EBS_freak

http://basschat.co.uk/topic/208208-in-ear-monitoring/ Thread crossover alert. Interesting link to A&H ME-1 use featured.

[quote name='WalMan' timestamp='1369208020' post='2086175'] Fair enough. It's the only one I know/knew [/quote] Here you go... Check this out... http://www.allen-heath.com/uk/News/Pages/NewsDetail.aspx?NewsId=672 This is where the monitor break out systems come into their own... A set up like that would require 56 output busses... The sensible choice is therefore the monitoring systems... But even so, that's 14ks worth of gear on stage just for getting the audio to each player. On top of that is the cost of the desk of the master desk to send such audio and earphones for each player. Wowsers... They aren't the type of systems you'll find down the Dog and Duck :-p

[quote name='mike257' timestamp='1369172918' post='2085942'] Yeah, I'm made up! It's more than capable for our purposes (5 piece function band mixing own sound from stage) and although recording types will tell you the preamps are a weak spot I think they perform more than adequately in a live setting. I'd been looking at analogue options but was struggling to stretch our budget as far as an A&H MixWizard (which was my first choice). That probably would have had the edge in terms of mic pres and EQ but costs upwards of 500 quid on the s/h market. I can bodge together a phone/tablet remote by connecting the 01v to my laptop and sending midi over WiFi from an app on my phone so can nip out the front during soundchecks to mix too. The only problem will be teaching my resolutely non-techy bandmates how to drive it! [/quote] Perfect. The quality of preamps are of less importance in a live situation compared to recording. In fact you are more likely to hear the shortcomings in your in ear buds!

[quote name='WalMan' timestamp='1369173660' post='2085961'] Make sure[list] [*]you have a good means of providing your own tailored monitor mix with something like the Aviom units. I used to run a bit of bass, my b vox, kick & snare & the merest smidge of lead vox & guitrar [/list] [/quote] To people reading this - Aviom is by no means the only way of getting a good tailored monitor mix and its a pretty expensive option. It can be less versatile than running auxes from the desk as typically digital desks will have greater control over the output audio than the Aviom. Whilst these systems such as Aviom, ME-1 and say the Powerplay systems are great for a high number of discrete monitor mixes, for smaller groups, aux sends with control via say an iPad may work better for you. Don't be led into thinking that such systems are the only way of achieving great IEM mixes.

[quote name='Twigman' timestamp='1369145215' post='2085401'] I wonder what Mr Hall is doing about these: [url="http://www.musicstore.de/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity/WFS/MusicStore-MusicStoreShop-Site/de_DE/-/EUR/ViewParametricSearch-SimpleOfferSearch?SearchParameter=%26%40QueryTerm%3D*%26CategoryUUIDLevelX%252F6OTVqHzpu7YAAAEZ63gtK5qL%252FsUPVqHzpVKQAAAEZOApFop40%3DHhnVqHzpNRgAAAEZwwlFop40%26CategoryUUIDLevelX%252F6OTVqHzpu7YAAAEZ63gtK5qL%3DsUPVqHzpVKQAAAEZOApFop40%26CategoryUUIDLevelX%3D6OTVqHzpu7YAAAEZ63gtK5qL%26ManufacturerName%3DCareer"]http://www.musicstor...erName%3DCareer[/url] [/quote] They are OK, the plastic plate on the headstock goes the other way John Hall should go after Encores too... afterall, they sound sh*t too... so they've obviously copied Rickenbacker.

The original O1V - wow, I played in a band where they had that desk for a bit. It's pretty capable if I recall. £160 is an absolute steal for that - if I came across one for sale at that, I'd defo buy it, especially with the ADAT card. Nice find.

No. I've never been so serious.

...to selling a Kingbass?

Micing up the audience, or using ambient mics to give them their common name when using IEMs is not something new. A lot of pro setups use this to remove the isolation they experience. You have found out quickly the main gotchas - in order to hear everything properly, everything has to miced... the full kit, every instrument and the vocals. No getting around it... if your buds are good, they are gonna cut so much ambient sound, you'll need to add it to your ears via the mix. As for the drums, a decent overhead and a bass and snare drum mic should be enough... but it may not be enough for the drummer... you shall have to have a play to see how it works out best for everybody. I tend to mic the whole kit if the room is big enough - purely because its sounds better through the PA than not. One of the things we have found as a band is that talking to each other can be a bit problematic - but it's the drummer that leads the gig so for example if he chooses to reorder the setlist on the fly or anything like that, it can be difficult to lip read what he is saying. The solution? Like the audience mic, he has a mic that is sent to auxes only and not the front of house. It can also be quite amusing to hear what he has to say if anybody screws up mid song! I read somewhere that the Dave Matthews bands each have seperate wireless lavlier mics especially for on stage communication so they can talk to each other through the monitor feeds. Pretty pricey... but also pretty awesome. ACS have a solution for the isolation problem with their "live" series. The ear buds have mics in them and with the live pack, you can mix in ambient sounds as received by these mics within the ear pieces. I say "have a solution", they still haven't hit the market yet... but it's going to be "soon"... but it has been "soon" for considerable time! There is another company who have this sort of approach - I forget their name at the moment but there is a DJ who is posting regularly about them on his blog. (EDIT: found it - [url="http://serato.com/forum/discussion/325426"]http://serato.com/fo...scussion/325426[/url] / [url="http://www.sensaphonics.com/?p=363"]http://www.sensaphonics.com/?p=363[/url]) There is also a mic system at [url="http://dreamearz.com/products.php"]http://dreamearz.com/products.php[/url] but I'm kinda perplexed why they stopped with only one mic. Sense of position/direction is one of the big advantages of running mics in your ears... but they decided to go mono anyway... ? I'm looking forward to getting the ACS "live" option as the odd time, somebody has come up to me and tried to shout in my ear. Of course, the regularity of this depends upon the gig - on a theatre stage, the chances of this happening is near enough nil... but play a wedding, you are bound to get the odd person come up to you. Just remembered - Audio Technica also has the feature to plug in a mic for ambient sound on their M2 and M3 packs. I can't remember off the top of my head whether this is mono or stereo - I've not used that feature when I tried out the Audio Technica M3 but maybe Gunsfreddy has used this feature on his M2. Stick with it though, you'll get used to them before not too long. If you are liking the quality of the transmission to your ears, you are more than half way there. If you like the idea of playing along with a CD, this really is the route to go. The rest of it is getting the mix right - although due to be a shared mix, this may always be a bit of a compromise. For example, in my band, I really like lots of bass drum and a really compressed snare (for obv reasons) with tons of bass guitar and shed loads of my own vocal. Conversely, the lead singer likes to hear not much band but loads of everybody's vocals. Chrismanbass hits the nail on the head... you will eventually want to go to a digital based mixer - and no doubt you'll be wanting that QU16 sooner rather than later! That Yamaha is a good option for the right money although out of 8 auxes, 4 will most likely be used for fx processing - which you must make use of if you are going to make the most of your digital desk... (4 mono auxes will probably be enough for you... but running a stereo rig, I must admit that I like the stereo image in my head... gives for a more natural sound) There's no getting around it, if you want to do IEMs properly, you'll need to drop the cash. As to how much you want to get towards a perfect solution... well, I guess that depends upon budget. For me, I decided it was the route I wanted to take... hence my investment in the digital desk, the T1 Lives, the PSM900 and when it comes out, I am hoping the ambient pack from ACS will be the absolute icing on the cake. So depending on how you look at things, I could actually gig without a rig now... it's just there for visual purposes. The preamp on my GLD80 is far superior than you'll get on any bass amp... and I can control that off an iPad that is mounted to my stand. All I need is a DI box into the stage box... job done. I love my inears... can't you tell?!

I have a few Heil mics. PR20 and PR22 (both UT cos you don't need all the accessories) are both superb mics and certainly outperform the SM58 and Beta in my opinion. Using the Shures as a bench mark, The Heils have a nice smooth top end and a more focused bottom end than the Shure. The feedback rejection is also spot on - defo a worthwhile purchase. I also have a PR35... they are the dog's danglies on vocals. Sounds lovely.

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' timestamp='1368799769' post='2081703'] Thomann use that size box for half a dozen plectrums and a pack of strings on the other hand Ashdown cabs sound like they are still in the box! [/quote] Ha ha - so true - you should have seen the size of the box that my mixing desk came in.... my neighbours thought that I'd had a house delivered to my house.

Aha. I see the Berg won!

What's with the Fragile labels? I thought these cabs were meant to be tough?

The Soundcraft Expression is a beautiful piece of kit - I'd probably take that over the Behringer X32 - but for the 32 channel it's abount 1k more expensive. 1k buys you 4 Behringer P16s... Hmm...

Who is this grandad clown reviving these old threads?

Woo! Talk about thread archeaology.

[quote name='alexclaber' timestamp='1368622480' post='2079305'] Or something you haven't seen yet! And like you say, tone is down to personal preference - one of our earliest Big Baby T customers had a fault with his cabs and they had to come back for repair. [b]He said: "[font=arial, sans-serif][size=3]Been having nightmares about having to use the [/size][/font][font=arial, sans-serif][size=3]Bergantino[/size][/font][font=arial, sans-serif][size=3]'s , that must [/size][/font][/b][font=arial, sans-serif][size=3][b]surely say something for your creations !" [/b] [/size][/font] [/quote] He may have been very protective of his Bergs and was wary about scuffing the Bergs up at the local jam night where all the knuckle draggers abuse the house band gear.

[quote name='thumperbob 2002' timestamp='1368611786' post='2079097'] I can see that a cool 32 channel desk is great for those big- hired in rigs, but for a jobbing group the Mackie with 16 channels is pretty awesome- and the thing is tiny- and light. I myself would prefer real faders, but I no longer have to mix onstage so no problem there. [/quote] The point is, I think the large format mixers are becoming less popular. It's all about smaller, portable, lighter desks with layered faders. High channel count on a small format frame is now entirely possible. In fact, you can do away with a console altogether - have a search for Camryn's Allen and Heath rig on YouTube and you'll see what I mean. As for the Mackie, agreed, it's a brilliant piece of kit - and I say it again, the Mackie guys would uber clean up if they did a 24 or 32 channel version of their iPad mixer. All those jobbing soul bands who mike up a brass section, backing singers... full kit... etc... if they could get that under 1.5k and undercut the X32, Mackie would have it.

[quote name='Skol303' timestamp='1368607391' post='2079019'] Indeed! And could be updated/expanded at less cost than a hardware desk. I honestly think such products are going to become 'the norm' in future, just as how software DAWs, synths and plug-ins are now a feature of every studio. Hardware and analogue gear will always rightly have its place. But the march of progress waits for nobody... [/quote] True. You only have to see what is happening to the resale price on analogue desks. All the hire companies are currently offloading before they hit rock bottom... It's crazy to think that I can do the same (even more) with my GLD80 than most touring band setups with their 32 channel desks and stacks of outboard.

The Berg cabs that I have tried are great and Genz are great. You can do no wrong with either. Both are made well and sound great... they sound different but both are top cabs - you'll have to trial them to see which you prefer naturally. I'm awaiting the arrival of the new Berg cabs to try but the NeoX212T would be my Genz choice of cab. They sound worlds apart from the EBS you have at the moment - mainly down to the tweeter. Have you not considered the 2x12 EBS Neo? I reckon it's the best cab that they have ever done. Defo worth adding to the melting pot. At this level, there is no better, just different.

[quote name='crez5150' timestamp='1368555689' post='2078539'] Just ordered the new Allen and Heath Qu - 16.... Ipad control on this too.... quite nice for sorting the mix when I'm setting up on my own [/quote] You'll love the multitrack recording - great for live recordings to mix later - I'm hoping they will include this functionality in the GLD80 in the next firmware update. The Dante card is really appealing but quite expensive... but then... wow the channel count! I may be biased but having done a lot of research, I reckon Allen and Heath have got the digital desk thing nailed, right from the QU16 right up to the iLive series. It's just staggeringly good - and has transformed the ease of setting up and getting a great sound every gig. The onboard fx for processing the kit alone is amazing...

[quote name='Skol303' timestamp='1368604579' post='2078984'] For a mere £13,000 you could always go 'Super Size' with one of these: [url="http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/may13/articles/raven.htm"]http://www.soundonso...icles/raven.htm[/url] [/quote] Stops the dust in the sliders issue I guess!

[quote name='arthurhenry' timestamp='1368554627' post='2078521'] Is this[u] really[/u] better than reaching out and moving a slider or turning a knob? [/quote] Yes. And on digital mixers you move sliders not knobs.

Nice one. Youll love it.

Of course... what we all really want is one of these.... [url="http://www2.solidstatelogic.com/#&panel1-1&panel2-1"]http://www2.solidstatelogic.com/#&panel1-1&panel2-1[/url]