EBS_freak

Colour me interested. Looking to hear about the results.

[quote name='MacDaddy' timestamp='1495478787' post='3304087'] The folks at Xvive asked for a video of the U2 not working properly. Fortunately this very thing was available from a Junkyard Dogs gig. I sent it to them, so watch this space. [/quote] Good that you managed to get it on video - things like this are usually impossible to capture!

Wooks - you may find these interesting... http://www.accugroovellc.com/venti From the guys that bought you the 4/8 ohm cab 20 Hz - 20 kHz (±0.5 dB)

Hello! What bass are you playing with? Active/passive?

I'm pretty sure that has never been mentioned, so yeah, cool.

Lots of parallel surfaces. Check. You pretty much nailed it there - but lets not forget the hollow stage! Come to think of it, the support band may have sounded bigger due to the amount of reflections everywhere. Wooks- was the separation between instruments as distinct for both bands?

Cool venue - although the speaker alignment on the right could do with some work 😜 Without being there, I wouldn't want to comment too much, but with a decent PA, there's no reason why you couldn't make the second band sound as authoritative as the first. There's less open mics on stage for starters, so you'd get an increase in your headroom before feedback. I'm guessing you would have heard a lot of bleed from the kit in this size venue and situation - especially from the cymbals and snare. I wouldn't like to say for sure (equipment limiting) but there shouldn't have been any reason why the sound guy couldn't have made those without backline sound as big as the the guys with. At the end of the day, it's only about shifting air... Aha - fellow Kemper user - you do realise that you can use the monitor out without any modelling (so you get the sound of your profile and then the sound of the cab is provided by the cab itself) and send your main out to FOH - and that would have the cab emulation on it...? Again, if you want to hear the same as front of house as you can (that's assuming no tweaking of your sound at the desk... which is bound to happen anyway), you are right to look at FRFR.

Oh dear.

I concur. Were there any drums?

I'm guessing this was at a fairly small venue and you were standing close to the stage? If you think about a stadium gig (and yes, I do realise I am probably going the polar opposite there), the fact whether there is backline or not, is irrelevant as you won't hear it over the FOH PA anyway. In a small venue, you aren't going to get any bleed from the backline if there isn't any... but I would also wager there is no front fills meaning that the only sound you are hearing are from the L and R FOH which may be too far away from your (and off axis ) for you to get the full benefit of what they are doing. If there were subs and front fill in front of you, there's no reason why these guys (sorry, I'm not aware of your work) should be ripping your face out with the PA. It seriously sounds like the venue isn't best suited to that band - at the moment. No smaller venue bothers with front fill due to the amount of bleed from the stage... and it's why sometimes the vocals in small venues sound a bit lacking. I believe as the trend towards modelling gains momentum, more venues will be looking at installing front fill speakers (if they care, that is). Just a quick question though Wooks - are you looking at introducing some colour in to your tone (maybe a speaker emulation) - as you may find a FRFR solution a bit lacking if you are used to hearing the colourisation you get from traditional speakers and cabs?

Should probably clarify I mean standard boxes vs Bose line array (or any other line array in that price range really). My experience has shown me that array systems are pretty disappointing in smaller venues. K-Array seem the best - and are certainly way ahead of the competition - however, the dispersion is still narrow, so for most applications, unless you are playing some very large venues, standard boxes will serve you better than an array.

[quote name='three' timestamp='1493746225' post='3290408'] Bow re-sprayed the neck on my Status SII after it developed that characteristically milky look at the fretboard edges. The quality is nothing short of brilliant. Realistic prices for an incredibly professional job - easy to work with too. I've been told (but can't confirm) that Bow were the original finishers for Status. Mine's an early one so the neck may have been re-finished by the people that sprayed it in the first place (sort of nice if true) [/quote] This is correct -they were indeed the original spray guys for Status.

I'm not saying that they don't... It would be interesting to hear the difference between similar priced non Bose vs Bose setups though. Just to clarify, the F1s will take bass. The comment around being lacking in bass is around the L1s.

This may provide some inspiration. PA cab +

Funnily enough, that is probably the one situation where I would recommend somebody getting such a setup... based on the fact that it is small and portable and will do a compromised job OK. The top is bright - but comes with a lot of distortion. Makes for tired ears for the listeners - and yes, there is that big mid dip. The system, if not used correctly,will feed back as you say, as it subscribes to the same laws of physics as everything else. The tonematch mixer gives you very little to work with to combat feedback though!

A TC Helicon with feedback suppression is not the answer. Tune your PA to the room and a great deal of your feedback issues will disappear. If you want to use feedback suppression devices, best to do it on your main outputs, not your pre you PA preamps. I'm a big convert in ditching the amp/cab thing and letting the PA do the work. Everything out front just sounds much, much nicer... and at the end of the day, thats what we want the punters to hear isn't it?

Gosh, there's that marketing in play again - although to be fair, it depends upon which system you are talking about. So, the L1s... Yeah, they are sold on this whole premise that you don't need monitors either - and you can have the speakers behind you so you can hear yourself. (and do you really want foh volumes rushing directly past your ears?) Spoiler - they still feedback like any other system! The new Bose systems, the F1 - well, A/B them against any comparably priced system and let me know what you think! To be fair to Bose, their marketing game has been strong on the F1... but whether it actually holds water... well, I've probably already said too much in this thread already on that front. Don't want it derailing again. *Apologies if anybody with Bose gear takes offence*

Those Bose Line arrays are no potent enough for bass to use in a band environment... unless it's acoustic.

RE:TKS - they may sound nice with guitars - but they certainly aren't FRFR - and running the risk of having my head bitten off, neither is the BigTwin2. I honestly think that if you want a true FRFR, you are looking at having a cab with inbuilt DSP to make it flat... or at least having an external processing device pre your power amps to make the signal to your cab as flat response as it can.

This is one of the problems that I have with FRFR cabs in general - they appear to be very guitar focused - so I can expect them to be not very happy with them having the lows that you would normally out from a bass. This is why cabs like that cab I'm seemingly not allowed to mention (the one with the low crossover point and the super high quality drivers in an abs case) seem to fit the bill well, along with cabs like the Yamaha DXR15. I don't know anybody having experience of the FR800 as a FRFR for both guitar and bass... but it has been mentioned numerous times as being suitable for bass. How it would cope with guitars - I am interested in, as the HF horn is very important as to whether a FRFR with a guitar sound sharp or smooth. I see FRFR speakers for bass having the same requirement as PA. If you wouldn't run your bass hard through your, say, vocal PA speakers, without fear of them imploding, then you wouldn't want to use those speakers for the basis of a FRFR solution.

I am trying to - but I am not having somebody take pot shots at me without the right to reply.

Be careful of that back! I would suggest you go for a lighter weight option if you can. Don't be in a hurry to drill into you cabs - a dolly board with a tensioner strap will help you should you need to sell your gear at any point (to go lighter) - any mods could put off potential buyers. If you do need to mod your cab, the removable wheels are probably the best shout for minimal impact. Remember, if you mount the wheels on the bottom of the cabs, you will change the sound of them as the sound won't couple the same (which may or may not be preferable).

Boom. For the record, there are plenty of threads involving BF that I choose to say nothing in - why? Because I have zero interest in them - like a lot of other threads on the forum. This thread caught my interest, as it's regarding FRFR. As a Kemper user, I am keen to hear how the BF FR800 performs. In fact, if you look through the thread, I even stated that the OP should try and get one from BF to try. The thread took a different direction, as many threads do... and hence the conversations started. Again, bar the feet and handle thing, which is a bit of a forum in joke, just like Ashdowns catching fire... I think I have been very fair in the thread and I am confused as to where, again, apart from the handles and feet comments, seen where I have made derisory comments. If it would make you feel better, I could share the love and go on about how Sandberg file their frets too deep on the upper frets, or maybe how Status built me an crappy neck and refused to take responsibility for it... how about the fact that EBS have cheapened all their hardware and coverings to pinch pennies? These are all valid observations and as a potential customer, I am entitled to make such comments. I have never said that nobody should buy a BF. Nor would I ever. The marketing claims is not recent - the whole "2 of our speakers equals 1 of our competitors" has stood for a long time. That's just one example. I could continue. A similar conversation on BC debunked the 4ohm/8ohm switch on another popular cabinet - which was proven to be utter BS. If people make some hefty claims, they will be questioned. Similarly, if people make cabs, where the handles and feet fall off, they will be questioned. People did it for Skoda, Alfa and Lancia for being total rust buckets, why would any other product be immune? PS - you state that it was aimed at nobody in particular - and then said you were then aiming it me and several others. Well done Geoff. Slow clap.

Your games won't get a rise out of me.

I dunno, you did a fair bit of research when choosing your wireless...?