Dingwall subliminal message!

[Grand Wazoo]

The bass in this clip is a Dingwall ABZ 5 and the video says it all

[thisnameistaken]

Where / what is the subliminal message?

[charic]

Hmmm I really want a dingwall now...

But I did before, so thats ok

[Grand Wazoo]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' post='1042230' date='Nov 30 2010, 12:32 PM']Where / what is the subliminal message? [/quote]


Well I didn't expect "everyone" to get it. Imagine what a world it would be if we were all that clever, aye?

[Prime_BASS]

All I get from that is that dingwalls low B is the only low B to have a long sustain.

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1042538' date='Nov 30 2010, 04:24 PM']All I get from that is that dingwalls low B is the only low B to have a long sustain.[/quote]

I did get a "If you are a bass player and feel you don't get enough attention, buy a really wonkey-looking bass" feeling briefly. Perhaps that was the subliminal message.

[waynepunkdude]

Good video, shame it's for such an unfortunate looking bass.


That groove in the background was nice.

[Jamesemt]

Wow, so much negativity!! The body shape looks good in the flesh, honest

[Grand Wazoo]

[quote name='Jamesemt' post='1047799' date='Dec 4 2010, 09:44 PM']Wow, so much negativity!! The body shape looks good in the flesh, honest [/quote]

Exactly, but hey, each to his own...

[Chris2112]

They're interesting enough basses but I find them to be a little bit...dated.

Dingwall and Novax were revolutionary when the fanned fret thing was new and exciting, and I can see it clearly has applications in things like 9 string basses and 8 string guitars (thinking of Rusty Cooley's 8 string Conklin and the issues he had with strings). But on a 4, 5 or 6 string bass? It's just overkill, a gimmick. Sure, it looks interesting and and doesn't detract from the playing experience, but the Dingwall basses I have played have been no more "even" in feel and tone across the strings then any other of the high end basses I have tried/owned.

Don't get me wrong, I am absolutely a stickler for "eveness" in a bass. The most "even" and balanced sounding of the basses I've owned (my ACG, my Kubicki Ex Factors and my Status Stealth bass) beat Dingwall in this respect. Thats one of the first things I look for when I try a bass: do the strings feel balanced and even? Do they sound balanced? Is one louder or quieter than the rest? Basses with a piano-like quality appeal to me. Dingwall have been good at producing this effect, but not spectacular.

The reason I think they're a bit dated is because the whole "solid low B" phenomenon is old hat. I do recall at the start of this millenium when getting a powerful low B sound was all the rage and was seemingly the first thing mentioned about every 5 or 6 string bass going. There was something of paradigm shift after a couple of years when everyone suddenly realised that 35" scale wasn't the be-all and end-all of getting a good low B sound. I remember a discussion on Talkbass where there was a picture of a bloke from the Fodera website holding his new 33" 6 string Fodera Matt Garrison bass. People were commenting on this bass, stating that they expected the low B to sound flat and feel flabby.

There was a revelation when it transpired that a well made bass with good pickups that [i]wasn't[/i] 35" scale could have a good low B. People have even accepted that 33" scale low B's can sound good - I never thought I'd see the day back then!


And so, this whole race to chase the ultimate, tunderous low B has fallen a bit flat. As it stands, Dingwall don't offer much appealing to me, although I do think they should concentrate on their best stuff - beautifully crafted boutique instruments - as thats the niche they best fill to me.

[Schnozzalee]

I like dingwalls, just bugs me they couldn't make a pickup with was diagonal and in line with the bridge (if you know what i mean). Really wanna try one.

[JordanRLS]

I think it looks pretty good really, I like it. Never played a bass with fanned frets, I imagine it takes a fair bit of getting used to...

[Chris2112]

[quote name='Schnozzalee' post='1047864' date='Dec 4 2010, 11:32 PM']I like dingwalls, just bugs me they couldn't make a pickup with was diagonal and in line with the bridge (if you know what i mean). Really wanna try one.[/quote]


I recall that the pickups are slanted like this to get the signal from what is effectively the same point on every string (and some other guff about harmonic nodes etc etc). I suppose it's already optimised in terms of position and it won't be changing!

[Grand Wazoo]

Ok guys I'd like to explain how I got to own a Dingwall and what happened to me ever since.

Up to that day I tried one, I was an Ernie Ball MM afficionado, I had the Bongo 5, the Stingray 5, the 25th Anniversary 5, and lately the Big Al 5.

Like most of you here I had heard about these a couple of years ago but never had a hands on experience with them, and thought to myself, hmmm... I'd like to try one of those one day and see what the fuss is all about. However at least here in London there is only one shop that sells them and that is the Bass Gallery in Camden, that part of London is not within easy reach to me so I never had the chance to actually go there and try one.

Fast forward to last August, when I was looking for some Mark Bass pedals to try and after a few phonecalls, I had found that the only place that actually stocks the whole Mark Bass range, including the Mo-Mark lego block amps and components was infact the Gallery in Camdem, so I decided to take a day off and get on a train to go there without worrying about parking meters, wardens etc etc.

Went in there spoke to Alex and asked to try this and that pedal, and thought about killing two birds with one stone I also asked to try the two Dingwall they had in stock one was the canadian made ABZ 5 in natural swamp ash and the other a Combustion (made in China with the same canadian made factory pickups)

I was so immediately taken by the ABZ 5 that within 10 minutes that bass completely changed my whole prospective on all the basses I owned at the time. Bear in mind I had no preconception, just like any of you here, I had no idea what to expect, whether to like them or loath them, hence I was prepared for either reactions, but I just had to see it for myself, right? It is very much a personal thing.

Anyway, long story short I A/B'd both the Canadian and the Chinese and they were galaxies apart as far as I am concerned, while the ABZ you could play so very easily and with the minimum effort, the fanned fret did not pose any impediment to any of my average playing skills, so if a debutant like me can get on with it without batting an eyelid, perhaps those of you more gifted will also feel right at home with it. Another peculiar thing is to do with these pickups: the bass is passive! The pickups are neodymium humbuckers, and by God that are so powerful that its hard to believe. One of my amps has 2 inputs like most amps, one for passive basses and one for active ones. Well if I plug this Dingwall in the passive input the amp clips at the same volume as if I was to plug it into the active input.

There are loads of innovation in this bass that go unnoticed at first look, the bridge for a start, it's a very clever one, instead of a having string saddles you have 2 rounded screws that you can raise up and down like a saddle, making the bridge a lot lighter and providing the best string to wood dynamic response. You can read more about it [u][b][url="http://www.dingwallguitars.com/bridge-on-afterburner-series/?phpMyAdmin=b918c322aafee3d28396a31091a36a76"]HERE[/url][/b][/u]
Another innovation is in the headstock design, which is quite flat and straight in the direction of the strings, this makes the headstock much stronger but such construction would normally require a string retainer to provide the correct tension at the nut. Dingwall cleverly designed countersunk tuning pegs at the correct angle: clever and functional without ugly string trees or bars.

In compariosn the Chines Combustion felt more like a very bad Indonesian copy of it and I was not at all taken by it as I was with the ABZ 5. It was also a lot heavier. This ABZ weighs only 7.12lbs and the Combustion was at least 2lbs heavier. I also hated the Combustion's colour, it was a yucky lyme green. I gave it back to Alex and said right I am taking this one home, the ABZ 5. And that was it.

Up to that day I had always thought that the Music Man necks and sounds were the best thing since sliced bread but 10 minutes into playing that ABZ made me re-think the whole idea and now I cannot touch a Music Man again, so much so that I ended up selling the lot of them, except the Big Al which is proving hard to shift [i][b](Make me a sensible offer, I can deliver it free too)[/b][/i].

One thing its for sure the Big Al now sleeps with the fishes in its original case and it has not been out since August 13th. The Dingwall on the other hand, has become my perfect companion, I cannot bring myself to play [b]any[/b] other 5 strings bass, the only other basses I find myself comfortable with are my 4 string Squier's

Believe it or not, it's not hype! And its not at all a bit dated like Chris2112 said. Not one bit.

I am not trying to convince anyone, I would have no interest, I am not the "fanboi" type, I just went to try one for myself with an open mind, and ultimately we must all appreciate that a bass can either be one man's poison or meat, but I really stress that you try one before shooting judgement based on fanboi internet "hearsay" which is the worst kind of hearsay there is.

Cheers

[Chris2112]

If it works for you then by all means, thats fantastic. I do think the fanned fret thing is a bit "emperor's new clothes". It will stay as a nice novelty but I don't think it'll change the world.

I'm a bit disappointed to hear about the dodgy Combustion bass though, if you're referring to the same one as the Gallery have in at the moment it's listed at £1200!

[EBS_freak]

I don't think it's dated. In fact, when it comes to Chris' gear, I would say his gear is pretty dated. And before anybody says, the ACG filter is nothing new... Alembic and Wal were there first... The whole thing is, it doesn't matter if something is dated. Hell, Js and Ps are pretty dated right?

I have a lot of time for Dingwall... whether you believe the hype (or whatever you want to call it) you can't knock them for coming up with something new and trying to break the conventional. I played Dave Swift's new Dingwall and whilst it wasn't for me, it was a stunningly made beautiful instrument with some gorgeous timbers. I'm not sold on the 36" B and all that... I have equally good if not better Bs... but hey, that doesn't matter. Different strokes, different folks and all that.

[Chris2112]

[quote name='EBS_freak' post='1047947' date='Dec 5 2010, 01:43 AM']I don't think it's dated. In fact, when it comes to Chris' gear, I would say his gear is pretty dated. And before anybody says, the ACG filter is nothing new... Alembic and Wal were there first... The whole thing is, it doesn't matter if something is dated. Hell, Js and Ps are pretty dated right?[/quote]


The ACG filter preamp may seem dated, but even then the idea of a filter preamp is still streets ahead of a typical EQ in terms of flexibility. They're definitely different animals, but I'd class them as a fantastic innovation. They're very well spoken of in Wal, Alembic and ACG basses too - but given that bassists are typically stick-in-the-mud Fender J/P players I wouldn't be surprised that such innovation has been overlooked for more than 20 years!

And the Kubicki, depsite being a 25 year old design is still far ahead of most basses made today in terms of technology!

Good ideas are good ideas, irrespective of whether or not they gain large scale popularity. My view on the fanned fret thing is that it's interesting, but not incredibly...useful? As I've said before, I've played basses with a more even feel and tone than Dingwall had with "old fashioned" frets!

[EBS_freak]

[quote name='Chris2112' post='1047950' date='Dec 5 2010, 01:49 AM']The ACG filter preamp may seem dated, but even then the idea of a filter preamp is still streets ahead of a typical EQ in terms of flexibility. They're definitely different animals, but I'd class them as a fantastic innovation. They're very well spoken of in Wal, Alembic and ACG basses too - but given that bassists are typically stick-in-the-mud Fender J/P players I wouldn't be surprised that such innovation has been overlooked for more than 20 years!

And the Kubicki, depsite being a 25 year old design is still far ahead of most basses made today in terms of technology!

Good ideas are good ideas, irrespective of whether or not they gain large scale popularity. My view on the fanned fret thing is that it's interesting, but not incredibly...useful? As I've said before, I've played basses with a more even feel and tone than Dingwall had with "old fashioned" frets![/quote]

Not suggesting that they aren't flexible... I know that they are. The main reason they haven't taken the market by storm like your treble/bass or mid/treble/bass systems is that are are not as straightforward to make a quick change. Want a smidgen more mid? Well, you can't really do that easily, you are probably better off turning around and pushing the mids a little on the amp. In the studio and where you have the ability to fine tune your sound, then yeah, they make perfect sense. You really have to have spent a lot of time with your filter circuit to get it behaving exactly how you want... and to be honest, most players want to plug in and play and not go through the learning curve of understanding the filters.

Kubicki is Kubicki. They are what they are. If you want one, get one. A bit like a Dingwall really. These are Delorian basses... maybe not the be all and end all, but they do have a certain charm

Your view is your view. Speak to a Dingwall owner and their view is bound to be different. Kinda a pointless debate really. What do I think of it? (in case anybody cares?) Well, I haven't got an opinion on it really. If you dig it, great. If you don't, great.

Edited December 5, 2010 by EBS_freak

[ThomBassmonkey]

I've played a couple of conbustions and really liked them, I love the jazz style necks on them and I was GASing heavily for one, there are a couple of things that put me off though.

I tried one in Bass Direct a while back and it felt and sounded lovely (through a GB amp), though the 2nd one I tried was through my amp and it didn't quite have the sound I wanted. It might have been the bass (deader strings maybe) and to be fair to it I didn't really play with the EQ, so I've not written them off for that. The other thing is that the B is actually 37", not 36" (on the combustion, I think the higer ranges can be 33-35" scales) which makes the E over 36". While it works and because of the way the frets fan, it doesn't feel as long as you'd expect, it is definitely still harder work than a 34" or 35" if you're riffing on the E or B strings which I don't feel is really needed when there's shorter scale basses that sound and feel brilliant on those low strings.

As a result I'm now GASing for something else, maybe a Sandberg but I'm still open to options.

[Grand Wazoo]

[quote name='Chris2112' post='1047946' date='Dec 5 2010, 01:38 AM']If it works for you then by all means, thats fantastic. I do think the fanned fret thing is a bit "emperor's new clothes". It will stay as a nice novelty but I don't think it'll change the world.

I'm a bit disappointed to hear about the dodgy Combustion bass though, if you're referring to the same one as the Gallery have in at the moment it's listed at £1200![/quote]

Yes if its a lyme green that's the one, you see what I mean about different strokes for different folks, some people like the Combustion, I didn't! Now that is my take on it, other people might like them.

[stingrayPete1977]

The only thing I dont get is the selling of everything else? Like Russ I loved Dave swifts Dingwall at bassday, excellent build quality (I think everyman and his dog played it that day!). And dont really have an opinion one way or the other on dingwalls as such but I cant ever imagine having just one bass though, Even if you could get the exact MM tone from one (Which you cant obviously) the whole feel of a Ric,MM,P or a Jazz etc makes you play in a different way that enhances the sound to get what your after. I cant imagine rocking out with a pick on a dingwall on stage at wembley like I could with a ricky or grooving motown style on a phat P bass etc. Im really not knocking the DW (My thoughts apply to every make and model available) I just dont see why you would want to sell everything else thats all?

[Prime_BASS]

I totally understand where you are coming from.

At the Notts bass bash I played a very very nice Wood & tronics Klimt, it was amazing to play it was like a bass epiphiny.

I could have ordered one but in the end I like my bass to have a bit of imperfect character about them, and the W&T left me a bit cold.

[Grand Wazoo]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' post='1048214' date='Dec 5 2010, 01:45 PM']The only thing I dont get is the selling of everything else? Like Russ I loved Dave swifts Dingwall at bassday, excellent build quality (I think everyman and his dog played it that day!). And dont really have an opinion one way or the other on dingwalls as such but I cant ever imagine having just one bass though, Even if you could get the exact MM tone from one (Which you cant obviously) the whole feel of a Ric,MM,P or a Jazz etc makes you play in a different way that enhances the sound to get what your after. I cant imagine rocking out with a pick on a dingwall on stage at wembley like I could with a ricky or grooving motown style on a phat P bass etc. Im really not knocking the DW (My thoughts apply to every make and model available) I just dont see why you would want to sell everything else thats all?[/quote]


Everything else I have sold - in my case - was the other 5 string basses because since I have been playing the Dingwall the other fiver really don't cut the mustard no more and have become sencond rate, again... [b]to me![/b]

As for a phat P sound I get that well covered with my modded Classic Vibe 51's and 60's. For a Jazzy sound I presently have that taken care by my CV Moo Jazz, which will soon also be obsolete when my new Dingwall Super J arrives.

Edited December 5, 2010 by Grand Wazoo

[Chris2112]

[quote name='stingrayPete1977' post='1048214' date='Dec 5 2010, 01:45 PM']I just dont see why you would want to sell everything else thats all?[/quote]


I guess it's kind of like buying a Lakland and being able to get rid of you Fender P and J and your Stingray. I can totally understand people feeling this strongly about basses. I'll never be without a Kubicki X Factor again, for a start!

[Vibrating G String]

[quote name='Chris2112' post='1047946' date='Dec 4 2010, 05:38 PM']I do think the fanned fret thing is a bit "emperor's new clothes".[/quote]
I agree completely, and after hearing a number of supposed benefits this "technique" offers it's odd to see the commercial only says it has better sustain.