Perry Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 If we had an ideal world we would spend small fortunes on out basses and amps. But, would the crowds notice the difference, if they did, would it really be worth it? As a mobile disco DJ I've used good gear and crap gear. The results are pretty much the same. I've had good and not so good gigs with both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 They wouldn't conciously notice but, subliminally, they couldn't but... I think a lot of punters don't know how crap a lot of what they hear is until they are presented with something that sounds classy. Then again, a lot of musos aren't much better. Otherwise Carlsboro would have gone out of business decades ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceguyhomer Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I'll stick my neck out and say it doesn't make that much difference to the audience. That said, you stand a better chance of being able to play week in and week out with better (more reliable) gear and the reason I strive to equip myself with the best gear I can justify is because I don't want the gear to be a factor or get in the way of what I want to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexclaber Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Yes but rarely consciously and it doesn't require expensive gear, it requires knowing how to effectively use your gear. Most gear is adequate, within reason (i.e. don't expect a practice amp to fill the FOH with bottom without PA support!) Alex Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crez5150 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 The audience doesn't care...... but then again equipment is better made and less expensive these days anyway. We totted up the value of gear on stage last week..... £75k..... would the audience know it was worth that?? would they care...... nope! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geddys nose Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 A crap band with good gear will always sound crap and a good band with crap gear will always sound good- My Dad always told me that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wateroftyne Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I think a common-or-garden audience have a lower quality threshold than the likes of us... they'll put up with something we would find unlistenable. That said, I also think they appreciate good sound, although they might not acknowledge it - or even realise it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neepheid Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I care. I hate the "amps up to 11" approach that some combinations of band/sound engineers take - distortion all over the place. They really need to cool it off a notch, so they are operating within the bounds of the equipment's capabilities instead of on the ragged edge of them. Maybe they think they're covering up frailties in their equipment, but they're really showing it in all it's dubious glory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bremen Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='Perry' post='116805' date='Jan 9 2008, 09:45 AM']If we had an ideal world we would spend small fortunes on out basses and amps. But, would the crowds notice the difference, if they did, would it really be worth it? As a mobile disco DJ I've used good gear and crap gear. The results are pretty much the same. I've had good and not so good gigs with both.[/quote] I thought not, but recently I've had comments from non-musicians who have noticed stuff like being able to separate instruments from the noise, and even commenting on lyrics; there's no way to hear the words if the sound isn't pretty good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bilbo Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I think we should start a new thread on good sounding rooms. I do around 70-80 gigs a year and can honestly say that it is only once or twice a year that I play in a room where the acoustics are conducive to a good sound. Mostly we play in horrid sounding rooms with high ceilings and nasty sounding reflections off tiled floors or brick walls - yeeeuch!! And some of these places have music seven nights a week! And full rigs don't really make that much difference if the room is a real dog. My favorite gigs are outside!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cetera Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I think it's more to do with 'instrument placement' in the sound specturm. If your bass is cutting through nicely with a slight mid boost so as not to clash with the guitar/keyboard and you each occupy a slightly different part of the EQ field with tight drums and a clear vocal it matters not if you are playing a Squier or a Spector into a Carlsboro or an EA. The audience will hear the quality of the overall sound, allowing them to pick out individual instruments. However, I agree that if your gear is good quality then it will be more reliable and provide you more opportunity to meet the above requirement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheBigBeefChief Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I think there's a certain charm in the sh*t gear approach. It also depends what the band is. For example, I think a covers band is under tighter scrutinity than a band playing originals. Not just in musicianship, but also how closely they can reproduce a sound compared the the original. Therefore, you probably need better gear to play covers. Playing originals through crap gear, well you can always claim that the muffled and distorted noise coming from you amp is intentional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='Geddys nose' post='116816' date='Jan 9 2008, 09:59 AM']A crap band with good gear will always sound crap and a good band with crap gear will always sound good- My Dad always told me that [/quote] +1 A friend of mine once bet his band that he could play a whole gig with his bass detuned a semitone and that no one in the audience would notice. He won his bet - the RAF audience thought the gig was great even though the bass was horribly out of key all night. (Maybe he was out of key every gig? ) If audiences don't notice that, then the chances that they'd notice some of the more subtle differences in the sound quality of the gear/room etc, are probably pretty unlikely. Isn't it a 'trueism' that the General Public only notice when things are really bad and hardly ever notice when things are really good? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheddatom Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='116898' date='Jan 9 2008, 11:52 AM']Isn't it a 'trueism' that the General Public only notice when things are really bad and hardly ever notice when things are really good?[/quote] I think people notice difference and contrast, so if they hear a crap band, and then a good one, it makes the first band sound worse than they are, and the second band sound better than they are. It would be impossible to notice if something was "really good" if it had always been really good and there was nothing to compare it to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tauzero Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='TheBigBeefChief' post='116893' date='Jan 9 2008, 11:45 AM']Playing originals through crap gear, well you can always claim that the muffled and distorted noise coming from you amp is intentional.[/quote] True. It worked for Chris Squire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TheBigBeefChief Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I actually prefer muffled and distorted. It hides a multitude of sins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cantdosleepy Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='116898' date='Jan 9 2008, 11:52 AM']A friend of mine once bet his band that he could play a whole gig with his bass detuned a semitone and that no one in the audience would notice. He won his bet - the RAF audience thought the gig was great even though the bass was horribly out of key all night. (Maybe he was out of key every gig? )[/quote] Man, that's pretty depressing. 'I could be playing anything. Noone notices'. Kinda makes you lose the drive to nail those riffs. Is there an idiots guide to quickly eq-ing a toilet-venue band for easy separation/reasonable mix? Could someone with good knowledge start and sticky a topic like that? eg: Four pice vox/guit/bass/drums- Boost bass at XXXhz, cut at XXXhz Boost guit at YYYhz cut at NNNhz, make him play only the top four strings Boost Vox at PPPhz, cut at DDDhz, limit at this threshold, try this compression ratio..? Keys: break his left hand, cut at SSShz That would be amazing! Those of us starting out in crap places without this wealth of experience would really appreciate something like this! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris_b Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 I play in a duo with an acoustic guitarist to "sit down and listen" audiences and generally they do notice and comment to us on the quality of the sound. In the covers bands the only factor is what you play, "do we know it and can we dance to it". The originals bands I play in take a lot of time and effort to make everything "just right" of which 101% goes right over the heads of the audiences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 My bum notes are much more audiable now I have got better gear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='Geddys nose' post='116816' date='Jan 9 2008, 09:59 AM']A crap band with good gear will always sound crap and a good band with crap gear will always sound good- My Dad always told me that [/quote] and a good band with good gear? amazing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bass_ferret Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='116898' date='Jan 9 2008, 11:52 AM']A friend of mine once bet his band that he could play a whole gig with his bass detuned a semitone and that no one in the audience would notice. He won his bet - the RAF audience thought the gig was great even though the bass was horribly out of key all night. (Maybe he was out of key every gig? )[/quote] Or he had a sh*t sound that was an indistinct low frequency rumble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 well to be fair i don't think it's just the bass, this band played a gig in my school and the singer sang a semitone flat all night, the crowd still seemed to like them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2wheeler Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 The audience have paid and showed up and want to have a good time. But just because they make the most of it and dance along doesn't mean they don't notice the sound quality, even if they can't exactly say what is bad/good about the sound. A friend had a (more or less Jam tribute) band at her birthday party and I bopped along with everyone else but I would never choose to go and see them again because the sound was horrible. I think other people felt the same way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverfoxnik Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='bass_ferret' post='116927' date='Jan 9 2008, 12:22 PM']My bum notes are much more audiable now I have got better gear [/quote] Mind you, when you came and saw my band in Worthing last September John, the bum notes and speaker distortion from my blown GK cab were equally noticable I seem to recall... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 [quote name='silverfoxnik' post='116978' date='Jan 9 2008, 01:29 PM'] Mind you, when you came and saw my band in Worthing last September John, the bum notes and speaker distortion from my blown GK cab were equally noticable I seem to recall...[/quote] Bet you wish you had your old H&K mate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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