Tips on downtuning

[charic]

Does anyone have any tips on downtuning to C? I still want to be able to play in E way the mood takes me aswell.

This is also currently just for an audition and on my ACG so I'm not modding!

Or do I just play in E and play up?

[xgsjx]

I have a few songs I play in drop D (just detuning the E down), but I've never tried going down to C.
If you rarely use the G string then you could restring with the first 4 strings from a set of 5s (BEAD), but I'm not sure if this would require modding the nut to take a slightly wider B string (you could get the lightest gauge you can find).

Or, play higher up & get an octaver.

[charic]

The tuning would be: CGCF if I remember rightly

I was considering the 5 string set route, don't really want to mod the nut though. Hadn't thought of an octaver!

[Bottle]

[quote name='xgsjx' post='1036221' date='Nov 25 2010, 12:34 PM']I have a few songs I play in drop D (just detuning the E down), but I've never tried going down to C.
If you rarely use the G string then you could restring with the first 4 strings from a set of 5s (BEAD), but I'm not sure if this would require modding the nut to take a slightly wider B string (you could get the lightest gauge you can find).[/quote]
I've done both - my Squier was the best platform for this, since it has bigger machine heads than the Ibby. I used the original string set (Fender 7250's) downtuned to DGCF with just a small trussrod tweak. After playing this way for a year, I decided to try using a spare set of 5'ers on it (dumping the high G), Hartke Bass Attack mediums - did have to file out the nut to take the 0.135" B string etc. Again, minor trussrod tweak and back in business. I use this downtuned as well, to ADGC (so it's still tuned in fourths). This way I can get a reasonable tone out of the fretted B and C, and further up the neck.

[quote name='xgsjx' post='1036221' date='Nov 25 2010, 12:34 PM']Or, play higher up & get an octaver.[/quote]
Not had much experience with using an octave-down - too 'synthy' for my tastes . I much prefer to put the correct strings on and get the full range of overtones from the string itself, rather than some electronic processing to get there. But that's just me....

HTH, Ian

PS to the OP: I'll be at the SE bash with the Squier - you're welcome to give it a go, if you'd like

[Happy Jack]

[quote name='xgsjx' post='1036221' date='Nov 25 2010, 12:34 PM']If you rarely use the G string then you could restring with the first 4 strings from a set of 5s (BEAD), but I'm not sure if this would require modding the nut to take a slightly wider B string (you could get the lightest gauge you can find).[/quote]

I have a cheap old bass (a Ned Callan [url="http://tinypic.com/a/2i2wn/3"]http://tinypic.com/a/2i2wn/3[/url] ) that I've done this with as an experiment.

It works fine. I don't play solos and in fact I don't make a lot of use of the G-string, nothing I can't work around, anyway.

If you're near London, charic, you're welcome to borrow it and see what you think.

Hell, for £100 I'll sell it to you.

[charic]

[quote name='Bottle' post='1036242' date='Nov 25 2010, 12:46 PM']I've done both - my Squier was the best platform for this, since it has bigger machine heads than the Ibby. I used the original string set (Fender 7250's) downtuned to DGCF with just a small trussrod tweak. After playing this way for a year, I decided to try using a spare set of 5'ers on it (dumping the high G), Hartke Bass Attack mediums - did have to file out the nut to take the 0.135" B string etc. Again, minor trussrod tweak and back in business. I use this downtuned as well, to ADGC (so it's still tuned in fourths). This way I can get a reasonable tone out of the fretted B and C, and further up the neck.


Not had much experience with using an octave-down - too 'synthy' for my tastes . I much prefer to put the correct strings on and get the full range of overtones from the string itself, rather than some electronic processing to get there. But that's just me....

HTH, Ian

PS to the OP: I'll be at the SE bash with the Squier - you're welcome to give it a go, if you'd like[/quote]

Much appreciated mate, may take you up on that offer

[charic]

[quote name='Happy Jack' post='1036244' date='Nov 25 2010, 12:47 PM']I have a cheap old bass (a Ned Callan [url="http://tinypic.com/a/2i2wn/3"]http://tinypic.com/a/2i2wn/3[/url] ) that I've done this with as an experiment.

It works fine. I don't play solos and in fact I don't make a lot of use of the G-string, nothing I can't work around, anyway.

If you're near London, charic, you're welcome to borrow it and see what you think.

Hell, for £100 I'll sell it to you. [/quote]

thanks alot mate but I'm not in the market at the mo and my next purchase will probably be a 5 or 6 string (pref 6!) Anyway this is currently for an audition rather than a permanent thing

[Adrenochrome]

We play in D standard with some songs in drop C. I use a 50-110 set and it's fine. The low C is a tiny bit floppy but sounds great with no loss of volume.

[JTUK]

If you need to contend with 2 tones then this is a very short term compromise.
I used to drop the E to B for a few songs but it doesn't work to any great degree. If you can get the string to work without too much flap that is one thing but then you need the E string to be playable at the 5th and 7 th fret for your E and F# 's etc..

Detuning the whole bass involves a nut re-mod, plus maybe something at the bridge and a new set of strings anyway.
You don't really want to be playing low B or C's on anything less than 118, IMV.

Alternative option is the octave pedal if you can get a decent one to track... but the only real solution is the 5 option at some point.... which I am sure you know.

[Adrenochrome]

[quote name='JTUK' post='1036272' date='Nov 25 2010, 01:07 PM']Detuning the whole bass involves a nut re-mod, plus maybe something at the bridge and a new set of strings anyway.
You don't really want to be playing low B or C's on anything less than 118, IMV.[/quote]

I don't fully agree if you want to try it with the kind of gauges that I was talking about. I've done it on a couple of basses and neither bass needing the nut cutting. Obviously if you're using the bottom 4 strings of a 5-string set then nut modification is more likely. Yes, the C is a little bit floppy with a 110 but it sounds fine and does intonate okay up the neck.

[Mr. Foxen]

I just detuned my Prosteels 55-110 to C, is a bit slack but workable, I generally play them in standard.

[BottomEndian]

[quote name='charic' post='1036204' date='Nov 25 2010, 12:27 PM']Does anyone have any tips on downtuning to C? [b]I still want to be able to play in E way the mood takes me aswell.[/b][/quote]
That's the problem, really. It's wanting to be able to change between CGCF and EADG. That's a not-inconsiderable change in tension, so if one of them feels right, the other one won't. There'll be differences in string-feel and neck relief (and thus action height). I've always set up basses for particular tunings, so changing tuning means changing bass.

IME, Alan cuts his nuts pretty carefully (as it were), so unless you're willing to widen your slots (again, lamenting the loss of :brow:) you're probably stuck with your current gauge. You might be able to find some stiffer strings than what you've currently got on without changing gauge, but it won't eliminate the fact that you can't have both tunings feeling great.

[charic]

Thank for replies guys. I've got a lot to think about

[urb]

I'll just add Tim Commerford from Rage Against The Machine has one of his Fenders tuned B - D seems like a good option for really digging into the low end without buying or having to adjust to playing a 5 string

[gafbass02]

Over the years I've really come to hate down tuning, even a semitone. I find cause i set my basses up so precisely at normal tuning it really affects the way they play. That and it just eats amp power. Grrr !

[silentbob]

This is from an interview with the bassist from Jimmy Eat World. Not really what you're after, but may be worth a look if the audition becomes a full time thing.

"With the band tuning down for many of its songs, Burch wrestled with pitch problems playing his American-made Fender Precision. “The tuning on my bass is low: C#G#C#F#. That’s a half-step down and another full step for the E string. As a result, the string tension is really low. Heavy-gauge strings helped, but if I hit a note, the motion and arc of the string would create tension and pull the note sharp.” When a tour-bus snafu snapped the neck in two, he brought the bass back to Fender Custom Shop’s Alex Perez for repairs—and an unexpected solution. “Alex explained that the more the strings are under tension, the more stable the note is going to be. He did for me what he’d done for other players, which is to put a left-handed neck on a right-handed bass. That made the E string—my low C#—the longest string from the peg to the bridge instead of the shortest. It’s amazing how stable the note is now. I also changed my E string to a heavier .125 from a 5-string set.”

[silentbob]

Here it is.

[bassbloke]

I've used the same Fender deluxe jazz with the same gauge Fender Superbass strings (45, 65, 85, 100, 135) for donkeys years and in that time have tuned BEADG, AEADG, ADADG, GCGCF, ADGCF. All I need to do is adjust saddle height and adjust right hand technique a little (pick or fingerstyle) to compensate for the change in tension.

If you are going to be playing with strings tuned down 4 steps, best thing you can do to retain tension and definition is to play much nearer the bridge.

[retroman]

Don't know how much help this will be but.........

Try a set of DR DDT's, with a 110 on the bottom. One band I am in tunes drop C. I have used these on a Gibson, and currently have a set of these on my Rickenbacker, and they're great. No floppyness, even on the slightly shorter scale Ric. They didn't pull the neck all over the place either. Also using DR DDT's for drop D as well, on a 105 set, equally good results. The 105 set works with drop C, just a little too light

[charic]

just done a setup with my bass in this tuning and its working fine now, i dont 'like' playing with this low tension but it'll do for now!

Thanks for all the info guys,
Hopefully this thread will help other people too.

Incidentally my acg sounds.... nicer?!