Want bass to sound funkier

[cheddatom]

IMO playing near the bridge doesn't give you more treble, it just cuts some bass to give you more of a mid-punch than a low-thump.

Treble is "click, clack, zip, scrape" etc

I've never played a bass that naturally lacked treble, as IMO this is down to new strings and your technique. I've played lots of basses that seemed incapable of transfering the treble to my rig (it's a bi-amp with guitar amp so i'm pretty sure i'd hear it if it was there).

Personally, for my funky or slap sounds, I prefer to play nearer the neck for plenty of thump, but I add in plenty of treble using my pedals and amp.

[zero9]

[quote name='derrenleepoole' post='1043372' date='Dec 1 2010, 09:30 AM']Before you go down the whole route of do I need a new amp, bass, strings etc., there is something that you can do that will help determine which route to go to help you get the sound you require.

I was always taught by my old teacher (Steve Berry of Loose Tubes) that the tone of any instrument should always be determined without an amplifier. Why? An amplifier will always do it's job, regardless of the instrument. Sure, some amps colour the sound, but understanding how your tone is before you get to the amp stage will help enormously. I NEVER try out a bass in a shop through an amp, because all you're doing is trying out the amp and not the bass!

If I were you, I'd get myself in a nice quite room, get the bass out, and simply play the help out of it acoustically. See if you can get the tone your after this way. It's worth noting that the way you play will have a huge impact on your tone as well. So finger placement, attack etc, will all play a huge part, not just the bass.

If you can get a reasonable tone acoustically, then it should be a simple case of getting an good amp to deliver that tone, but at volume. It's possible that the amp you're using is making the tone worse. If in doubt, level off all the EQ settings to flat and start with fresh ears. If you're getting a sound you like through your bass, but not your amp, you know where the problem lies.[/quote]

+1

Unless the pickups are knackered, however, everything being well I couldn't agree more.

[derrenleepoole]

[quote name='zero9' post='1043758' date='Dec 1 2010, 01:45 PM']+1

Unless the pickups are knackered, however, everything being well I couldn't agree more.[/quote]

Good point! No point in having an ace bass with great acoustic tone if the pickups are poo!

[zero9]

[quote name='derrenleepoole' post='1043771' date='Dec 1 2010, 01:51 PM']Good point! No point in having an ace bass with great acoustic tone if the pickups are poo! [/quote]

I always loved the sound from my 'p' bass acoustically, but it wasn't until I put better pup's on it when I realised it's full potential.

[algmusic]

Most of the time I play funkier stuff. I think about using the bridge pickup more, and the front less and the play closer to the bridge is a big thing.. I agree with derrenleepoole points, but I also think the fingers (both hands) have a lot to play in this aswell, far more than people think. Feel is important. If you add these things together, you'll get a better sound, then over time you might realise you need better gear. But good gear doesn't mean good sound. If you but Nathan East on an old £50 Westfield, he will still sound like nathan east, brilliant

[mrtcat]

A handful of lessons with a good teacher can really help here too. A decent teacher will be able to give you some pointers on how to get close to the sound you're after. He/she should also be able to tell you if your gear is holding you back. Beyond that I firmly believe practice and experimentation will be your biggest help.

A friend of mine went and bought the exact same gear as a youtube bass player he was really into but couldn't get anywhere near the sound of his idol. It's 99% in the fingers IMO

[derrenleepoole]

I think feel is key more than anything else. Funk playing is as much about what you don't play as what you do play. The phrasing and timing are everything. Tone is almost an after thought really. Think about early funk recordings, bassists with nothing more than a P or J bass, probably with worn strings and a big phat amp. No fancy preamps, tone circuits etc.

I think many starting out musicians come unstuck with gear choice. There's a perception that better gear equals immediate improvement in tone etc. This is simply not true. If you don't know how to get the best out of the gear you have, what hope will you have with something more expensive? Don't get me wrong, expensive pro gear is great if you can afford it. But how many posts are we seeing appearing on here of late praising the likes of ubber cheap gear like Westfield and SX etc?

I think getting your head around good tone from ANY instrument will help in the long run, more than shelling out for 'this' amp and 'that bass etc.

If a new bass is on the horizon, the one model that will get you that 'funkier' sound is more than likely a Stingray styled instrument.

[Horizontalste]

Just a point, earlier you mentioned changing things around on the bridge. Did you put it back where it should be? the saddles need to be right in order for the notes to be in the right place on the neck.

[zero9]

[quote name='610*c' post='1044008' date='Dec 1 2010, 04:41 PM']Just a point, earlier you mentioned changing things around on the bridge. Did you put it back where it should be? the saddles need to be right in order for the notes to be in the right place on the neck.[/quote]

+1

If you're inexperienced about setting up your bass, you may not be getting the most out of it. You mention that strings don't sound even (muted E etc). I would try to find someone locally to check over your bass to ensure it's set up properly.

Good luck.

[Pete Academy]

As previously mentioned, it's mainly in the fingers.

First and foremost I would work on technique.

[Prime_BASS]

Reading through this thread there is a lot or subjective opinions, not a bad thing but then again you say funkier sound.

Could you provide some examples, youtube links???

It'd be a lot easier to give advice once we know what you are aiming for.

Knowing what you have helps, which you've done but I don't know much of anything about Wesley basses, all we really now is to know though is what it's pickups(2xsingle coil, split coil, humbucker)

It's true that "tone is in the fingers" I didn't really get my desired finger playing sound until I'd practiced for good long while and built my finger strength. Also the right EQing can work wonders. However you can't make chickens fly.

intonation: the notes at the 12th fret should be the same as the notes when played open.

[Fat Rich]

You could also try raising the pickups a little, if they're way too low that might muffle the sound a little. Maybe your bass needs a setup generally.

Funk is all in the fingers as has been said already.... try playing closer to the bridge, more bridge pickup than neck pickup, more tension in your plucking fingers particularly the finger joints nearest your nails, try digging in a bit more (but not till it hurts) and make sure you're fretting the notes cleanly with your other hand (close to the fret but not right over it or you'll get a muted sound).

Muted notes are very important too, try playing some of your existing grooves but keep a 16th note pulse running through with muted notes wherever you're not playing an actual note. Start off with too many muted notes then experiment taking some (or probably most) of them out till it really groooves.

For funk playing timing and muting is all important, make sure you're not just starting the notes in time but also stopping them in time too with no strings or harmonics ringing in the background. To start off, concentrate on playing cleanly and precisely, then when you've found the funk you can tastefully add some slop here and there to make it super funky!

And listen to as much funk music as possible.

Good luck!

[xilddx]

The thing is, funk is NOT a sound. You can be funky on a cardboard box.

The OP is after a SOUND. He wants a more trebly sound. Strings may help for a few weeks until they lose their top end, or if his current strings are ancient.

If turning the tone and treble all the way up on the bass and amp is not working, it could be a pup height problem, could be where he is playing the strings, could be an electrical fault, could be anything really.

I think his best bet is what someone else suggested and take it to a shop and see what it sounds like through another amp, and if it's the same then get the guy in the shop's opinion. Not in Denmark Street of course.

[lojo]

I may have missed a post, but has the OP been able to sound more funky on anything else he has tried, at a friends, in a shop etc, at least the would go some way to limit it to his gear over fingers

Try your bass in another amp etc, try to narrow it down, otherwise you may spend out and not get anywhere

[obi 2 kenobi]

[quote name='funky_numba' post='1043211' date='Dec 1 2010, 12:44 AM']Hi all,

I've only been playing bass for a few months now. I use a second hand Wesley bass I use but it's been a great help for learning.

I've been watching a lot of bass covers on youtube.. mainly funk/ jazz based music. I love that type of sound but what's driving me nuts is that I cannot reproduce that bright funky tone on my own bass.. even with the new swing strings I bought. Don't get me wrong.. they are A LOT better than the ones I got with the bass but the tone seems a bit 'muddy' compared to the ones on the youtube vids . I currently have Rotosound 40 60 80 100 roundwound Swing Strings.

Apart from buying a new bass.. I would just like to know how I can alter the sound. I've put the tone up full, but no joy. Do I need different strings.. Elixir, Ernie Ball Super Slinkys, blah blah. What about Jazz pickups? Will that alter the sound by much.

Any help is much appreciated!!



Buy a stingray dude. Problem solved

Paul.[/quote]

[MoonBassAlpha]

There must be some BassChat funksters in Glasgow, surely?
Why doesn't someone pm the guy and offer to look at his gear and sound for him?
I would if he was in my neck of the woods. C'mon folks!

Oh yeah, and some links to clips of what you're striving towards sound-wise would be a big help too, OP.

[goblin]

[quote name='funky_numba' post='1043239' date='Dec 1 2010, 01:54 AM']What kinda pickup have you got on you bass?[/quote]

Using rotosound swingbass 66 at 95 - 35 on the Jazz, and on the Wal and Warwick they're 100 - 40.

Pickups on the Jazz are bog standard Vintage 35s and the Warwick's got a pair of active EMGs.

As for setting intonation, when the jazz arrived, the E strings was really dead, even new strings didn't help. I lowered the action as far as I could before I'd be getting fret buzz, and then to set the intonation you adjust the saddles (on mine it's just a case of a philips screw driver going up the bottom of the bridge). As soon as the 12th fret harmonic sounds exactly the same as the note on each string, the intonation's perfectly set

[funky_numba]

[quote name='zero9' post='1043778' date='Dec 1 2010, 01:54 PM']I always loved the sound from my 'p' bass acoustically, but it wasn't until I put better pup's on it when I realised it's full potential.[/quote]

Hi Zero9,

I hardly use my amp when practicing. I plug my bass into my pc soundcard (it's a very good soundcard btw). I have various apps at my disposal to tweek the sound but I still cannot get that sweet funky sound. I think I may be flogging a dead horse trying to find THAT sound, especially if I have cheap pups to start with.

I don't know what make the pups are but I've been looking around the net and have heard some soundbites of reasonably priced pups that give THAT sound.

What pups did you have originally and what ones did you upgrade to? Do you have a 'popular' bass to start with?

Thanks for your help.

Funky_Numba

[funky_numba]

[quote name='610*c' post='1044008' date='Dec 1 2010, 04:41 PM']Just a point, earlier you mentioned changing things around on the bridge. Did you put it back where it should be? the saddles need to be right in order for the notes to be in the right place on the neck.[/quote]

What do you mean 'put in the right order'? I was under the impression that the bass gets tuned initially with the guitar tuning pegs but the 'fine-tuning' and the action is done by adjusting the saddles/ bridge screws.

I am lost now!! Please advise!!

Thanks.
Funky_Numba

[funky_numba]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1044274' date='Dec 1 2010, 08:22 PM']Reading through this thread there is a lot or subjective opinions, not a bad thing but then again you say funkier sound.

Could you provide some examples, youtube links???

It'd be a lot easier to give advice once we know what you are aiming for.

Knowing what you have helps, which you've done but I don't know much of anything about Wesley basses, all we really now is to know though is what it's pickups(2xsingle coil, split coil, humbucker)

It's true that "tone is in the fingers" I didn't really get my desired finger playing sound until I'd practiced for good long while and built my finger strength. Also the right EQing can work wonders. However you can't make chickens fly.

intonation: the notes at the 12th fret should be the same as the notes when played open.[/quote]

Hiya Prime_BASS

Thanks for the update.

Here are some of the Youtube links I found and :

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7nfC7kWBAQ"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7nfC7kWBAQ[/url]

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgyutFJKwPA"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgyutFJKwPA[/url]

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_t21IZrWo0"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_t21IZrWo0[/url]

Btw.. I don't understand what you mean by saying 'the notes at the 12th fret should be the same as the notes when played open'. Please explain.

Many thanks!

Funky_Numba

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

[quote name='funky_numba' post='1055570' date='Dec 12 2010, 12:16 AM']What do you mean 'put in the right order'? I was under the impression that the bass gets tuned initially with the guitar tuning pegs but the 'fine-tuning' and the action is done by adjusting the saddles/ bridge screws.

I am lost now!! Please advise!!

Thanks.
Funky_Numba[/quote]
If you've been fine-tuning it at the bridge, the bass will now be playing out of tune as you've have bollocksed up the intonation. Have a look at this: [url="http://www.garywillis.com/pages/bass/bassmanual/setupmanual.html"]http://www.garywillis.com/pages/bass/bassm...etupmanual.html[/url]

You need to get the bridge set up properly for the strings you are using & for your playing style . Then you won't touch the bridge again unless you start using a different type of strings.

[funky_numba]

[quote name='goblin' post='1045856' date='Dec 3 2010, 12:16 AM']Using rotosound swingbass 66 at 95 - 35 on the Jazz, and on the Wal and Warwick they're 100 - 40.

Pickups on the Jazz are bog standard Vintage 35s and the Warwick's got a pair of active EMGs.

As for setting intonation, when the jazz arrived, the E strings was really dead, even new strings didn't help. I lowered the action as far as I could before I'd be getting fret buzz, and then to set the intonation you adjust the saddles (on mine it's just a case of a philips screw driver going up the bottom of the bridge). As soon as the 12th fret harmonic sounds exactly the same as the note on each string, the intonation's perfectly set [/quote]

I had the same problem. I lowered the action on the e-string and get fret buzz.

I think I have passive pups on my bass. I still don't get the intonation thing.. the 12th fret harmonic????

Thanks for your help.

[LawrenceH]

[quote name='funky_numba' post='1055596' date='Dec 12 2010, 12:46 AM']I had the same problem. I lowered the action on the e-string and get fret buzz.

I think I have passive pups on my bass. I still don't get the intonation thing.. the 12th fret harmonic????

Thanks for your help.[/quote]

The frets on a bass guitar neck are spaced apart according to a mathematical formula. It's designed so that once an open string is in tune, when you fret the string those notes will also be in tune. For example, if I play an open E on a perfectly set up bass, then when I play the first fret on the same string it will play an F, second fret F# etc.

However, the formula relies on there being a set 'scale length' (not the same as a musical scale). That is, the fret spacing only works if the string is a certain length from the nut to the bridge end (typically 34 inches). If it's the wrong length, then if I tune it to E open, when I play the first fret instead of being an F it will be a slightly flat or sharp F depending on if the string is too long or too short. This problem will get worse with each successive fret, so by the time I hit the twelfth fret which should be an E again one octave higher, it will sound very out of tune indeed.

The way to solve this problem is to change the length of the string by adjusting the bridge saddles back and forth. We don't do this to tune the instrument routinely (although confusingly you do on a cello or similar), we just use it to set the intonation. Day to day tuning on a bass guitar is done with the pegs.

One way of checking the intonation when setting it is to use the 12th fret harmonic and to compare it to the note when fretting at the 12th fret to make sure they're exactly the same. To play a harmonic, very lightly touch your finger on the string exactly over the 12th fret line, and whilst your finger is touching the string at that point only,play the string. You will hear an octave harmonic, a note that resonates one octave higher than the open string despite the fact that you haven't pressed down behind the fret. Now when you fret the note at the 12th and play it normally, you should hear the same note.

If the note you hear when fretting is flat compared to the harmonic, then you need to move the bridge saddle towards the neck (shorten the string). If the fretted note is sharp compared to the harmonic, you need to move the bridge saddle away from the neck (lengthen the string). Note that for various reasons the correct exact length of each string from nut to bridge will be slightly different for each string, so you need to do this individually for all four strings.

If you don't yet trust your ear enough to do this with harmonics, you can instead use an electronic tuner to check the intonation just by tuning the open E string, for example, then playing the 12th fret and seeing if it's also an E. If it's sharp, lengthen the string, if it's flat, shorten it, as before. However if you do this method you need to re-tune the open string between each adjustment.

Hope that is helpful. The best way by far to understand this is to have a teacher show you! It's a LOT easier to understand by demonstration!

[LawrenceH]

[quote name='funky_numba' post='1043231' date='Dec 1 2010, 01:40 AM']I normally play thru my pc soundcard however, I have a second hand TEC20B Starfire bass practice amp which I bought with the bass. It has a few pots .. 1 low, 2 mids and 1 high (i think) but they seem to make little if any difference to the sound. I wonder if the bass amp is gubbed!!! My bass still sounds 'muddy' through that amp.[/quote]

Oh yeah. Does your bass have a battery in? If so then running through the soundcard is probably ok. But if not, then it will always sound 'dead' through a soundcard because of impedance mismatch unless the soundcard has an input specifically for guitar. But really, it's very hard to diagnose if this is worth sorting out over the internet. If you're ever in Edinburgh send me a PM and I can help you out.

[funky_numba]

[quote name='goblin' post='1045856' date='Dec 3 2010, 12:16 AM']Using rotosound swingbass 66 at 95 - 35 on the Jazz, and on the Wal and Warwick they're 100 - 40.

Pickups on the Jazz are bog standard Vintage 35s and the Warwick's got a pair of active EMGs.

As for setting intonation, when the jazz arrived, the E strings was really dead, even new strings didn't help. I lowered the action as far as I could before I'd be getting fret buzz, and then to set the intonation you adjust the saddles (on mine it's just a case of a philips screw driver going up the bottom of the bridge). As soon as the 12th fret harmonic sounds exactly the same as the note on each string, the intonation's perfectly set [/quote]

I'm totally lost! What's with the 12th fret harmonic thing??