Phil Starr

I haven't read all the posts so someone may have already given this answer. Why not contact @Ashdown Engineering? They are just the most helpful people and they will know. I love Bass Chat but really; arguing about how flat 'flat' actually is probably wasn't helpful.

Yeah I've wondered if there isn't a little bit of HPF filtering of the lowest frequencies as I've not had the low rumble at any of the venues I've played recently. I'm hoping to do a bit of response measuring of amps at the SW bass bash in a few weeks' time so I'll check it out then if possible. Ha ha it does look a bit silly perched on the 112, just about acceptable on the 110T I suppose it could go on a pedalboard

Oh well, I've bitten. The Gnome is my preferred amp nowadays. It sits in my hard case and I'm increasingly appreciative of its solidity. I've changed the way we do sound too with bass pretty much always going through the PA. I've also gone over to using cabs with a tweeter alternating between a single 110T and a single 112T which is slightly louder. I also carry a Peavey MiniMax 500W amp which is what I mean to use. I almost always end up using the Gnome though, it sounds better. It's just a flat neutral sound without all the tonal options of the Peavey but I'm using my Zoom B1ON to do tone shaping so I don't need the Peavey's bells and whistles, or the super noisy fan either. The Gnome has the least noisy fan of any amp I've tried. The Gnome so far has always been loud enough. Last week we auditioned 5 drummers, all different levels of aggression with the sticks. I took the Gnome (no PA just floor monitors) with the 112 turned up high and immediately turned it down where it stayed all evening. No problems at all. Not 'shortly' but .... The Gnome gets warm in use, even at home practice levels though it doesn't get much warmer at gig levels in summer heatwaves. The metal body acts as a heatsink, helped by the fan and there is a limit to how small you can go. The inside of the amp is fairly crowded too. If you doubled the power you'd need to think about doubling the amps surface area to maintain the internal temperature

OK that sounds good Ive just bought some RCF ART745’s so how about an FRFR versus others comparison. I’ve two identical PA amps so running four speakers against the RCFs would be simple. Alternatively I could run four amps through the most neutral speaker I can find to do an amp shootout Your call

Do we want a shootout this year? In past years it hasn’t been great in the side room where the acoustics are awful. I’m thinking of trying a shootout in the main hall for maybe 20-30 mins. We could compare speakers or amps. It could then involve everyone but would disrupt normal proceedings. I could do it after lunch when you’ll be to full to move anyway 😊

I went through this process a few months back. I decided for me I wanted a tool for the job I had in mind rather than a mass of bells and whistles I wouldn’t use. I play in two bands, a four piece and a duo and I’ve never played in anything bigger than a five piece. We play small venues and mix ourselves so it is set and forget. We rarely tweak front of house once we’ve got a reasonable mix. Space on stage is always an issue. Going digital was the first decision. A small footprint stage box solves a lot of space issues and speeds set up. Being able to save settings for the next gig is brilliant and I have saved settings for both bands and for rehearsals where we have a different set up. With a four piece we needed four vocal mics, three instrument mics and we rarely mic drums but would use a three mic technique if we did. Spare channels are great but I’d never used the ten channels on my old analogue mixer in six years. Biggest issues for me were convenience, reliability and ease of use. We also wanted to go in-ears so plenty of aux channels were must haves. I went for the RCF M18. It’s tiny, has a great router unlike rivals and stunningly intuitive software. More features than I’ll ever use at a gig and it sounds good. It’s not as versatile as the Behringer, only recording in stereo but there is almost no learning curve to operate it. The software is seamless, no glitches and the things you need to hand are just where you need them. The menu structure means nothing is more than two clicks away. I looked at the Behringer X18, sound raft and Zoom as well. They all have pluses, the Behringer is seriously flexible and I liked the physical controls on the Zoom but for functionality with a small live band the M18 is a great practical solution. I like things that just work.

I’ll show you mine 😏

I'm not sure, but JBL are ridiculously overclaiming to be honest. You can't get 137db out of a 15" driver, 127db will cause permanent hearing damage in 1sec at this level and is about what you might hear close to the runway with a jet aircraft taking off never mind 137db which would involve 10x more acoustic power. The compression unit on the horn is 1.5" and power handling is going to be around 35W so the amp might be 750W but the one driving the tweeter is throttled down to 50W at least. That being said JBL are a reliable brand and make competent gear. I doubt they are much better sounding, if at all than the better Yammy's or RCF's but to be fair I haven't heard them.

That would mean a budget of £1100 if you are looking for new which gives you a bit of choice. I've always liked Yamaha as reliable and well built and I've had a couple of Yamaha's over the years. I chose the RCF's after auditioning them next to Yamahas. To me the midrange is just that little bit better so vocals come out really well. The Yammy's are still good though and I too quite like a wooden box. If your South West is anywhere near Bristol then a trip to PMT would let you hear both next to each other.

Hi Alex, you'll probably be better off in the Amps and Speakers sub forum where most of the tech nerds hang out. There's lots of experienced people there. PA doesn't really have a home unfortunately so it pops up everywhere. Do you have a budget in mind and are you looking for new or used? The good news is that PA has come on in leaps and bounds in recent years and there is lots of really capable kit at OK prices. Starting at the top firms like Yamaha, RCF, QSC are making some great kit. RCF for me are the ones to beat and even the bottom of the range are decent speakers. I've just bought a couple of used ART 745's for £1200 if that is within budget. A pair of new ART 715's will be around £1100. They've just discontinued the 3 series so there might be some bargain ART 315's coming up. If around £1000 is too much don't worry there are plenty of other choices Welcome to Basschat

You'd be better off asking @stevie about the other speakers. I just built the cab for that design and helped with the trialling, Stevie did all the design work. I'm in the middle of a run of gigs and auditions at the moment so I won't be able to look at this quickly atm.

Ortega Floor Amp Stand, Black at Gear4music

The 110T is a great choice for a first cab build. Not least because you'll end up with a great little cab at the end, they really sound good. We've called this the 'easy build' technique for a reason. It's about as simple as it gets once you have the panels cut, no harder than building a flatpack bookshelf, if you make a mistake it's simple enough to seal any gaps with mastic and you are pretty much guaranteed a working cab. Good luck with the build, I hope it goes well and I look forward to your review of your cab at the end when you get to plug it in and play. Ask away if you get stuck.

Yer tiz, where's that to then?

I don't think you'll regret that decision, except for the 2 mins it takes at either end f the gig where you have to lift them onto the stands :). My 745's are replacement for the QSC12's the singer took when she moved on. never struggled and never let us down. These should do as well and with slightly sweeter vocals too.

What you are saying is all good. Two tens can theoretically make the same sound levels whether they are in a PA speaker or in the backline. there are two provisos though. On the floor the floor actually reinforces the bass and you can't be certain the manufacturers would choose the same 10" driver. Raw bass will have a greater dynamic range than recorded bass and bass in live music is often mixed forward so it's not unreasonable to expect lower excursion from the bass driver in a PA speaker than a bass speaker. This is probably where all PA speakers aren't equal, the best ones will have the excursion. I just can't tell you the 910 is one of those and it will be beaten by the 912. I did wonder if I should point that out after I posted but you got there first The 912's are 18kg I think and quite big units. Does this still qualify as compact for you? I've actually used the 310's as a bass rig and even done a gig with just one, and that is with a drummer. The problem is that there is too much bass when they are on the floor, for bass they are better balanced up on poles. For me I know they can cope with bass as the PA at many gigs but that's how I play and mix. I roll off at 40Hz and use some gentle compression and we play pop rather than rock which all helps. the other plus is that all the mk4 Art series RCF's have really great speaker management built in to the DSP (also true of most modern PA speakers) so you can hammer them really hard with no risk of failure. There is no real one size fits all PA system and I'm currently carrying (storing mainly) 3 PA systems The 310's, RCF745's and a Wharfedale system with subs, even then I know we can't do the biggest outdoor gigs so I still can't cover 100% of the gigs we do in a year.

Ha ha I was going to suggest you buy one of those to add to your 310's as a cost efficient way of getting what you want. You'll have just a little bit more confidence with the 910's in placve of the 310's and they will probably sound a littlebetter too. The 702 will let you get a lot more out of your system when you need to and the crossover in the sub will let you push the tops a bit harder. It'll be a nice system.

I can see what Russ is saying and it is true that there is a limit to how hard you can work a 10" woofer. I'm amazed by how many options RCF offer they also offer 10's in the HD and NX series as well. It looks like they have withdrawn the 3 series though. Each one is a step up with either better bass drivers or better compression drivers or a better cab. RCF actually started out making drive units and have the luxury of being able to specify a driver for each cab. Generally you'll get bigger voice coils and hence more power handling longer voice coils and bigger magnets and hence more excursion, tighter bass and increases in volumes in return for the extra cost. I haven't had the chance to pull a 9 series apart yet so this is based only upon speculation but the 935 sounds great. So looking at what you put up for comparison, yes you have a bigger voice coil and more power handling in the 9 series so I think it looks perfectly sensible to expect an extra 3db from the 9 series. The power ratings are a nonsense, probably what the amp can do short term, I doubt the compression drivers can handle more than 30W thermal so upping the power from 100W to 350 is a nonsense. Yamaha and everyone else does the same so just take it all with a pinch of salt. The DSP won't let the amplifiers reach full power so everything is safe but it lets them tell you that you have 1000W available. So 1db difference is what you can just hear if you have two speakers next to each other. In practice it would make no difference for a gigging band. 3db is probably the minimum needed to be noticeably louder, but not by much. It's difficult to exact but as a really rough estimate if your 310's are fine for a pub with 50 people in the 910's might be good for 60-70. They probably will have better 10" drivers which will give you a little more bass handling as part of the package. Only expect marginal gains though. Only you can judge if those gains are worth £850 minus trading in your 310's Might be worth seeing if a local PMT have them in stock so you can take your 310's along and compare them

FB Marketplace for this sort of thing. You'll be picking up and able to see and test what is going to be old gear. None of the hassle of dealing remotely and getting involved with an eBay dispute. More chance of picking up a bargain too as a lot of people just use it to clear out their lofts/sheds/whatever. There's a TKO 115 for £120 when I looked yesterday.

There's one other difference between the cabs that you don't mention. Bill's is a commercial design and so you get detailed instructions and a level of support you don't get from our 'amateur designs. We can help you out on details if you get stuck but there isn't anyone full time able to do everything. 15mm was specified as the right balance between weight saving and rigidity. 18mm and 12mm are what the big sheds provide as standard. 12mm is lighter but you might get some panel resonances and need a bit more bracing. 18mm a little stiffer and you could possibly use a different bracing but we haven't tried and tested anything other than 15mm. It's not a huge risk building in either; both will work in the sense of giving you a decent sounding cab but you might need to do some fettling after you have tested it to get the absolute best out of the ply that you try. Stevie specified poplar ply for his cabs and bought high grade ply for the final iteration. Good quality 12mm hardwood ply might not be too far short in terms of performance, we just haven't tested it. The advantage of a self build is that you can choose the back panel of your choice, with an 8ohm speaker I'd always use a double socket so that I could daisy chain a second speaker but that is a choice for you. Our problem is that if we specify every component then designs become outdated as soon as one of those becomes unavailable. You can get carried away with wire. Almost anything you use will have better current carrying ability than the very fine wires used in the speaker coil and they aren't long enough to have a huge resistance. I've more or less settled on standard 42 strand copper cable but it's not unknown for me to strip out the conductors from 13A mains cable and use those if I've nothing else to hand. As to glue again don't get too hung up about it, almost any glue will be stronger than the wood. PU glue is horrible to work with and if you have gaps to fill you can always go back to them with mastic and seal them. If you use PU to bridge gaps then it loses strength. This isn't really about the right or wrong of a particular adhesive just about practical solutions. If you possibly can ring around and try and find someone to cut the six pieces that make up the cab plus the two large pieces that make the main braces. I've built many cabs using the tools you have but unless your table saw has a sliding table it's unlikely you will cut 100% accurately on your first attempt. Even that isn't the end of the world as you can fix most thigs with a lot of sanding and maybe an extra trim but that bit isn't a lot of fun, working with accurately square cut panels is fun

Sadly that is how most bands see bass. It has a function in the band of holding down the rhythm and defining the chord changes. To be fair that is what most songs call for in most genres. If someone else is soloing they really just want to know where the bass is going to be so the soloist or singer can concentrate on what they are doing and know if they get lost someone in the band is there to help them get back to where they need to be. Even if you play Jazz or Funk mostly you'll be playing a groove over a simple chord progression and with a new band you'll need to demonstrate that more than trying to duet with someone you've never met before. Good luck with the next try out you get

Hey Steve, still after more volume It’s hard to tell just from the specs how good these will be and how well they will integrate with your RCFs. They are remarkably cheap for something with what looks like a decent crossover, a power amp and 15” speaker. It’s hard to see how they could have spent much on the speaker and it is likely that it will have restricted excursion or an undersized motor system. However it is remarkable just how much some of the cheaper gear is giving you nowadays for your money. On the plus side they will allow you to get more out of your tops and our ears aren’t very sensitive to bass so it is always surprising just how much modest subs will add to your sound. If you are lucky they will have DSP protected the speakers from over excursion so you shouldn’t have to worry about pushing them. These look so like my Wharfedale subs I checked to see who owned HH, it’s actually Laney. That’s probably good news as Laney are making a lot of solid old school kit. We pulled apart a Laney PA speaker recently and it had quite a decent class A/B amp in it. For the price it sounded great. If you are lucky you might have bought an unremarkable but well priced and specced speaker. Really interested in how you get on with this in practice. Gigging up near the Somerset borders soon?

It's actually a very good question. Yes in theory, but that little chamfer wouldn't probably be enough to be significant. There are plenty of successful designs that have compromised ports but which still work well without obvious problems. It's just one of many aspects of design where there is room for disagreement. @Stevie and I disagree slightly about this and works hard to avoid any chuffing in the ports. I'm more relaxed because it has never been an issue for me at a gig and I haven't noticed it when other people are playing. The reality is that there is very little fundamental coming out of the pickups in a bass guitar so designing for really high levels of those frequencies is like designing houses for a once in a hundred year flood. It might never happen but there are ways around it, you have to consider the odds and what the consequences would be if it happens. In this case it is a bit of distortion on the loudest deepest notes if the amp is right up and you are applying lots of bass boost. WinISD calculates the port air velocity and I did look at it, it's not perfect but I tried a range of port sizes for you and this is the biggest port that easily fits in your cab. Any bigger would reduce the chance of wind noise but would mean constructing a port longer than the cab is deep. That means either a folded port with other problems or changing the shape of the cab so your 19" amp would overhang. When we were discussing this Stevie was able to demonstrate chuffing at very low power in one of my older designs. This was with a test signal at 50hz and I think around 20W. That's alarming but I never heard any chuffing in use from that cab before or after that cab. That's the day we found that one big port is less prone to chuffing than four little ones. My ports still tend to be smaller than Stevie's but I'm now much more likely to use a single port and as big as possible. So there isn't an absolutely right answer to this, all designs are compromised and different designers worry about different issues. I'm not anticipating that this will be a problem for you.

Looks like @stevie and @Chienmortbbhave answered your questions. If you look at the crossover it has two parts. The one to the horn which matches it's output to a single bass driver, it wouldn't match the increased output from two bass units. The bass section doesn't match two units because the combined impedance would be 4ohms not the 8ohms it was designed for. You could do a version that John alluded to. A 112 and a 112T with the problems that he mentions that the 112 operating without a crossover would have midrange output that would 'interfere' with the carefully controlled midrange of the 112T. That's not to say that it might not sound nice, just that the sound would be unpredictable. If I wanted to go that route I'd build two cabs, one with the horn and one without. You'd effectively have the FRFR/hi fi sound of the 112TMk3 with the old school sound of the 112 with the possibility of increased output and a third sound when the cabs are combined. We never tested this but I'm like John/Chienmortbb on this, it might sound quite nice. As to the port, well you could simply shift this to the central position but retaining all the dimensions of the cab I gave you. It would certainly help brace the cab. Personally I don't like the symmetry of that arrangement, with both speakers the same distance from the port any resonances would be likely to sum. Like so many decisions in cab design there are wins and losses to be made. You asked for a slot port but actually a round port of the same area would be better. Turbulence in the port causes chuffing at high volumes. You get turbulence at the edge of the port because the surface causes friction in the air movement. A round port has the minimum outside edge for a given cross section so reduces turbulence. That's why I don't like the narrow vertical ports some designs use and put the port on the bottom. It's also easy to construct that way.

Good advice, it may also be something trivial like a broken wire or an internal connector come loose. A bit like replacing a car because the fuel line is blocked. Find out what is wrong first, then decide.