimpy lows. Ironically I've never really cared how much cabs weigh, indeed I've been known to voluntarily lift heavy things in the name of exercise - but it's gratifying that those with knackered backs or other ailments can keep gigging because our cabs happen to be light. But the goal has always been real bottom, not that fake compressed and technically distorted mid-bass that so many smaller rigs use to try to fill the bottom with varying degrees of success.

Cabs don't vary in how they 'throw' sound - they're all loudest close up, silent at infinite distance and obey the laws of physics in between. Any variance you hear are your ears playing tricks - the cab that sounds loudest and fattest at a distance is the louder fatter cab.

It isn't weight that matters, it's size! (Not so) simple physics. And with enough power you can reduce physical size without reducing the size of the sound.

Turn the neck pickup down. And dig in.

I'm much more attached to my bass than my amp or cabs and it's the bass and my hands that produce my sound. BUT (see, big 'but'!) it's the cab that tends to be the weakest link in the chain when it comes to reproducing that sound, especially if your band is loud.

It's a soft limiter LED, comes on 6dB before clipping. You'll only actually clip the amp if you push it so hard that this LED practically never goes out!

Ignore the LEDs. Only worry about it if the limit LED is on most of the time. If it sounds good, it is good.

Except if you're using say a 2x10" and 4x10" in which case 8 and 4 ohms respectively is best. And the real impedance curves of all cabs are so wiggly that with valve amps using the next highest tap is perfectly fine (and actually better for some cabs)...

I'd delete Rule 3! And head and cab wattage hardly matter at all.

No, I meant play music through your cab and see how it sounds and if the tweeter knob does anything. The 410HLF is a very unusual sounding cab - tons of bottom, not much midrange and then the tweeter for the treble. I can't think of another cab on the market that sounds like it, regardless of speaker configuration.

If you currently run both pickups at full volume, turn one of them down a bit (or a lot).

[quote name='JTUK' post='1207281' date='Apr 21 2011, 05:23 PM']Why are you arguing with me..? He can't get a sound out of one of your cabs..? [/quote] He's previously stated that he does, and that it works for the band and audience too. The issue is that on very small stages he's too close to hear the same sound that everyone else is hearing. The problem is simple acoustics and the best solution is simply elevating the cab and I'm not the only one saying that!

Does the earth look flat to you too?

Thanks Thom, I'm glad someone else is listening (both in terms of what I'm saying and also hearing the real world results of acoustic laws at gigs!) If you're on a very small stage there's a lot to be said for putting the guitar amp and bass amp on opposite sides of the stage to their players. But if you want to feel the thump up close that isn't an option.

[quote name='MatthewKeys' post='1202587' date='Apr 17 2011, 01:36 PM']The glass fuses look intact, but they do not light up or spark or anything when my amp is turned on with the tweeter at various volumes. I'm not sure if they are supposed to light up or not but I thought it would be worth mentioning![/quote] The 'glass fuses' aka bulbs only light up when you're trying to push too much power through the tweeter. As they glow they soak up excess power and if you continue to push more and more power through they eventually blow like a fuse to protect the tweeter. Did you try playing recorded music through the rig?

[quote name='JTUK' post='1206821' date='Apr 21 2011, 10:22 AM']I really can't see a reason why having an earful of bass is going to be helpful...when all it really does is surpass a problem not fix it, IMV.[/quote] If you're standing right up against a short-ish cab then you're going to miss out on a lot of the treble and midrange which the rest of the band and the audience are hearing, because your ears are much further off-axis. I'd lift the cab off the floor and/or tilt it upwards so it's pointing more at your ears. If your amp is in a rack then put the cab on the rack instead of the other way around. As little as 1' of lift and 20 deg of upward tilt can make all the difference. Improvise! You'd have to lift the cab really far off the floor to lose out on LF coupling where you need it (by which point you'll probably start getting coupling from the ceiling instead!)

I've said this before and I'll say it again! With cutting edge speaker cabs this power is a joy, allowing you to get equal tone and volume to a large rig with one half the size, or allowing you to get deeper lows without having to use bigger cabs. The reason higher power amps often sound bigger and deeper than lower power amps is that the lower power amps run out of power more often, and it's the lower frequency content of the notes that eat power and thus are restricted when you run out of power. I don't believe any bass amps out there are under-specced with regards to power output. However some meet more stringent specs than others. The anecdotal evidence regarding all the lightweight high power amps suggests that whichever one you think is loudest is the one whose full power compression/limiting best suits the dynamic feel you like. It's just like how some people think the SVT sounds and feels amazing whilst others think it sounds compressed and midrangey when you're cranking.

[quote name='Monckyman' post='1200382' date='Apr 15 2011, 10:30 AM']OK guys enough, if the mad proff gets a lot of luv round here thats ok, but there`s no need for him to make what I thought was a quite rude statement. Clipping amps is not recommended by anyone I know in the industry,not P.A amps, not guitar amps,not bass amps. OVERDRIVING them is different, that`s pe-amp stuff, not OUTPUT amp.[/quote] Dear Mr Monckyman, The only reason I'm saying anything is because what you're saying is wrong. I totally agree that it's not a good idea to clip the amps driving PA tops or full-range cabs. (It's fine clipping PA subs). However, you are way off the mark regarding guitar amps - all the classic rock guitar sounds are derived from clipping the output stages of valve amps. Bass amps live along a continuum sitting between PA stuff and guitar stuff whilst he input signal is much more like than from a guitar than that from recorded music. Many classic OVERDRIVEN sounds are the result of overdriving OUTPUT amps. And not only valve amps, solidstate amps too (GK stuff being a notable example). If you remain convinced that you must never ever ever clip the output stage of your bass amp then you will either have to use a ton of compression and limiting or you will end up taking a rig to your gigs that is about four times as large that it needs to be. Constant clipping is rarely a good thing - but frequent clipping is perfectly normal and should be expected unless you're playing a quiet gig with a big rig. Best regards, Alex

[quote name='ThomBassmonkey' post='1199451' date='Apr 14 2011, 02:34 PM']Ultimately I'm just asking "if you play quietly, even if your amp's wattage is higher than the speaker's rating, then you won't be pushing too many watts through it?".[/quote] Yes. But conversely if you turn your amp down but still play loud through it you can hit full power. Lots of amps hit full power with a typical bass and player at less than half volume.

And they are talking about PA speakers! As someone who designs and builds BASS GUITAR speakers I'd contend that my advice is more relevant and thus more accurate. If you take the time to read everything here: [url="http://barefacedbass.com/technical-information.htm"]http://barefacedbass.com/technical-information.htm[/url] and here: [url="http://barefacedbass.com/bgm-columns.htm"]http://barefacedbass.com/bgm-columns.htm[/url] you may then understand what I'm talking about. If you already know all about power density, the lowpass filtering of voice coil inductance and the crest factor of typical bass guitar vs typical program material then my apologies for wasting your time.