Combining 8x10 and 115 cabs

[Steve Spector]

I know this may sound a bit daft, but apart from the weight issue is there any reason not to hook up an 810 and 115 cab together? Would it be pointless or even not work?
Steve

[DirkThrust]

You've pretty much answered the question already. It would work but be almost completely pointless.

Assuming they are both 8 ohm you would be feeding half your amp's power into each cab which would not be the best use of the watts available to you. You would be far better off putting it all into the 8x10

You would also be mixing cabs that aren't designed to be used together and the results would be unpredictable due to mixing cabs with different drivers, tonal characteristics, frequency responces etc.

OTOH what really matters is how it sounds to you so give it a try and you may like the result

EDIT Actually it would be a bit louder using both because you would be getting the full juice out of your amp but I think the difference would be tiny and almost inaudible and the possible drawbacks would outweigh any possible benefit

Edited December 25, 2010 by AndyMartin

[umph]

8x10 is alot louder than a 1x15 so you wont get any sonic benefits

[ahpook]

if you're wondering this on xmas morning i can only think that santa brought you a pretty darn sizeable present !!

[Steve Spector]

[quote name='ahpook' post='1069232' date='Dec 25 2010, 01:00 PM']if you're wondering this on xmas morning i can only think that santa brought you a pretty darn sizeable present !!

[/quote]

Pure coincidence! I've been looking at a new setup for a while. Was looking at a 410 and 115, but saw an 810 for a decent price and got me thinking. Sounds like it'd be pretty pointless.
On the other hand I'm not that keen on the idea of just an 810 as I like quite a deep boomy sound and wonder if I'd miss the 15".

Steve

[DirkThrust]

A 15 won't necessarily go deeper or boomier than a 4x10. We've been sold the idea that you need a 4x10 with a 15 underneath to produce the lows by speaker manufacturers for some time now but forget the idea that a 15 will go lower than a 4x10 because with modern speakers it's simply not correct.

Edited December 25, 2010 by AndyMartin

[JMT3781]

Just think of the difference if you add it up... 80 inches of speaker pushing air as opposed to 15 inches. In my mind, that means the 15 won't keep up, and you are wasting watts on powering it..

[JTUK]

Useless idea....

[Steve Spector]

[quote name='JTUK' post='1069321' date='Dec 25 2010, 08:15 PM']Useless idea....[/quote]

Thanks for the reply, but to be honest any reply that's not backed up by some sort of reason is not of any interest to me - I'm here to learn after all. If you carry on with "Useless idea ... because..." that would be great.
Thanks
Steve

[Mr. Foxen]

There is a lot more air stuck to the 10" speakers than the 15, so the same amount of power will move correspondingly more air. That means it will both be louder and that it will be able to more otal air when it is at maximum. This means the 8x10 will totally drown out the sound of the 15 tearing itself to shreds. Actually, if you had an entirely seperate amp and a really good 15 in a really ideal box, made just to put out lower frequencies than an 8x10 can, so basically a 3015LF loaded subwoofer, possibly a horn one, and ran it with its own amp and crossover, it could add useful content, bt you might as well not use an 8x10 then, and use something more suitable.

[Phil Starr]

first why do it? Most 4x10's will be loud enough for anything and an 8x10 will be loud enough for anything. The 15 will struggle to be heard so any tonal differences will be marginal. If you like the sound of the 8x and don't mind transporting it then go for it. If you don't like the sound then you won't change it by adding other speakers.

By the way it is the area that determines sound output ,all else being equal, so one 15 = about 3.5 10's

[bumnote]

[quote name='Phil Starr' post='1069397' date='Dec 25 2010, 11:30 PM']By the way it is the area that determines sound output ,all else being equal, so one 15 = about 3.5 10's[/quote]

could you explain a bit further? i know the moving part of the speaker isnt actually 15" but if the area of a circle is pi r squared then my maths makes a 15 at 176 sq ins and 2 10s at 157.

Ta

[Mr. Foxen]

It isn't an espcially useful way of looking at it, there is a bunch of other factors involved, all else is never equal. 2x10 and a 15 are sort of comparable in sensitivity as a horrific generalisation (volume to power), but there is more to it. Porting a cab adds a bunch of sensitivity, and 15s are often ported and 8x10s often aren't.

[url="http://barefacedbass.com/technical-information.htm"]Have a look here.[/url] And browse about the rest of the site, lots of tech nerding there.

[DirkThrust]

[quote name='Steve Spector' post='1069384' date='Dec 25 2010, 11:03 PM']Thanks for the reply, but to be honest any reply that's not backed up by some sort of reason is not of any interest to me - I'm here to learn after all. If you carry on with "Useless idea ... because..." that would be great.
Thanks
Steve[/quote]

Hey, it's Christmas day We're just fitting it in around all the other stuff we have to do today. You'll usually find JTUK to be one of the better informed posters on here

[Steve Spector]

[quote name='AndyMartin' post='1069408' date='Dec 26 2010, 12:08 AM']Hey, it's Christmas day We're just fitting it in around all the other stuff we have to do today. You'll usually find JTUK to be one of the better informed posters on here[/quote]

No hard feelings, but if time's short it'd be better not to say anything. Saying "usless idea" really doesn't help at all, but I'll be genuinely interested in the follow up reasoning when JTUK has a bit more time. I am a bit of a novice and admit it, that's why I'm here!

Steve

[JTUK]

[quote name='Steve Spector' post='1069416' date='Dec 26 2010, 12:41 AM']No hard feelings, but if time's short it'd be better not to say anything. Saying "usless idea" really doesn't help at all, but I'll be genuinely interested in the follow up reasoning when JTUK has a bit more time. I am a bit of a novice and admit it, that's why I'm here!

Steve[/quote]


Ampeg 8x10 is 800watts so that should handle most amps. And they are low powered drivers for 10"
You aren't going to get a 15" anywhere near that output and nominaly half that. In order to get a power spread on the two cabs the 15" would need to be double the impedance of the 8x10 given those ratings..that is besides anything esle.
Why would you bother to do this when the 8x10 is such a big lift into the gig and would cover 99% of the time. The 15" would add nothing to the set-up...it isn't balanced in any way and you don't need the extra cab/speaker. There are other cab configs I'd consider and if you had a very large stage area and a concert rig then 2 8x10', but this 15" and and 8x10 is nothing but putting extra cabs on stage to no good effrect, IV/IME..therefore a useless idea.

Vanity gone wrong, I'd say.

I don't rate Ampeg 8x10's of old..... not sure this is an Ampeg you have, though.. and that is because I have played through too many tired hammered versions and the power was very low but I would fully expect them in decent nick to outperform a single 15" every day of the week and twice on sundays.

Certainly, Aguilar, Boogie, Orange and even Ashdown are all rated no less than 1200watts per cab..

[Bill Fitzmaurice]

[quote name='JTUK' post='1069432' date='Dec 25 2010, 09:07 PM']Ampeg 8x10 is 800watts so that should handle most amps. And they are low powered drivers for 10"
You aren't going to get a 15" anywhere near that output and nominaly half that. In order to get a power spread on the two cabs the 15" would need to be double the impedance of the 8x10 given those ratings..that is besides anything esle.
Why would you bother to do this when the 8x10 is such a big lift into the gig and would cover 99% of the time. The 15" would add nothing to the set-up...it isn't balanced in any way and you don't need the extra cab/speaker. There are other cab configs I'd consider and if you had a very large stage area and a concert rig then 2 8x10', but this 15" and and 8x10 is nothing but putting extra cabs on stage to no good effrect, IV/IME..therefore a useless idea.

Vanity gone wrong, I'd say.

I don't rate Ampeg 8x10's of old..... not sure this is an Ampeg you have, though.. and that is because I have played through too many tired hammered versions and the power was very low but I would fully expect them in decent nick to outperform a single 15" every day of the week and twice on sundays.

Certainly, Aguilar, Boogie, Orange and even Ashdown are all rated no less than 1200watts per cab..[/quote]
A bit long winded, but essentially correct.
Low frequency output is primarily determined by total driver displacement, not watts. That of an average 1x15 is 350cc, that of an average 8x10: 1100cc.

[Phil Starr]

[quote name='bumnote' post='1069399' date='Dec 25 2010, 11:49 PM']could you explain a bit further? i know the moving part of the speaker isnt actually 15" but if the area of a circle is pi r squared then my maths makes a 15 at 176 sq ins and 2 10s at 157.

Ta[/quote]
Oops, too much Christmas spirit, I punched the wrong keys on my calculator. The essential point is, it is area not diameter, but you have this.

Actually it is not area but displacement and BFM has given you the figures for this as well. As well as their size and weight 8x10's and all multiple driver speakers have problems with their radiation patterns and cancellation of certain frequencies. Players tend to either love the sound or hate it. They don't usually lack bass or sound output as everyone is saying but the sound is quite coloured and a bit 'retro'. It's like marmite, you'll love it or hate it but it has a taste you can't mistake and it isn't nice mixed with anything else!

[algmusic]

I think point of adding a 1x15 to a 8x10 is like someone a helping a bodybuider carry a paperclip.

If you had a 4x15, then you might be taking :-)

[Steve Spector]

[quote name='JTUK' post='1069432' date='Dec 26 2010, 02:07 AM']Ampeg 8x10 is 800watts so that should handle most amps. And they are low powered drivers for 10"
You aren't going to get a 15" anywhere near that output and nominaly half that. In order to get a power spread on the two cabs the 15" would need to be double the impedance of the 8x10 given those ratings..that is besides anything esle.
Why would you bother to do this when the 8x10 is such a big lift into the gig and would cover 99% of the time. The 15" would add nothing to the set-up...it isn't balanced in any way and you don't need the extra cab/speaker. There are other cab configs I'd consider and if you had a very large stage area and a concert rig then 2 8x10', but this 15" and and 8x10 is nothing but putting extra cabs on stage to no good effrect, IV/IME..therefore a useless idea.

Vanity gone wrong, I'd say.

I don't rate Ampeg 8x10's of old..... not sure this is an Ampeg you have, though.. and that is because I have played through too many tired hammered versions and the power was very low but I would fully expect them in decent nick to outperform a single 15" every day of the week and twice on sundays.

Certainly, Aguilar, Boogie, Orange and even Ashdown are all rated no less than 1200watts per cab..[/quote]

Brilliant, thank you very much.
All the best,
Steve

[JMT3781]

[quote name='algmusic' post='1069485' date='Dec 26 2010, 10:17 AM']I think point of adding a 1x15 to a 8x10 is like someone a helping a bodybuider carry a paperclip.

If you had a 4x15, then you might be taking :-)[/quote]

taking what?

yourself to the chiropractor i think!

[bumnote]

[quote name='Phil Starr' post='1069476' date='Dec 26 2010, 09:43 AM']Oops, too much Christmas spirit, I punched the wrong keys on my calculator. The essential point is, it is area not diameter, but you have this.

Actually it is not area but displacement and BFM has given you the figures for this as well. As well as their size and weight 8x10's and all multiple driver speakers have problems with their radiation patterns and cancellation of certain frequencies. Players tend to either love the sound or hate it. They don't usually lack bass or sound output as everyone is saying but the sound is quite coloured and a bit 'retro'. It's like marmite, you'll love it or hate it but it has a taste you can't mistake and it isn't nice mixed with anything else![/quote]

Thanks, wasnt having a dig but Ive learnt a lot from discussions here on speakers and just trying to understand

[algmusic]

[font="Georgia"][/font][quote name='JMT3781' post='1069543' date='Dec 26 2010, 12:01 PM']taking what?

yourself to the chiropractor i think![/quote]
Opps typo.. I meant talking.. But I think the back problem would be the issue. All this gear is really tour or studio gear really IMHO