Faulty cab problem

[lemmywinks]

I recently bought an EA CXL 110e and it upon testing it there seems to have been some damage in transit.

The cab is extremely quiet with no low end and some distortion even at the lowest volume, i contacted EA (they were very prompt, replied within an hour) and they had this to say:

[i]"The most probable cause is a damaged driver.

We have recone kits in stock that must be professionally installed. The retail price is $98.16 but we offer a 20% discount and you pay for shipping.

There is an alternate Neo driver that you can install that will reduce the weight of the cabinet by about 10 lbs. The retail price of the Wizzy10 Neo driver is $231.08 and the 20% discount is available. This driver uses a Whizzer cone and there is no tweeter."[/i]


So it looks like i'll be paying $80 + shipping for the official fix, plus any repair fee.

So......

1 - What is a recone kit?
2 - What drivers are in these cabs? Also can they be bought elsewhere?
3 - Are there any other options?

I was going to test it with a spare 10" driver i have to see if it definitely is the speaker at fault but i couldn't get the clips off, am i safe just to clip contacts onto the existing ones to attach the test driver (with the original one still wired in)?


Cheers!

[icastle]

[quote name='lemmywinks' post='1038420' date='Nov 26 2010, 11:27 PM']I recently bought an EA CXL 110e and it upon testing it there seems to have been some damage in transit.

The cab is extremely quiet with no low end and some distortion even at the lowest volume, i contacted EA (they were very prompt, replied within an hour) and they had this to say:

[i]"The most probable cause is a damaged driver.

We have recone kits in stock that must be professionally installed. The retail price is $98.16 but we offer a 20% discount and you pay for shipping.

There is an alternate Neo driver that you can install that will reduce the weight of the cabinet by about 10 lbs. The retail price of the Wizzy10 Neo driver is $231.08 and the 20% discount is available. This driver uses a Whizzer cone and there is no tweeter."[/i]


So it looks like i'll be paying $80 + shipping for the official fix, plus any repair fee.

So......

1 - What is a recone kit?
2 - What drivers are in these cabs? Also can they be bought elsewhere?
3 - Are there any other options?

I was going to test it with a spare 10" driver i have to see if it definitely is the speaker at fault but i couldn't get the clips off, am i safe just to clip contacts onto the existing ones to attach the test driver (with the original one still wired in)?


Cheers![/quote]

A recone kit consists of a replacement cone plus the coil which sits between the visible part of the speaker that we all recognise and goes into the magnet assembly.
Has to be fitted exactly square or else the coil will rub on the magnet assembly and is therefore outside the scope of DIY fitting really.

Not sure of the answer to 2) - never heard of them!

The other option would be to just fit a replacement driver of suitable size, impedance and power rating but this will probably cause a degradation in performance.

Does this unit not have any sort of warranty with it?
If it was damaged in transit then the courier company and\or vendor should be putting this right, not you!

[voxpop]

This is one of two CLX110 that I have sold here on Basschat. Both speaker cabs were purchased by two individuals who arranged thier own courier as I am fed up with things getting damaged in transit.
The speakers were bought by me from a fellow basschatter only 2 months ago and I have only used them for home rehearsal. The drive units and cabs were in fantastic working order when I used them.
One arrived save with the new owner and I believe he has not had a problem with his. This second one was packaged well by me and picked up by a UPS driver. It looks like it was thrown arround in transit and something has caused the driver to fail. Unfortunately lemmywinks only insured it for £50. He bought it from me for £175.

It is coming to the stage that I have totally fed up with f**king couriers damaging items. In the last year I have had this and two other items trashed by the postage system. I am comming to the conclusion that pickup only is the way to go or I will stop selling completely.

I really am sorry Lemmywinks that you are having problems.

[voxpop]

Try these guys........ [url="http://www.wembleyloudspeaker.com/"]http://www.wembleyloudspeaker.com/[/url]

[BassBod]

As a former (very happy) owner of these cabs......

I'm also very fed up of couriers damaging things, so I try very hard not to use them. EA are very good at service, but their drivers are pretty special items. A generic replacement probably doesn't exist, but I'd ask Mr Barefaced Alex Claber for some thoughts, as he will know what is obtainable in the UK and what the trade offs will be for various drivers in a transmission line cab. The lighter replacement EA driver is a good option (my only issue with these cabs was the weight) but it obviously costs a lot.

BUT - before you do anything else, check all the connections on the driver and the input panel. If the cabs been thrown around enough to damage the driver I'd expect to see real evidence of damage on the outside of the cab/packaging.

Best of luck

[lemmywinks]

Cheers for the replies guys, i'm going to give it a proper check over when I have time, I am going to wire in. My other driver to make sure it's that at fault

the cab wasn't obviously damaged and looked pretty much new when it arrived,

if I do replace the driver for a different one an advantage will be the weight, the speaker in this cab weighs as much as a family saloon!

[warwickhunt]

As there is no obvious structural damage to the cab I'd be surprised if the driver has failed as a result of being chucked around. From experience drivers are pretty robust, though other components may not be. I'd be inclined to check X-overs etc to see if anything has come loose and to ensure that it is the driver I'd fit it into a different cab and see if it is a 'fail'... alternatively bypass the wiring and x-over and try a direct connection to the back of the driver to see that it functions.

[markstuk]

+1... Consider how much they get shaken around when you're playing a low B through them :-)

[lemmywinks]

The box was really well packed and these cabs are built like tanks, they have a tough textured paint finish (it actually scuffed my work pants when I unwrapped it!) so I wouldn't expect any exterior damage, they really are that well built

one thing I did wonder about was if the package was jolted or had a tumble during transit which could cause driver damage

i'll have a proper look inside and detach the crossover during the week to test everything, hopefully it's just something worked loose. I did try to detach the speaker terminals but the appeared to be stuck fast. Would it be safe to attach a test speake onto them with the existing one still wired in?

[icastle]

[quote name='lemmywinks' post='1038853' date='Nov 27 2010, 03:03 PM']The box was really well packed and these cabs are built like tanks, they have a tough textured paint finish (it actually scuffed my work pants when I unwrapped it!) so I wouldn't expect any exterior damage, they really are that well built

one thing I did wonder about was if the package was jolted or had a tumble during transit which could cause driver damage

i'll have a proper look inside and detach the crossover during the week to test everything, hopefully it's just something worked loose. I did try to detach the speaker terminals but the appeared to be stuck fast. Would it be safe to attach a test speake onto them with the existing one still wired in?[/quote]

I wouldn't if I were you - you will end up changing the impedance by doing that and, unless you know the impedance of the cab and the driver you are going to use as a "tester") upset your amp.
Even getting just one lead off the speaker would suffice if you can manage it...

[lemmywinks]

Ok i disconnected the driver and wired it direct to a speakon, it's dead

I took all the internal gubbins out and wired in my spare driver (a Neo Celestion BN10-300S 4ohm) direct to a speakon and the cab sounds sweet, like a small version of my Schroeder 1212r. It's also less than half the weight which is a bonus


So, as i already have the BN10-300S earmarked for something, what would be suitable drivers for this cab?

Also, if i were to have the driver reconed would i be able to buy the parts elsewhere or are they specialist stuff? The only info on the cab says "1025 CXK / 105 -6"




One last thing, the driver is 4ohm and the tweeter is 8ohm, yet the cab is listed as 8ohm. Why is that?



Cheers for all the help so far guys!

[LawrenceH]

[quote name='lemmywinks' post='1041489' date='Nov 29 2010, 06:43 PM']One last thing, the driver is 4ohm and the tweeter is 8ohm, yet the cab is listed as 8ohm. Why is that?[/quote]

I may have missed something, but how do you know the driver is 4 ohms if it's dead?

The recone kit will need to be the advised one from EA since it's an Eminence driver built to their custom spec.

[lemmywinks]

Oh it says 4ohms n the edge of the driver!

[BassBod]

Sorry to hear about the dead driver....having used that cab for at least 6 years, I even feel a bit sad! But its very interesting that the driver is 4ohms. I used to use a pair with an Eden WT300, and it would overheat/shut down if pushed. Now I know why! Sorry Eden......

[warwickhunt]

[quote name='lemmywinks' post='1041596' date='Nov 29 2010, 08:25 PM']Oh it says 4ohms n the edge of the driver![/quote]


[quote name='BassBod' post='1041606' date='Nov 29 2010, 08:34 PM']Sorry to hear about the dead driver....having used that cab for at least 6 years, I even feel a bit sad! But its very interesting that the driver is 4ohms. I used to use a pair with an Eden WT300, and it would overheat/shut down if pushed. Now I know why! Sorry Eden......[/quote]

Not pointing fingers at all but it begs the question as to whether the driver is original?

Assuming it is meant to be an 8ohm cab (disregarding the horn) and has a 4 ohm driver in it then I'd have misgivings about the originality of the driver, which might impact on your choice of replacement!

[LawrenceH]

[quote name='BassBod' post='1041606' date='Nov 29 2010, 08:34 PM']Sorry to hear about the dead driver....having used that cab for at least 6 years, I even feel a bit sad! But its very interesting that the driver is 4ohms. I used to use a pair with an Eden WT300, and it would overheat/shut down if pushed. Now I know why! Sorry Eden......[/quote]

If they used 2.83v then at least that explains in part the implausibly high sensitivity spec for these speakers

[lemmywinks]

Yeah the driver says 4ohms and the tweeter says 8ohms, threw me a bit too!


I've spoken with a fella on TB who had one of these and replaced the driver for an Eminence Deltalite with good results so if one of those comes up then problem solved.

Tbh i'm not too keen on getting the original spec driver in there now, it's 20kg with it in and i reckon about 5kg with the neo speaker.

[BassBod]

I had two of them..very close serial nos. One bought new via Overwater..the other used from here, a few months later. No idea which of the two has just died.

Sounds like the weight saving will be worth the hassle, its a great sounding cab, but 34lbs was a bit much - its the only reason I sold them.

[Bigwan]

The 4 ohm rating of the driver doesn't mean anything since there's a crossover involved. The crossover design determines the ohmage rating of the cab. Use caution when selecting a replacement - an 8 ohm driver used with a crossover designed for a 4 ohm driver will give unpredictable results, impedance wise.

[LawrenceH]

[quote name='Bigwan' post='1042274' date='Nov 30 2010, 12:54 PM']The 4 ohm rating of the driver doesn't mean anything since there's a crossover involved. The crossover design determines the ohmage rating of the cab. Use caution when selecting a replacement - an 8 ohm driver used with a crossover designed for a 4 ohm driver will give unpredictable results, impedance wise.[/quote]

I doubt the crossover is going to make a difference down low where you typically get the impedence minimum that, as far as the amp's concerned, determines the effective cab impedence. But yes, an 8ohm driver will change the crossover frequency.

If it sounded good with the 4ohm Celestion I'd say go with one of those, they're cheaper than the Deltalites anyway, unless you specifically want an 8 ohm cab. Then just use the 8 ohm Celestion and don't worry too much about the crossover! It would be good to know the specs for the EA driver but I doubt you'll be able to find them.

[lemmywinks]

The crossover would be bypassed if i stick with a replacement neo speaker as the tweeter is on the back of the original driver, not mounted on the front of the cab like you'd expect

The reason i was interested in an Eminence unit was because of the guy from TB, he said it gave a really clear, crisp sound which is what i'm after. The Celestion i have in there at the moment is a very poky low-mid sound, much like my Schroeder, which is great but i wanted something a little more hifi (even though i hate using that phrase!)

Basically i want something which suits the cab and, being completely clueless about this sort of thing, figured if someone else had done it and it worked then there might be a good chance of me not cocking it up!

[LawrenceH]

[quote name='lemmywinks' post='1042400' date='Nov 30 2010, 02:20 PM']The crossover would be bypassed if i stick with a replacement neo speaker as the tweeter is on the back of the original driver, not mounted on the front of the cab like you'd expect

The reason i was interested in an Eminence unit was because of the guy from TB, he said it gave a really clear, crisp sound which is what i'm after. The Celestion i have in there at the moment is a very poky low-mid sound, much like my Schroeder, which is great but i wanted something a little more hifi (even though i hate using that phrase!)

Basically i want something which suits the cab and, being completely clueless about this sort of thing, figured if someone else had done it and it worked then there might be a good chance of me not cocking it up![/quote]

Ah, I see, sounds like it's a coaxial driver. The Em deltalite will give quite a boost around 1.5kHz to 3k, so you'll have pretty prominent mids compared to the Celestion. I wouldn't call it 'hifi' but if you equate hifi with mids that cut then it's probably what you're after! To get a proper 'hifi' (I agree, it's a rubbish phrase!) response you'd probably want some kind of tweeter in there, but to start with I'd see how you go with the deltalite II. If you were in Devon you could try one of mine out, but I'm guessing north-west doesn't mean Barnstaple!

[BassBod]

If its any help, I nearly always turned the tweeter right down. Nothing wrong with it, in fact it was a very musical one compared to SWR/Eden. I only really used it if I was amplifying acoustic guitar or vocal, and even then it was never more than half way up.

[lemmywinks]

Just a quick question. I messaged John at EA about fitting the Eminence and he had this to say:
[i]
"The Deltalite will fit in the CxL-110 cabinet in terms of Cabinet tuning but the voicing has a rising response from 1.3KHz to 2.5KHz about a 6 dB rise."[/i]

What does this mean in laymans terms?

Ta!

[BassBod]

I read that as a boost in midrange - although one mans honk is another mans growl - if you know what I mean. Maybe try boosting that frequency range on another amp and see if its agreeable?