I'm too rock for my own good.

[Doctor J]

Just remember: pop and slap over everything ≠ funk

[chris_b]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017477' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:26 PM']....I assume you all play £50 P bass copies. Because it's all in the feel and nothing to do with your gear?....[/quote]
You can play anything on a Lakland, but I made the gear comment because I was trying to emphasise that you won't get funky by changing your gear. Bernard Edwards, Chic, started off playing an Ibanez and when George Porter Jr joined The Meters he was playing a bass which only had 3 strings. One had broken and he hadn’t bothered to replace it!

I don't know what "rock" you play but I would imagine that the changes you need to make for funk have more to do with the flow of the bass lines. You want even, flowing, accurate notes.


Oh, and just remember too much slap kills the funk!

[wotnwhy]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017511' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:42 PM']how can a bass player be so totally detached from their instrument and sound that it doesn't affect their feel?[/quote]

I wouldn't say it's total detachment, far from it. But personal feel should be able to overcome feel of an instrument. Going back to the £50 P, i was also going to say, if it wasn't for the fact that it played like a lump of moldy dog doo i would still be playing it! You should be able to get [i]close[/i] to your sound with [i]virtually[/i] any instrument, it's just you have to work harded at it with some instruments. So a good instrument is one where you don't have to work as hard to get your sound, which is why the subject of a 'good' instrument is so subjective.

[paul h]

All good salient points but I still need an answer!

Does your bass/sound affect your feel? Apparently not. Apparently it's nothing to do with gear.

So if I give you a P bass through an SVT you will play that with exactly the same feel as an MTD through an EBS?

Edited November 9, 2010 by paul h

[Low End Bee]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017522' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:52 PM']All good salient points but I still need an answer!

Does your bass/sound affect your feel? Apparently not. Apparently it's nothing to do with gear.

So if I give you a P bass through an SVT you will play that with exactly the same feel as an MTD [b]via an overdrive pedal [/b]through an EBS?[/quote]

Should work

[Doctor J]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017522' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:52 PM']All good salient points but I still need an answer!

Does your bass/sound affect your feel? Apparently not. Apparently it's nothing to do with gear.

So if I give you a P bass through an SVT you will play that with exactly the same feel as an MTD through an EBS?[/quote]
I tell my fingers what to do, not the other way around.

[paul h]

[quote name='Low End Bee' post='1017526' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:53 PM']Should work[/quote]



But raises a good point. Let's talk in terms of guitars.

A big bodied jazzer through a nice warm vintage valve amp. And a RG through a Marshall Valvestate and loads of pedals. You would play both with the same feel?

[wotnwhy]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017522' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:52 PM']Does your bass/sound affect your feel? Apparently not. Apparently it's nothing to do with gear.[/quote]

Yes it does, but not to the point where your feel is completely lost. Think of a beautiful woman, the clothes she wears effects her overall image, but put her a pair of briefs and your old shirt or a glamerous evening dress and she's still a beautiful woman.

[quote]So if I give you a P bass through an SVT you will play that with exactly the same feel as an MTD through an EBS?[/quote]

To an extent, yes. But then the difference between the 2 is far, far greater to changing the pickup in a bass from ceramic to alnico

[paul h]

[quote name='wotnwhy' post='1017535' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:58 PM']Yes it does, but not to the point where your feel is completely lost. Think of a beautiful woman, the clothes she wears effects her overall image, but put her a pair of briefs and your old shirt or a glamerous evening dress and she's still a beautiful woman.



To an extent, yes. But then the difference between the 2 is far, far greater to changing the pickup in a bass from ceramic to alnico [/quote]

Maybe I'm just a more sensitive musician than you are?

[chris_b]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017522' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:52 PM']....Does your bass/sound affect your feel?....[/quote]
You're playing could be affected by the feel and set up of the bass but the sound can easily be changed. Bootsy Collins had a fat round sound and the guy in the Commodores used a very clanky tone. The rest of us are in the middle somewhere.

Don't get hung up about sound, just get into the riffs and bass lines. Your tone will come later. Anyway, after 2 weeks you might think sod it and go back to rock.

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='wotnwhy' post='1017535' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:58 PM']To an extent, yes. But then the difference between the 2 is far, far greater to changing the pickup in a bass from ceramic to alnico [/quote]

I don't know what the pickups in my basses are made from. If I find out my Warwick has ceramic pickups will I only be able to play Def Leppard parts from that point on?

[paul h]

[quote name='chris_b' post='1017541' date='Nov 9 2010, 02:00 PM'][b]You're playing could be affected by the feel and set up of the bass but the sound can easily be changed.[/b] Bootsy Collins had a fat round sound and the guy in the Commodores used a very clanky tone. The rest of us are in the middle somewhere.

Don't get hung up about sound, just get into the riffs and bass lines. Your tone will come later. Anyway, after 2 weeks you might think sod it and go back to rock.[/quote]

Thank you.

In my OP changing the pickup was only a small part of the deal. The main issue was getting a different feel from the instrument. I have only got "hung up" on the sound aspect since because I find it hard to believe that so many people have zero interplay between the sound of their bass and their "feel".

[Low End Bee]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017529' date='Nov 9 2010, 01:55 PM']

But raises a good point. Let's talk in terms of guitars.

A big bodied jazzer through a nice warm vintage valve amp. And a RG through a Marshall Valvestate and loads of pedals. You would play both with the same feel?[/quote]

It wouldn't really matter too much with my guitar playing.

But in reality I would play a particular song in exactly the same way. I'm sure I would attempt to play Mystery Train and Enter Sandman with the same 'feel' on both. They would struggle tonally to cope with their 'wrong' genre though.
Hell it sounds like a fun thing to try though.

[paul h]

I give up. It is obviously just me then.



My bass sounds a bit too rock and because of that I think I instinctively lean towards that style of playing. I am hoping that with a slightly warmer sound and a less clanky set up that I might find it easier to play with the "feel" I am looking for.

I am the only person this happens to.

On the upside I am also the most versatile bass player on the planet and can now charge a fortune for session work. No one else can can compete with me because despite a producer's best efforts everyone else plays exactly the same at all times regardless of external stimulus.

Back of the net!

[wotnwhy]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017559' date='Nov 9 2010, 02:14 PM']My bass sounds a bit too rock and because of that I think I instinctively lean towards that style of playing.[/quote]

I would wager i could make it sound 'funk' using just the tone controls on the bass and whatever amp you are using.

[quote]I am hoping that with a slightly warmer sound and a less clanky set up that I might find it easier to play with the "feel" I am looking for.[/quote]

To fix clanky i would lower the action and maby try some heavier guage strings (depending on how clanky it is), and a much softer attack. In fact, think of it as rock playing = attack strings, funk playing = stroke/caress/tickle

[paul h]

[quote name='wotnwhy' post='1017584' date='Nov 9 2010, 02:26 PM']I would wager i could make it sound 'funk' using just the tone controls on the bass and whatever amp you are using. [/quote]

I don't doubt it. But that's why this isn't a "wotnwhy sounds too rock..." thread. And I would also most likely say "Funky, but sounds a bit harsh, I don't like ceramic pickups".

[quote]To fix clanky i would lower the action and maby try some heavier guage strings (depending on how clanky it is), and a much softer attack. In fact, think of it as rock playing = attack strings, funk playing = stroke/caress/tickle[/quote]

I don't think I could really get my action any lower. Also I am thinking more along the lines of 70's funk in a Larry Graham, Louis Johnson style as well as Bernard Edwards...Basically the strings are going to be attacked at some point!

[Low End Bee]

[quote name='Low End Bee' post='1017549' date='Nov 9 2010, 02:07 PM']It wouldn't really matter too much with my guitar playing.

But in reality I would play a particular song in exactly the same way. I'm sure I would attempt to play Mystery Train and Enter Sandman with the same 'feel' on both. They would struggle tonally to cope with their 'wrong' genre though.
Hell it sounds like a fun thing to try though.[/quote]


Thinking about it I would do a few dive bombs on Mystery Train with the RG and maybe some flat picking on Enter Sandman with the jazz box.

So maybe you're partially right?

[thunderbird13]

why not just get a wah wah pedal - that should cure any rock leanings !

[paul h]

[quote name='Low End Bee' post='1017600' date='Nov 9 2010, 02:36 PM']Thinking about it I would do a few dive bombs on Mystery Train with the RG and maybe some flat picking on Enter Sandman with the jazz box.

So maybe you're partially right?[/quote]


Partially right! GOOOOAAAAALLLLL!

I'll take that thank you very much!

</thread>

[charic]

Interesting thread Paul

I tend to play different depending on my sound. The advantage for me is the fact that the ACG is so sodding versatile it can match any style I want too play.

If I want a funky sound I dial in a funky sound & alter style accordingly

If I want a rock sound I dial in a rock sound & alter style accordingly

I could play either way with either sound [b]BUT[/b] it wouldn't feel as natural.

[paul h]

[quote name='charic' post='1017693' date='Nov 9 2010, 03:35 PM']Interesting thread Paul

I tend to play different depending on my sound. The advantage for me is the fact that the ACG is so sodding versatile it can match any style I want too play.

If I want a funky sound I dial in a funky sound & alter style accordingly

If I want a rock sound I dial in a rock sound & alter style accordingly

I could play either way with either sound [b]BUT[/b] it wouldn't feel as natural.[/quote]

Thank you! I think it's natural for playing to be affected by your tone. After all everything we do really comes down to listening. Listening to the band and to ourselves. So if I'm not happy with my tone then it will affect my feel.

[charic]

As Homer Simpson once said: "Indubitably"

[chris_b]

[quote name='paul h' post='1017705' date='Nov 9 2010, 03:45 PM']....I think it's natural for playing to be affected by your tone....[/quote]
I would suggest you take tone out of the equation and practise acoustically. Then the tone can't get in the way of your playing.

[risingson]

Bernard Edwards's style isn't exactly easily copped. People might think they can play Good Times like the record, but so many people lack the feel because Bernard Edwards was a stupidly good bassist who isn't easy to copy, simples. If you want to be a funk player, you either had to grow up in 70's Philadelphia or New York, and if you didn't, then you need to emerge yourself in listening to The Meters and Slave records for years at a time.

[Pete Academy]

[quote name='risingson' post='1017899' date='Nov 9 2010, 06:05 PM']Bernard Edwards's style isn't exactly easily copped. People might think they can play Good Times like the record, but so many people lack the feel because Bernard Edwards was a stupidly good bassist who isn't easy to copy, simples. If you want to be a funk player, you either had to grow up in 70's Philadelphia or New York, and if you didn't, then you need to emerge yourself in listening to The Meters and Slave records for years at a time.[/quote]

True. Good Times is tricky to play correctly. I've seldom heard it played right.

Slave? Mark Adams is one of the best funk players ever. Truly unique.