BAD DESIGNS ok lets have em,

[lemmywinks]

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='1038480' date='Nov 27 2010, 01:56 AM']The RD has a 36" scale, that makes playing a bit harder whatever the manufacturer (although a top horn would probably help.[/quote]


Are you sure? I'm pretty sure mine was standard, however you have to use extra long scale strings if you're stringing it through-body so a lot of people think they're longer

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='lemmywinks' post='1042066' date='Nov 30 2010, 10:36 AM']Are you sure? I'm pretty sure mine was standard, however you have to use extra long scale strings if you're stringing it through-body so a lot of people think they're longer[/quote]

Googling shows where I got the reference to 36", but catalogues say 34 1/2" or 34 3/8", so a bit longer than Fender.

[funkgod]

Anybody got an idea why the new stingray nut is like it is ???
i have just ordered a new neck from MM and it came with this on it
makes it almost impossable to replace with a nice brass one or the intonation will be out.
ahhhh its all so apparent now !!!£££!!!

i cant see any reason why the change was made, other than you will now have to order a new one through MM, i hate it.
i can see they are now stepped but there is nothing you would not get on the saddles.
[attachment=84240:IMG_2492.jpg]


i wish they would use the old warwick thumb bass "just a nut 1" that was a perfect design
with the strings going over the screw heads set in the brass nut.

[cd_david]

[quote name='funkgod' post='1297209' date='Jul 8 2011, 01:56 PM']Anybody got an idea why the new stingray nut is like it is ???
i have just ordered a new neck from MM and it came with this on it
makes it almost impossable to replace with a nice brass one or the intonation will be out.
ahhhh its all so apparent now !!!£££!!!

i cant see any reason why the change was made, other than you will now have to order a new one through MM, i hate it.
i can see they are now stepped but there is nothing you would not get on the saddles.
[attachment=84239:IMG_2492.jpg]

i wish they would use the old warwick thumb bass "just a nut 1" that was a perfect design
with the strings going over the screw heads set in the brass nut.[/quote]

The nuts have been like this for a while. Its is to redue intonation problems, ie yyour strings are compensated for thickness at one end of the string there for with fixed frets the further from the compensation you go (away from the saddles) the further your intonation drifts. This reduces that by having both halves of the string intoned.
I think its a great idea, mine work brilliantly.

[Truckstop]

Rackmount gear with all the jack sockets and DI's etc etc in the back. Pain in the arse! With the obvious exclusion of power supplies and amp-cab sockets, why are they always in the back? This means you have to take the lead out of the front of your amp, and feed it into the back at the risk of crushing the lead or looping it round the back which is annoying and sort of defeats one of the reasons of buying rackmount gear.

Truckstop

[Musicman20]

[quote name='cd_david' post='1297236' date='Jul 8 2011, 02:17 PM']The nuts have been like this for a while. Its is to redue intonation problems, ie yyour strings are compensated for thickness at one end of the string there for with fixed frets the further from the compensation you go (away from the saddles) the further your intonation drifts. This reduces that by having both halves of the string intoned.
I think its a great idea, mine work brilliantly.[/quote]

+1 great design, and it also looks very well engineered.

I tried the Warwick Just A Nut III on a Streamer and really didnt get on with it.

Its best to keep a Ray stock, IMO.

[funkgod]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='1297311' date='Jul 8 2011, 03:15 PM']+1 great design, and it also looks very well engineered.

I tried the Warwick Just A Nut III on a Streamer and really didnt get on with it.

Its best to keep a Ray stock, IMO.[/quote]

AHH,,,, seems to make some sence now, tho i still like the brass blanc better.
the just a nut 1 was far better than the 3 with the individual screw tops, again no need for them to change that.

[paul h]

[quote name='funkgod' post='1297219' date='Jul 8 2011, 02:02 PM']Anybody got an idea why the new stingray nut is like it is ???
i have just ordered a new neck from MM and it came with this on it
makes it almost impossable to replace with a nice brass one or the intonation will be out.
ahhhh its all so apparent now !!!£££!!!

i cant see any reason why the change was made, other than you will now have to order a new one through MM, i hate it.
i can see they are now stepped but there is nothing you would not get on the saddles.
[attachment=84240:IMG_2492.jpg]


i wish they would use the old warwick thumb bass "just a nut 1" that was a perfect design
with the strings going over the screw heads set in the brass nut.[/quote]

This photo confuses me greatly. Surely conventional wisdom says that the nut should be closer to the bridge to improve intonation?

[url="http://www.buzzfeiten.com/howitworks/howitworks.htm"]http://www.buzzfeiten.com/howitworks/howitworks.htm[/url]

[dave_bass5]

MarkBass Amp bag for the larger heads like the SA450/SD1200 etc.

Great idea in theory as you dont have to take the head out to use it, but with large vent holes in the sides it makes it pretty dangerous if its raining as there is nothing stopping it from going straight in to the amp.

[Dave Vader]

[quote name='paul h' post='1297356' date='Jul 8 2011, 03:53 PM']This photo confuses me greatly. Surely conventional wisdom says that the nut should be closer to the bridge to improve intonation?

[url="http://www.buzzfeiten.com/howitworks/howitworks.htm"]http://www.buzzfeiten.com/howitworks/howitworks.htm[/url][/quote]


Conventional wisdom says that as soon as you touch a fret anything you have done behind it has bugger all effect on intonation. However, I'm willing to be told otherwise.

[xilddx]

[quote name='funkgod' post='1297219' date='Jul 8 2011, 02:02 PM']Anybody got an idea why the new stingray nut is like it is ???
i have just ordered a new neck from MM and it came with this on it
makes it almost impossable to replace with a nice brass one or the intonation will be out.
ahhhh its all so apparent now !!!£££!!!

i cant see any reason why the change was made, other than you will now have to order a new one through MM, i hate it.
i can see they are now stepped but there is nothing you would not get on the saddles.
[attachment=84240:IMG_2492.jpg]


[b]i wish they would use the old warwick thumb bass "just a nut 1" that was a perfect design
with the strings going over the screw heads set in the brass nut.[/b][/quote]

It was rubbish. And Warwick recognised that and designed the JANII which was even more rubbish.

Now we have the Brass JANIII which is a lovely bit of work.

[Count Bassy]

[quote name='Dave Vader' post='1297375' date='Jul 8 2011, 04:17 PM']Conventional wisdom says that as soon as you touch a fret anything you have done behind it has bugger all effect on intonation. However, I'm willing to be told otherwise.[/quote]


When you press a string on to the first fret you are not only fretting it, but are also bending it by an amount, so with a conventional nut the first few frets always come out a bit sharp, irrespective of how well you set the intonation at the 12th fret.

By effectively moving the nut forward in a compensated nut you are shortening the distance to the first nut so that it nominally plays flat.
If you get it right this flattening and the sharpening from pressing the string down cancel out, so the first few frets are better in tune.

Obviously this applies to all frets but the affect reduces as you move away from the nut.

I played around with one a few years ago (actually with a bit of wire acting as a zero fret). And the affect was really quite good in terms of tuning accuracy.
Some day all basses will be built this way.

Edited July 8, 2011 by Count Bassy

[bassace]

[quote name='Earbrass' post='1034072' date='Nov 23 2010, 05:22 PM']+1. Great played arco in the massed ranks of a string section, but seriously lacking as a rhythm section instrument when played pizzicato and alone.[/quote]

And you can't get it under your chin.

[paul h]

[quote name='Count Bassy' post='1297420' date='Jul 8 2011, 04:57 PM']When you press a string on to the first fret you are not only fretting it, but are also bending it by an amount, so with a conventional nut the first few frets always come out a bit sharp, irrespective of how well you set the intonation at the 12th fret.

By effectively moving the nut forward in a compensated nut you are shortening the distance to the first nut so that it nominally plays flat.
If you get it right this flattening and the sharpening from pressing the string down cancel out, so the first few frets are better in tune.

Obviously this applies to all frets but the affect reduces as you move away from the nut.

I played around with one a few years ago (actually with a bit of wire acting as a zero fret). And the affect was really quite good in terms of tuning accuracy.
Some day all basses will be built this way.[/quote]

This. ^

I am currently rocking a zero fret conversion for that reason, amongst others.

[funkgod]

[quote name='silddx' post='1297400' date='Jul 8 2011, 04:33 PM']It was rubbish. And Warwick recognised that and designed the JANII which was even more rubbish.

Now we have the Brass JANIII which is a lovely bit of work.[/quote]

I loved the first thumb bass nut, i could get the strings right down in the nut, just a fraction above the first frett with no buzz, the problem i found with some plastic ( or softer than metal types).
if i set (filed) the nut down so the strings sat as said ( just above the first frett ) after a short space of time if you use the bass alot with constant tuning changing strings the strings slowly file the bottom of the nut away and you slowly start to get a buzz from the first frett,
i could not find an issue with the just a nut 1, loved the way if the string sat too low in the nut ( or high) it was just a half turn on a fine thred to lower or higher it, perfect.
on saying all this my wal has a plastic nut that i have never had to change in 25 years and i use that alot.
i spose its all down to what works for us, one mans bla bla bla.

[Wolverinebass]

My own personal favourite branches of design insanity are:

Heel adjust truss rods that you have to take the neck off to sort. Who thought that was a good idea?!! Try that with an 8 string bass when you have to re-string the damn thing to adjust the action and take the neck off twice just to be sure it's right. Grrrr.

Most things about Rickenbackers. Though I think Mr Foxen has already said everything!!

Rack gear that doesn't have inputs on the back. Then you have to run it through to the front via a gap to use it. See my Digitech for that joy with only a front input. Idiots!! Why didn't they figure that out?!!!

3 point bridges. [i]You[/i] know it's wrong Gibson. [i]We[/i] know it's wrong.

Basses not having standardisable scale lengths. Sure, 35, 34, 33, 32, 30 or whatever. That's fine. Don't do 30.75 like my Alembic or some other ludicrous fraction of an inch. Because then you're never quite sure what scale of strings to get as it's kind of in the middle. You'll probably always get the wrong ones or if you can get ones that'll fit they'll be the wrong gauge so you'll feel like you're playing a bass with melted cheese strings on it as the tension will be too low.

Rackmounted amps having the tuner output socket on the front. Why?!! Just so we can have more wires in the way of our stuff?

[thepurpleblob]

I don't know if anybody else said this (too lazy to read whole thread)... but those bits of rotting foam underneath pickups when they should have proper big springs. It can't be that hard to make a pickup that actually comes up when you undo the screws!!

[Evil Undead]

[quote name='Count Bassy' post='1033454' date='Nov 23 2010, 02:14 AM']Bass cases, even 'fitted' hard cases, where simply putting the bass in knocks the end tuner. Only a minor problem I know, and I'd always check the tuning anyway, but it really annoying knowing that that one string will be out whenever you take it out the case.

Also cases which are way to bulky for the instrument inside - it offends my sense of efficiency.[/quote]

Both of these I agree with 100%

Was just thinking this recently

[RAY AGAINST THE MACHINE]

Two things : Battery compartments on my Steinberger, or washburn status. Too many screws, too fiddly ,and old fashioned battery patch with two wires etc.

Hollowbody basses..only one stap button

[Dandelion]

My Fender Jazz bass bridge has no recesses for the grub screws to sit in so the barrels can wander about on the plate. Which means that they can vibrate against each other.

I got around this problem on a previous bass by sticking Blu-tack in between the barrels. But on a Fender?

[darkandrew]

[quote name='funkgod' post='1297325' date='Jul 8 2011, 03:27 PM']AHH,,,, seems to make some sence now, tho i still like the brass blanc better.
the just a nut 1 was far better than the 3 with the individual screw tops, again no need for them to change that.[/quote]

Except that the screws on the JAN1 will eventually wear out to the point that even Locktite won't stop them rattling and then you get all sorts of weird harmonics on open strings (Warwick in their English translation refer to this as "playing notes that aren't even there").

The JAN2 wasn't really that much better either, although it didn't rattle it would snap with the lightest sideways knock.

The JAN3 on the other hand does seem to be OK (in brass form anyway) although do I really need an adjustable nut?

Edited July 27, 2011 by darkandrew

[Deep Thought]

I have a particular dislike for the 9 volt battery attachment system in most pedals/tuners etc., that bit of ? cardboard covered in plastic with two press studs on it and two flimsy little wires. The studs usually grip really tightly, requiring excessive force to disconnect the battery, which the whole effort lacks the strength to withstand over repeated uses. My Korg Pitchblack has this, and I don't have much confidence in its longevity. Systems exist where it's possible to just drop in a 9 volt without use of the press studs, give me one of those any day.

[BigRedX]

Bridges where the intonation adjustment isn't done by winding the saddle backwards and forwards on screw but requires you to move it physically by hand. It's far more cumbersome, time consuming and potentially less accurate to set. However I see a lot of designs using this method so I'm thinking there must me a good reason for it from tone PoV to make it worthwhile because it certainly isn't ergonomic.

Would any of the Basschat resident luthiers care to comment?

[Mr. Foxen]

[quote name='BigRedX' post='1318001' date='Jul 27 2011, 10:07 AM']Bridges where the intonation adjustment isn't done by winding the saddle backwards and forwards on screw but requires you to move it physically by hand. It's far more cumbersome, time consuming and potentially less accurate to set. However I see a lot of designs using this method so I'm thinking there must me a good reason for it from tone PoV to make it worthwhile because it certainly isn't ergonomic.

Would any of the Basschat resident luthiers care to comment?[/quote]

Those ones tend to let you fully lock the saddle in place, rather than wibbling about on a spring. You could have a screw as well, but more parts for same functionality.

[BigRedX]

[quote name='Mr. Foxen' post='1318004' date='Jul 27 2011, 10:09 AM']Those ones tend to let you fully lock the saddle in place, rather than wibbling about on a spring. You could have a screw as well, but more parts for same functionality.[/quote]
I can sort of see the logic when you're talking about the typical Fender style BBT bridge, but there's plenty of other designs that use the screw and spring method to set intonation that are unlikely to do this such as the Schaller 3D and the Hipshot A Style where the saddles run in fixed channels and as long as you allow the saddle to move forward freely when slackening off the screw there shouldn't be any problems.

On the move it by hand bridges I've lost count of the number of times I've tried to make a small final adjustment to the saddle position only for it to slip away in my grasp and then have to start all over again. Plus on a lot of these designs the very act of locking the saddle in place by a grub screw causes it to move slightly as you turn the screw.

So is there a clear tonal advantage or is it just lazy engineering?