Head for a Barefaced Super Twelve T - Which one?

[ajerthebadger]

Hello hello,

After having to sell my TC RH450 I am now looking for a new head.

I have a Barefaced Super Twelve T coming next week and I'd like to get a head so I can use it.

I am looking for a more vintage style sound. I recently bought a Marcus Miller Jazz bass and play alt rock so something valve pre amped/powered would be nice.

I've read that these cabs are LOUD but I'm not sure at what wattage. I'd be looking for atleast 500 watts as 250 was no where near enough (used the RH450 and RS210C cab).

Can only really spend about 300 so I'd be looking secondhand.

Any recommendations?

Cheers

AJ

[Colledge]

if you could stretch the budget a little further, you could get the obligatory terror bass, vintage tone in lumps the size of a house.
there have also been alot of good things said about the hartke lh500 which is in the budget, though i can't vouch for it myself.

[Musicman20]

That amp head is SUPER loud. Seriously, Ive tried a lot. The TC amp is more like 600-700 'Markbass watts'. It will push and push.

If you want something still vintage and ultra loud, you are probably in the right ball park with a LH500, but it will not be louder than the RH450.

The very thing stopping you getting a lot of volume is speakers.

Ive tried the RH450 into a 4x10 (8 ohm) a few times and it is very loud.

If you want serious volume then you need a lot of speakers! That BF cab will be loud, but 2x12s can only do so much. If you need a lot more volume than a 2x12, you need a large high end 4x10 or 6x10.....even a 4x12.

I play in a hardcore punk band btw, so I know what you mean by loud

[ajerthebadger]

I think you need to have a read of the Barefaced website.

They say that at higher volumes (plus 250watts) the Super Twelve will be louder than a 4x10.

Obviously I havent heard it myself but quite a few people that own them say they are deafeningly loud.

The RH450 was good but I was trying to make sure the beer fund was replenished before uni starts and I didnt need all that amp.

I was looking at the LH500, many a good thing been said about them and they go for stupid money too.

Thanks for the recommendations.

AJ

Edited September 7, 2010 by ajerthebadger

[Musicman20]

[quote name='ajerthebadger' post='948319' date='Sep 7 2010, 02:15 PM']I think you need to have a read of the Barefaced website.

They say that at higher volumes (plus 250watts) the Super Twelve will be louder than a 4x10.

Obviously I havent heard it myself but quite a few people that own them say they are deafeningly loud.

The RH450 was good but I was trying to make sure the beer fund was replenished before uni starts and I didnt need all that amp.

I was looking at the LH500, many a good thing been said about them and they go for stupid money too.

Thanks for the recommendations.

AJ[/quote]

Ive read the site, and yes some 2x12s ARE louder than 4x10s, but it depends what 4x10

If we are talking highend 2x12s VS highend 4x10s, the 4x10 will win. It will not have as compressed a sound when you dig in or slap at high volumes.

If we are talking a highend 2x12 vs a cheaper 4x10, the 2x12 might be louder.

There are tons of thread on Talkbass about this, with people who play a lot of gigs and are much older than myself. One chap who has both the Berg AE212 and AE410 said he reached the limit of his 2x12 at a gig, but it still sounded great, whereas the 4x10 would still have room and volume.

If the RH450 was too much of an investment, I can see your point, and the LH500 is a good solid simple amp. Not amazing, but damn good for the money. Ive borrowed one on tour and its loud.

[51m0n]

LH500

For the beer tokens its the beans.

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=99358&hl=ae410"]I have compared a Super12T pushed by an LH500 against a MBsa450 pushing a Berg ae410. [/url]

Both VERY loud. Didnt have a dB meter and the object was not to see which was the out and out loudest rig, both crushed a loud drummer and guitarist though.

If you need more volume you need to get involved in drag racing....

[Ghost_Bass]

What about a Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0? :brow: A big bit off your budget but would cope with that speaker just fine. I'm on your opposite side, have a 9.0 on it's way from the states and still trying to decide between a Midget T and a Supertwelve T... you could have a go at the 9er and let me know how they sound together

Cheers

[Musicman20]

[quote name='51m0n' post='948354' date='Sep 7 2010, 03:03 PM']LH500

For the beer tokens its the beans.

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=99358&hl=ae410"]I have compared a Super12T pushed by an LH500 against a MBsa450 pushing a Berg ae410. [/url]

Both VERY loud. Didnt have a dB meter and the object was not to see which was the out and out loudest rig, both crushed a loud drummer and guitarist though.

If you need more volume you need to get involved in drag racing....[/quote]

Agreed, most decent 2x12 should be more than ANYONE really needs. But some people need insane amounts of volume, low end, and punch, and that would require a really quality 4x10, or even 6x10.

I use different 2x12s, and I agree, they are very loud. Even the TC RS212 is VERY loud, and at the old prices an absolute bargain.

Its more, as I understand from other reviews, to do with 'pushing your cab to its limits' and the sound compressing. Pushing a 2x12 every gig at its limits is not ideal. A 2x12 will only do so much. If you play a 5 string bass in a very heavy doom band, I would want more than a 2x12. I dont, so im alright

Edited September 7, 2010 by Musicman20

[51m0n]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='948377' date='Sep 7 2010, 03:17 PM']Agreed, most decent 2x12 should be more than ANYONE really needs. But some people need insane amounts of volume, low end, and punch, and that would require a really quality 4x10, or even 6x10.

I use different 2x12s, and I agree, they are very loud. Even the TC RS212 is VERY loud, and at the old prices an absolute bargain.

Its more, as I understand from other reviews, to do with 'pushing your cab to its limits' and the sound compressing. Pushing a 2x12 every gig at its limits is not ideal. A 2x12 will only do so much. If you play a 5 string bass in a very heavy doom band, I would want more than a 2x12. I dont, so im alright [/quote]

Surely the people in these 'very loud doom bands' are using a chuffing ENORMOUS PA to create the 'volume singularity'(tm)* fix they need?

In which case huge stage volume is utter pants anyway....

* 'volume singularity'(tm) = A noise so immensely loud that you are unable to perceive anything else around you - it 'sucks in' all other sound

[Musicman20]

[quote name='51m0n' post='948386' date='Sep 7 2010, 03:23 PM']Surely the people in these 'very loud doom bands' are using a chuffing ENORMOUS PA to create the 'volume singularity'(tm)* fix they need?

In which case huge stage volume is utter pants anyway....

* 'volume singularity'(tm) = A noise so immensely loud that you are unable to perceive anything else around you - it 'sucks in' all other sound[/quote]

Yep, their onstage volume is immense. Most decent 2x12s are more than enough. I dont know how they deal with those insane volumes!

A DOOM expert will be along shortly to describe how DOOM volumes operate (eg two 4x12s).

[Colledge]

[quote name='51m0n' post='948386' date='Sep 7 2010, 03:23 PM']Surely the people in these 'very loud doom bands' are using a chuffing ENORMOUS PA to create the 'volume singularity'(tm)* fix they need?

In which case huge stage volume is utter pants anyway....

* 'volume singularity'(tm) = A noise so immensely loud that you are unable to perceive anything else around you - it 'sucks in' all other sound[/quote]

on the contrary, in old friend of mine was in a (imo utter crap) was in a hardcore / sludge / whatever band and they where seriously loud but didnt even have a pa system... the singer used a marshall half stack for vocals...

it was as bad as you imagine.

[gafbass02]

I must admit I don't get it either. I've played some HUGE places and not needed the power I had cause of the monitoring, and at a normal sized venue I'm near enough to amp to either not need monitors, or just a smidge. Even at backline only gigs the most I used was the old trace stack vs 2x100 watt Marshall heads and 4 4x12"'s in a very long pub. And that was with a pretty loud band. In Balance of Silence, (loud metal) the trace was still overkill T
The BFB recently proved it could fill a room easily too in a six piece albeit loungefly so not full on rawk much less DOOM!

Edited September 7, 2010 by gafbass02

[umph]

considered going for a pre/power set up?

[chris_b]

[quote name='ajerthebadger' post='948285' date='Sep 7 2010, 01:45 PM']...I am looking for a more vintage style sound. I recently bought a Marcus Miller Jazz bass and play alt rock so something valve pre amped/powered would be nice. I've read that these cabs are LOUD but I'm not sure at what wattage. I'd be looking for atleast 500 watts....[/quote]
You haven't bought a very vintage sounding bass, but a used Ampeg SVT3PRO (with valve pre) will get you into the ballpark. Basically any Ampeg will be pretty good at that vintage tone. The Markbass LM2, 3 or LMK are very warm sounding amps. Hartke or Peavey could be a good stop gap until you can afford something better.

I think you'll be able to get a good sound out of most amps through a BFB Super12.

[Merton]

Hartke LH500 or LH1000

[Dood]

[quote name='Merton' post='948516' date='Sep 7 2010, 05:17 PM']Hartke LH500 or LH1000 [/quote]

Yup - Listening to S1mon's recordings, I really like the tone of the LH with the Barefaced cabs. Infact, Alex himslef has recommended the LH1000 as a great sounding and financially viable option for powering his cabinets. I'm very pleased with my LH1000.

[ajerthebadger]

What about a good valve pre and power amp? Ampeg?

[ajerthebadger]

[quote name='chris_b' post='948471' date='Sep 7 2010, 04:41 PM']You haven't bought a very vintage sounding bass, but a used Ampeg SVT3PRO (with valve pre) will get you into the ballpark. Basically any Ampeg will be pretty good at that vintage tone. The Markbass LM2, 3 or LMK are very warm sounding amps. Hartke or Peavey could be a good stop gap until you can afford something better.

I think you'll be able to get a good sound out of most amps through a BFB Super12.[/quote]

The Marcus was definitely a lot more vintage sounding than the new American Standard and the Geddy seemed a bit brittle for my liking. Then again I dont want to pretend that I'm an expert, being in an Alt Rock band, the ability to boost the bass and treble appealed to me, and it still retains a bit of the non boosted tone in there which I liked.

I have actually now seen a video of the MarkBass Tube 800 and Little Rocker being tested and both look and definitely sound very appealing. Anyone know of a good place to try MarkBass stuff out? (big stock, ideally not in the centre of London, nearer to Bristol)

I think the LH500 will be a good stop gap. I'll look to upgrade at the end of this month.