2x15 Bass Cabs

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='Merton' post='970844' date='Sep 28 2010, 04:31 PM']WTF is a slow moving sound? [/quote]

Just listen to those reggae guys and their 18s, miles behind the drums.

[sk8]

i can definitely tell the difference between my 412 and 210. 210 is much punchier

[MythSte]

I'd be really interested to see (no pun intended) a blind test on a load of different speaker sizes/configurations and see what happens - just to put this argument about "slow" speakers etc to rest!

[Raggy]

[quote name='MythSte' post='970903' date='Sep 28 2010, 05:17 PM']

I'd be really interested to see (no pun intended) a blind test on a load of different speaker sizes/configurations and see what happens - just to put this argument about "slow" speakers etc to rest![/quote]

+1

[Wil]

[quote name='JTUK' post='970862' date='Sep 28 2010, 04:44 PM']a 15" is a slow moving sound...you can't hear it..?
you pull a note and you get DNNNNKKK...when you want a much sharper hit.
There is no way you can quicken that up.

I am really surprised you have never come across this..It is classic..!![/quote]

Compare a single 15 to a single 10 or single 12 and I doubt you'd hear much difference in response. However! A single 15 compared to a 4x10... yes, I can relate to what you're getting at, definately. It's the reason I prefer using a 4x10 to a 1x15 - I dont know if its down to cab design, number of speakers, porting or whatever, but there is definately a difference in tone/response. I've heard it with my own two ears, I tells ya!

I'll bet that a 4x15 will have just as much punch though, I really dont think the size of the speaker comes into it, more the configuration of the cab.

Edited September 28, 2010 by Wil

[Mr. Foxen]

With a 1x15 you'll have a more consistent tone as you move off axis compared to a 4x10, is to do with width of radiating plane and pistonic beaming.

Thing is, 15" speakers you can get now are plain better than any 10" speaker you could get ever.

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='BottomEndian' post='970689' date='Sep 28 2010, 09:10 AM']Not very. It's all been done before. [/quote]
Ad nauseum, in fact. Comparing cabs based on the driver size is as accurate a method as comparing automobiles based on tire size. The one thing that can be said of the insistence that driver size is crucial is that the insistor has no idea how speakers actually work.

[JTUK]

oh dear.. round and round we go.

It doesn't matter how it works, it matter how it sounds to you, and it helps if that person has half a brain or a clue.
Use your ears. If it works, you buy it..if it doesn't, you wont. The rest is highly amusing.
Leave the science to the people who have to justify it to sell their product..they'll enjoy that, I'll use my ears, I think they are good enough. Nobody is going to buy a cab because it reads well on paper unless the sound to their ears backs it up..... or nobody in their right mind.

Sometimes you wonder though..

[MythSte]

[quote name='JTUK' post='970944' date='Sep 28 2010, 05:56 PM']oh dear.. round and round we go.

It doesn't matter how it works, it matter how it sounds to you, and it helps if that person has half a brain or a clue.
Use your ears. If it works, you buy it..if it doesn't, you wont. The rest is highly amusing.
Leave the science to the people who have to justify it to sell their product..they'll enjoy that, I'll use my ears, I think they are good enough. Nobody is going to buy a cab because it reads well on paper unless the sound to their ears backs it up..... or nobody in their right mind.

Sometimes you wonder though..[/quote]

Everyone has different experiences though. Untill recently the only 410's I'd heard where Warwick and Peavey, I thought both sounded appauling! However, It would be silly for me to say I dont like 410 cabs based on that.

Have the people who are saying 15's are slow heard many reasonable quility 2x15 cabs I wonder?

[The Bass Doc]

Just joining in 'on the fence' as it were. The treble response from 15s is certainly a bit different to some smaller drivers and, in particular, tweeters.

I can fully understand some guys' preference for say a well designed 4x10+horn/tweeter since I well remember being mightily impressed on hearing my first SWR Goliath some years ago.

To imply however that 15s don't give out 'top-end' is misleading - it's just a different kind of treble.

I can't do the 'linky' thing but if you can dial up the thread 'North-east mini bass bash' you see dear old Wateroftyne (dear old=he's getting on a bit and is expensive) putting 4 cabs through their paces - Aggies, Bergs, Barefaced and EV loaded Fender. The amp and guitar settings remained the same throughout and I think most will agree there was still a fair bit of treble from the 2x15s - just a different sort.

[Count Bassy]

[quote name='civictiger' post='967036' date='Sep 24 2010, 07:06 PM']I would also look into getting a Marshall 7215, but they are so rare I wouldnt know where to START to look for one![/quote]

There's one on E-bay right now being sold with a DBS7200 head. £200, no bids, reserve not met. 4 days left.


[url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180566696587&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vie...e=STRK:MEWAX:IT[/url]

[wateroftyne]

SHAZAM! Wish I'd tuned the bass first, though...

[Protium]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='970984' date='Sep 28 2010, 06:24 PM']SHAZAM! Wish I'd tuned the bass first, though...[/quote]

Assuming the same EQ and amp through each (otherwise what's the point )

The first two sound much more trebly, more rounded, brighter - exactly what you'd expect from 10's and 12's.

The Vintage sounds very muffled in comparison (even against the Fender). It might be loud but if it sounds like that, no thanks. Not nice to my ears. Lacking brightness, exactly like a typical 15.

[howieee]

so far as i can see nobody has mentioned it so im going too

im looking for an ampeg 2x15 they seem to be bit of a rarity......

also am i right in saying that it ONLY has jack sockets on the back?

[wateroftyne]

[quote name='Protium' post='971000' date='Sep 28 2010, 06:42 PM']Assuming the same EQ and amp through each (otherwise what's the point )

The first two sound much more trebly, more rounded, brighter - exactly what you'd expect from 10's and 12's.

The Vintage sounds very muffled in comparison (even against the Fender). It might be loud but if it sounds like that, no thanks. Not nice to my ears. Lacking brightness, exactly like a typical 15.[/quote]
Yeah - I made a point when I posted this clip way back, that it was unfair on the Vintage as the EQ wasn't optimised for each cab.

Obviously if it's EQ'd to sound OK with a pair of horn-laden 2x10s, it's going to sound muffled via a tweeterless 2x15.

Push the top-end a little more, and I found the top-end to be very warm and pleasing to my ears. I'm not a tweetery person, though.

The Fender 2x15 is just a freak of nature treble-wise.

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='Protium' post='971000' date='Sep 28 2010, 06:42 PM']Assuming the same EQ and amp through each (otherwise what's the point )

The first two sound much more trebly, more rounded, brighter - exactly what you'd expect from 10's and 12's.

The Vintage sounds very muffled in comparison (even against the Fender). It might be loud but if it sounds like that, no thanks. Not nice to my ears. Lacking brightness, exactly like a typical 15.[/quote]


The first two have tweeters. If the DB cans run the same driver as the GS ones (I think the difference is in the mid voicing) then the barefaced 15s are significantly brighter. The only BF Vintage I've played is Shockwave's betweetered one, but I had it rolled off, but I've tried a couple of Compacts, which are voiced the same. The GS cabs with the tweeters off are pretty dark sounding, I've checked with Aguilar and the tweeter is high passed, the woofers run full range so there is no treble loss from that.

[Musicman20]

That video shows the difference I hear yet again. The BF is my least favourite sound. Not bothered what the weight is. But some will like it and that's totally fine!

[warwickhunt]

[quote name='wateroftyne' post='970984' date='Sep 28 2010, 06:24 PM']SHAZAM! Wish I'd tuned the bass first, though...[/quote]

What do you mean? The bass was in tune when I bought it!

I'm not going to get mired in the argument about more bottom end out of 15's versus 10's 12's etc but I can assure you that Howie's 15" EV's (no tweeter) had as much top end as any set-up on the day of that Mini bass bash. Coincidentally my Aggies tested, have only one tweeter between them and I always have it backed off 50%.

[JTUK]

[quote name='MythSte' post='970961' date='Sep 28 2010, 06:11 PM']Everyone has different experiences though. Untill recently the only 410's I'd heard where Warwick and Peavey, I thought both sounded appauling! However, It would be silly for me to say I dont like 410 cabs based on that.

Have the people who are saying 15's are slow heard many reasonable quility 2x15 cabs I wonder?[/quote]


Latest 15" cabs I used were an SWR SoB with horn and a GK thing.
The SWR with horn was ok but not a standalone cab solution in my mind. Turn the horn off and the sound was no way useable for me.
I had to use the cab with a Goliath jnr lll and then it worked ok.
Don't get me started on the GK thing.

Other than that I have 2 JBL 15" at home which I would probably give away.. I haven't used them in eons and would expect one or both would need a recone anyway.
Other 15" cabs in recent time used would be an Ashdown.

Hired in stuff..? Boogie 2x15, (to be fair this is unusual unless requested ) which really wasn't me although I liked the 1516's, and thankfully if in doubt, you'll get either an Ashdown or Ampeg 8x10. Not a big fan of those either, tbh.

I have heard some JBL 15"s that are livelier than most in terms of perceived range.....still a slow moving cone though, IMV.

Maybe it is time the OP came back with their thoughts if all this hasn't put them off.

[Conan]

[quote name='Merton' post='970844' date='Sep 28 2010, 04:31 PM']WTF is a slow moving sound? [/quote]

Sound that travels at less than 330 m/s. Obviously

[Conan]

And yes, at the end of the day it's down to your ears. Cabs are expensive (or at least they can be) so you buy what sounds pleasing to your ears. Nobody sane would disagree with that - however, it does get a bit wearing when people start trying to TELL you what sounds "best" and that you can't get this sound from that cab/speaker. etc, especially when you KNOW it to be inaccurate!

I liked the sound of the Compact but found it a bit small and near to the ground. I will reserve judgement on the Vintage until I have used/heard it in comparison to decent 10s and cheap 10s... If I like the Vintage I will attempt to buy one as I find the low mass very appealing after years of carting around TE, Ampeg and Ashdown boxes.

End of.

[BottomEndian]

[quote name='Conan' post='971382' date='Sep 29 2010, 08:24 AM']I find the low mass very appealing[/quote]
Completely off-topic here... you're not a physics teacher are you, Geoff? As a physics student, I got into the habit of referring to mass instead of weight, but all the non-physics types found it really odd.

[JPJ]

I used to be a 15's man, then became a 10's man. To me, 10's felt tighter and more responsive plus, and probably because there is normally more 10's in the same box than 15's, I've never had 10's crap out on me and fart the way some single 15's have in the past.

I've tried the 1x15 under 4x10 option, and found that the 15 wasn't really adding anything, so I now run two 4x10's.

But on Sunday we played a charity do, back line provided. I had to use a 1x15 Line 6 LD300 combo, going up against 2 Marshall powered 4x12's and apart from the fact it was sitting on the floor and could have done with being lifted up a little bit closer to my ears, it coped really well with my 5 string, even at the quite high on stage volumes we play at.

Perhaps 15" speaker technology has improved to the point where I should look again? Maybe a well designed 1x15 sitting under my Schroeder 21012 would be my perfect setup, as I love the clarity of the Schro but find it lacks that real low end thump?

Oh gawd, here we go again........

[Musicman20]

15s have moved on, without a doubt.

Have you seen the Schroeder 15+?

That is TINY and apparently, not that ive heard it, sound great for its size/weight.

[Conan]

[quote name='BottomEndian' post='971434' date='Sep 29 2010, 09:37 AM']Completely off-topic here... you're not a physics teacher are you, Geoff? As a physics student, I got into the habit of referring to mass instead of weight, but all the non-physics types found it really odd.[/quote]

Well technically I'm a science teacher with a biology specialism, but I do have to teach physics for my sins...