flyfisher

Thanks Skol, looks like a useful set of hints & tips for a recording novice like me. I get what 51m0n is saying - after all, music is such a subjective subject that ears are the ultimate judge - but anything that helps the novice to understand where to start and what the effect of various changes might be, must surely be a good thing? Anyone who dials-in the suggested eq settings and then sticks with them even if they don't like the resulting sound is never going to have a happy outcome. I can't imagine many people are likely to do this, so Skol's 'cribsheet' seems like a good idea to me. Seems like one of those 80/20 rules to me; the first 80% is fairly straightforward and where rules-of-thumb can be very useful, whereas the final 20% is where things get tricky and experience really counts. I don't think Skol was suggesting the document was a 100% solution.

Played with both my bands a small local pub last night for the landlady's birthday bash. When I say small, I would say it was only marginally bigger than where we rehearse and about 100 people were expected for the birthday party alone! Crammed into a corner, I kept backing into a crash cymbal when our harp player in one band kept backing into me and in the other band the guitarist gave me even less room as he had a pedal board taking up valuable floorspace. Still, it all seemed to go down well, with plenty of people congratulating us afterwards. The people at the front certainly got a good view of the proceedings and our guest sax player was mingling with the people at the bar for much of the set. But it made me wonder about all the hand-wringing and worrying that goes on here about tone. In such a packed and cosy environment all the fine tuning during rehearsals seems to go out the window. All good fun though!

A favourite cartoon from an ol Private Eye . . . . [attachment=87566:WaspCartoon.jpg]

[quote name='PaulWarning' post='1345434' date='Aug 19 2011, 01:46 PM']way above my head, I just think they sound good[/quote] . . . . which is the only important thing. Music is all about making stuff up and experimentation. There no real rules and the proof is in the listening. If someone likes the result then it's a good result. Of course there are 'guidelines' and even engineering concepts that can be useful in giving us a head start when trying to create something but the ultimate test is whether it sounds good. Engineering alone can never be the arbiter of one thing being better than another because 'better' cannot be defined or measured in a musical context.

[quote name='JTUK' post='1345066' date='Aug 19 2011, 07:55 AM']If you are mixing makes ...it becomes more of a lottery, IME.[/quote] And even then, the positioning of the cabs can make more difference than almost anything else. A big open stage or crowded into the corner of a pub can have a huge impact on the sound, regardless of the care an attention given to mixing and matching drivers and cabs.

[quote name='ficelles' post='1345018' date='Aug 19 2011, 01:00 AM']I always thought 10s gave more punch but then I guess that depends what you mean by the word...[/quote] I think of 'punch' as meaning how quickly the speaker cone can react to the signal from the amp. Because there is mass involved, a smaller, lighter speaker cone should be able to move faster than a bigger heavier one. This makes it easy to imagine how a small speaker can move fast enough to reproduce very high frequencies, which a large speaker physically cannot do (easily) but is not so helpful in imagining a small speaker reproducing low frequencies - though they can. But then the whole electromechanical stuff overlaps with the psychology of how we perceive sound, which add a large dose of subjectivity to the whole subject.

Microwave oven would probably be OK as the microwaves excite water molecules to heat them and (usually) the food they are within. Actually, a gas oven would probably be OK as well. Yes, gas can give off water vapour but if the oven is above 100C then it's not going to condense inside so the oven would still dry out the sachets.

Yep, look after the ohms and you won't ruin your amp. Everything else is pretty subjective - if you like the sound then go for it.

Audio watts is not quite the exact science it might seem. Your calculation is correct but the speaker won't suddenly go up in smoke when the amp output is cranked up to 251W. The general view is that if the speaker is not distorting then everything is fine. Also speaker ratings are generally pessimistic and amplifier ratings optimistic. The max calculated power of 287.5W is only 15% over the speaker rating so I'd be surprised if you could do any damage with this configuration. And, as you say, you're highly unlikely to be cranked up to full volume anyway. I wouldn't worry about it.

[quote name='civictiger' post='1344401' date='Aug 18 2011, 02:18 PM']I use an adapter atm and it caused me all sorts of problems, with my Russian Big Muff.. it just so unreliable.[/quote] There's no fundamental real reason why such an adapter should be unreliable - it's just two connectors and a bit of wire. Wires can break, of course, and connections can become intermittent, but nothing that wouldn't be easy to fix. Might be worth having a close look at the 'battery' end of the adapter. Sometimes the flower-like terminal can open up and not make good contact with the other mating half. A gentle squeese with some pliers will close the 'flower' so that it grips the mating half more securely. Hope that makes sense.

[quote name='icastle' post='1343896' date='Aug 18 2011, 01:01 AM']That's true. But on the other side of the coin though, how many anti Tesco websites have appeared compared to anti 'Jones the Butcher' websites? [/quote] Well yes, but large successful companies always draw some people out from under their stones to have a moan. Look at Microsoft. Anyway, 'Jones the Butcher' was a bumbling old fool

[quote name='Happy Jack' post='1344092' date='Aug 18 2011, 10:01 AM']That's worth knowing - I'll chuck 'em all away then.[/quote] They can be reused by baking in an oven to dry them out. So no need to throw them away if you really need them.

You'll do no damage using something like that adapter, as long as the voltage and polarity of the mains adapter connector are correct.

Firstly, those little bags can only absorb a certain amount of moisture. So, unless you regularly dry them out then they're probably not actually be making any difference at all. Secondly, unless you regularly store your bass/case in a damp environment or play in the rain and put it in the case when wet (OK, that would be daft, but you get the picture) then I'd be surprised if moisture is a significant problem. Wood will expand/contract as its moisture level changes. Thus, for a guitar, I'd say that the ideal situation is to keep the moisture content constant. Storing it in a dessicating atmosphere may not help with this at all. In practice, most basses are stored in a household environment and I don't know anyone who worries about their TV or hi-fi or or furniture or a myriad of other goods being affected by dampness. My bass is over 20 years old and doesn't show any signs of moisture-related problems. A quick towelling-down to remove any sweat/skin oils after playing is probably more important. I wouldn't worry about it.

[quote name='Bill Fitzmaurice' post='1343508' date='Aug 17 2011, 06:48 PM']The problem is that they aren't. And if you're getting all the mids from a guitar cab at ear level you can't hear any of the mids from your cab down below waist level. The technical explanation is called Precedence Effect. It's tough enough to hear your mids with the cab down low and not tilted back, it's impossible with the mids from the guitar masking them.[/quote] Fair point, but there's still plenty of bass to be able to hear what I'm playing, so my performance isn't affected. The on-stage sound might not be the best but surely it's what the audience hears that is most important.

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='1343628' date='Aug 17 2011, 08:25 PM']Fair enough, those shops need to get their sh*t together.[/quote] Agreed. And actually, that's a rather different issue to the online issue really. [quote name='Pete Academy' post='1343628' date='Aug 17 2011, 08:25 PM']I sincerely hope Fender don't sell out.[/quote] I know what you mean but I wouldn't really see it as 'selling out'. If they end up selling to online companies it will be because economics forced them into it. If that's the only way they can eventually stay in business then it's not really selling out is it? [quote name='Pete Academy' post='1343628' date='Aug 17 2011, 08:25 PM']As stated previously, music shops are the best place to try instruments out, not online back and forth...how stupid is that?[/quote] I agree with that wholeheartedly. But how long can shops survive in the face of people trying out instruments in the shop and then buying them online? I don't see the demise of shops as some sort of planned conspiracy, just a natural consequence of the advantages of buying online. [quote name='Pete Academy' post='1343628' date='Aug 17 2011, 08:25 PM']I would love to stock more brands in our bass dept, but funds just don't allow it.[/quote] There you go . . . .

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='1343589' date='Aug 17 2011, 07:45 PM']Flyfisher, whilst I understand your comments, you have no idea how a music shop is run. You forsee doom and gloom for real shops, which is happening, as the other month four music shops closed down, including Dolphin, who have luckily been rescued by PMT. Don't forget, many major companies, such as Fender, will not supply online-only stores. What's the point? Eventually, those manufacturers will come under strain. Companies like JHS, who do the Vintage brand, will supply your local f***ing bakery. They were one of the first companies to supply Argos, which says it all.[/quote] You're right, I have no idea how a music shop is run, but I have a fair idea of the retail experience from the customer's perspective. And these sort of threads rarely seem to put music shops in a favourable light, based on the experiences of other customers. Fender might not supply online stores at the moment but I seriously doubt that policy is set in stone for eternity.

I don't think it's a silly idea, especially if space is tight, and I've done it a number of times without any problems. As mentioned above, if the guitarist can hear himself better there is less temptation to crank up the volume. Because the bass and guitar frequencies are well separated in the mix, I've never found had problems hearing my cabs. Definitely worth some experimentation I'd say.

[quote name='icastle' post='1343458' date='Aug 17 2011, 06:05 PM']Humans are (generally) a social animal and will only take so much 'cold mechanisation' before they switch alliegences back to a more traditional set of values. I agree that there needs to be a marked change in the attitudes and business models used in some music shops but I don't really foresee them (or any other retail sectors) dying out.[/quote] I agree about the 'social animal' thing, but if shopping is an important social experience for someone then I'd say they've got something wrong in their lives. Shopping [u]detracts[/u] from socialising with your friends. It wastes valuable spare time - something that is becoming ever more precious in these days of connected-all-the-time-working-round-the-clock. Apparently, 'worlidays' are the new big thing: [url="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14526949"]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14526949[/url] Imagine having this discussion 20 years ago, or BW (Before the Web ). The level of online shopping today would have been inconceivable. At least the rise of coffee and charity shops are helping to fill all those empty shop units in high streets throughout the land. I don't see the decline being halted anytime soon.

I agree that the home delivery thing can be the weak link for internet shopping, though I have to say I've not got any personal horror stories. People being at work during the day can, of course, be a problem. But there are ways around that. I've seen secure 'delivery bin' products where a package can be left and then latched closed by the courier, ready for the owner to return home. There's also a fairly new "safe deposit box" scheme. I'm not sure about the precise details, but my wife has recenly been buying stuff online and having it delivered to a 'locker' (like a left-luggage box at train stations) at our local Morrisons store. The online company emails the locker number and combination code and my wife collect the parcel on the way home from work. Rural post offices could also offer a "box number" type collection service for people who work during the day. Might be some complications with opening hours, though our village shop stays open until 8pm to catch the passing trade from people coming home from work. I'm sure there'll be loads of similar innovations in years to come. The other downside about shops is that anyone working full time is mainly limited to shopping on a saturday - and who wants to waste a precious day off when they can order online at any time of day? I've got no axe to grind against shops, I just can't see them surviving unless they can offer something very unique and appealing - and I can't think what that might be.

[quote name='Pete Academy' post='1343329' date='Aug 17 2011, 04:22 PM']See you in the dole queue.[/quote] No need for that, just need to adapt. Don't leave it too long though.

[quote name='mrdreadful' post='1343231' date='Aug 17 2011, 03:10 PM']The (now closed down) shop I got my Jackson guitar from told me one price when I asked them to order it in... and then tried to slap an extra £150 on that when it came to actually buying it (with cash)! I told them quite bluntly that if they didn't charge me the price they said initially I'd take my business elsewhere. The extra £150 disappeared like magic![/quote] I'd have walked out there and then, even after they took off the £150, because they were trying it on. A deal is a deal - they broke it, the deal's off.

I reckon people only used shops because there was no alternative, so we've built up a sort of nostalgia about them. But the reality is that they're pretty crap really. They only stock a tiny proportion of the products available in their marketplace (how could they afford to do anything else?) so you have to traipse around lots of shops if you want to really check out what's available, which takes time and money. And even if they do normally stock it you can't be sure they will actually have stock on the day you decide to buy. And none of that even starts to address the overhead issues which increases prices. These days we have the internet. We can browse through entire product ranges at the click of mouse in the comfort of our own homes. We can read product reviews from real people, we can see video demonstrations. If we buy, the goods are delivered to our door in a day or two and if we don't like them or change our mind we have a statutory right to return them for a full refund. And, of course, prices are generally lower because they don't have to support expensive property leases, staff and demo stock. If both these options were available at the dawn of commerce then shops would never have got off the ground. They've had a good head-start, so will take a while to die off, but remember that the web has only been with us for 20 years and we're now seeing a generation of consumers who've grown up with it and can't understand the point of shops. I'll give shops another 20 years or so.

[quote name='Bilbo' post='1342931' date='Aug 17 2011, 11:35 AM']I still only use 'play' on a dvd player, one setting on a washing machine and 'on/off' for the central heating. Is it just me?[/quote] I only use my mobile phone for making telephone calls - remember that quaint old custom where you actually speak in real time to a real person [i]insted of xchangin loads of txt msgs, like, innit[/i]. Trouble is, we all like gadgets don't we. Things we can fiddle with, customise, and show off. The manufacturers love it, of course, especially since the production cost of including loads of hardly-used-after-a-few-weeks features is almost zero yet people will seemingly pay lods of extra money for them. I've not yet quite decided whether getting old means you can no longer 'handle' such things or have just seen it all before and can no longer be arsed with such nonsense.

The "work for hire" thing is an interesting concept. Could it be argued that the public is the ultimate "hirer", because we pay for everything anyway? I reckon this is just another little sideshow on the way to a radical overhaul of creative rights in the digital/internet age.