EBS_freak

A challenge of challenging proportions nonetheless.

I think the challenge of having a more affordable line is certainly a challenge - so much to think about in terms of perception of the instrument, impact on the value of existing instruments and their potential resale rate, the perception of the brand itself etc. I'm not really sure who has managed to do it properly - I remember Fodera and their line of more affordable bases (I think they were made in Japan?) - and I for one was thinking - well, they are certainly cheaper but they aren't a Fodera. But then again, I don't really get the Fodera thing anyway. Lakland are the only brand that I can think of where they have managed to do it... maybe Sadowsky... I don't think people perceive the Skyline and Metro series as lesser instruments than the full fat models. Mind you, I'm guessing that they shift a lot more of these series of instruments than the top series... whereas the smaller luthier probably wants those figures the other way around. Difficult one.

But they haven't mastered tolex adhesive, handles that don't fall apart or feet that don't fall off?

I've played too many drunken weddings to know that the design is a bad idea. Would be good to feedback to the developers!

And to think that speaker inside costs all of about £50 trade.

Mmm. Danley. Sorry, I'm still having a moment!

Quite - manufacturers have been booted from other forums for ridiculing other manufacturers. It's a pretty lame thing to do.

Everybody has their reasons for being there - all valid of course!

I would never buy one of these Mark Audio things based on one thing. Too easy for somebody to be a prick and poke their fingers into the speaker cones.

Mmm. Danley. When I bought my last rig I nearly went Danley... til I saw saw the weights. Having said that, the rig above seems quite manageable in terms of size and weight. But then again, I was working around a TH18. What we really want is a Jehrico coming in a 20kg

Yeah - but they are made of unicorn poo!

They probably do bat an eye - it's just that the Aguilar name is nowhere near as prevalent as the Barefaced name round these parts.

Brex.... :-p If you were Aguilar and you could price it that high and it still sells... you'd slash the prices...?

Like LEDs :-p

I don't think there would be anybody willing to disclose prices in a public forum as they tend to be negotiated directly with the organisers. There's the "price" and then there's the "price". About orders - that's kinda what I was referring to above. Some luthiers already have a healthy stock of orders and additional interest stemmed from a show could flood them. I see that Status were notably missing this year - I guess they don't need to be there. I guess they are also in the lucky position that if they ever need a cash injection, they just release a new take on the King bass and they'll hear the sound of multiple lawyers and bankers opening their wallets. Working a show is very hard work - typically, there's the van hire, the parking, the booking of hotels for Friday and Saturday night, the load in, the load out, the eating out costs, the cost of the stand itself, the cost of power to the stand, the cost of printing any leaflets and business cards. Some exhibitors will clearly make a loss or find it hard to justify being there... especially if their orders are already looking healthy. Some guys of course, just love the social aspect of exhibiting - I am guessing people like the Aguilar guys and Sheldon Dingwall fall into this camp - but it also gives them chance to catch up with the players, distributors etc... and see a different part of the world for a while under "business expenses".

Hofner. But that's for all the people that want to play at being Macca I guess.

Agreed - theres a fine line. Fender have done it great that the Squier is not a Fender - but is overseen by the Fender powerhouse. As for the luthier, yeah, I'm guessing that theres definitely the risk of damaging the brand. I'm not even sure that it has worked for Lakland with their Skyline series. The skyline series is pretty much Lakland and the US stuff is just expesnive Laklands that people dont really buy. Different is I guess, is that with the Skylines, that is more a box shifting model... whereas for cheaper luthier built basses, there's still the whole hands on element which then brings the more expensive range into question as to whether it's worth the money or the more affordable range are just a pale imitation. Difficult.

Its always a fine line... and the end of the day, the amp manufacturers are there for one reason. To help sell amps. If people can't try the amps, then they won't sell. If the amp manufacturers aren't given a chance for them to run their rigs at volume, there isn't really any point of them being there. If they aren't there, the show organisers aren't going to have any exhibitors or income. No exhibitors, no income, no show. Ultimately, the exhibitors are the one with the power - if they aren't satisfied with the ability to show off their wares or realise an increase in revenue that can be traced back to them being at the show, they simply won't book a stand again... hence why some notable names may be missing... or they simply because they don't need to be there.

A lot of people find that FRFRs are lacking in mids - usually because bass cabs are heavily coloured in this area. If your FRFR cab isn't doing it for you - its probably down to the model of the cab not being as forward in the mids as you'd expect. I would wager that you should be looking at the low mids as opposed to the bass - bass cabs aren't actually as bassy as you would think.

Just get making in your spare time and get it all refined. You have to learn through trial and error - also, repairing other basses I guess. There is no one method for building instruments- that's what makes each luthier interesting. You only have to look at the jigs for putting a radius on a neck for example. Each luthier has their different approaches - I absolutely adore Schack's take on the neck join for example. You may find some of the luthier groups on facebook interesting - there's lots of novel ideas shared on there.

In reality, most independent luthiers aren't hitting minimum wage - but what they don't earn in money, they have a job which many, love doing. Its interesting to see how many luthiers have come out of the rat race as they realised that they were ultimately unfulfilled doing the 9 to 5.

If you want loads of sub 56 hz coming out of your PA, guarantee your mix is going to be sounding pants anyway. Bearing in mind you rarely hear the fundamental of your bass guitar anyway (more the harmonics), only going down to 56 hz is certainly not a bad thing for bass monitoring purposes - or out front for that matter. Anything lower is going to be eating up loads of power and for very little reward.

Worth mentioning that FRFR with passive cabs is a bit of a BS game... (many passive cabs claim to be flat response but are far from it) but with DSP in place, particularly the cabs with DSP and power amps built in, the deficiencies of the cabs in terms of not having a flat response, pretty much anything can be made flat. Then it becomes more about the speakers that are being used and whether they can handle the volumes at each of the frequencies that are being demanded from it. As charic says, bass amps are designed to be coloured... as are some bass amps... that is is why some cabs work with some amps and not others... and vice versa. You don't really have the same challenges with FRFR. If the model is pants, its going to sound pants through all FRFR cabs. I wouldn't agree FRFR = top end speaker. It's more about being uncoloured and full range and flat response hence FRFR.

Umm. I don't really get that quote. Perhaps he's operating on a different level to me...

The whole point of FRFR is that it is transparent and hence adds no colour. So in this case - it sounds like a valve amp through an 8x10. If you take the speaker emulation off and put the amp emulation through a real 8x10, it should sound the same as the real thing too. Likewise if you took the speaker emulation off and use the FRFR, it would sound thinner - because the colouring of the 8x10 isn't being added.