Buying a Rickenbacker

[achknalligewelt]

Thanks, everyone. Now I just need to find one to play...

[robocorpse]

I've owned around 15 Ricks, and I've never had 2 that were quite alike. My least favourite ones were 1974-79, they feel somehow thinner and stiffer, and have pickup issues (due to the early version of the Hi-Gain pups with iron-impregnated rubber polepieces) and weird action issues. Best one I ever had was a V63 reissue (which I still own), which is an absolute monster and does take some getting used to, but the TONE is incredible (a few people played it at the Surrey Bassbash recently). There are all sort of problems they can suffer (lifting bridges, pickups dying on one string are the usual probs) but I have only had 2 that had the neck joint problem where the body wings stay straight, and the glue joint allows the centre blank to bend slightly, so you get the "lines of death" round the heel. AVOID THOSE AT ALL COSTS, they are irreparable without MAJOR surgery and a refinish. I had a '67 and it was no better than the 80s ones, but the '69 I had was absolutely GLORIOUS (but someone offered me a price I couldnt refuse...) I have owned 2 4001CS Chris Squires and they were like chalk and cheese, one was an absolute dog, the other was gorgeous but had bad paint issues, I have since sold both of them. I still own 3 Ricks and am unlikely to ever part with 2 of them, but I hardly ever play them now as I'm too scared to take them out of the house. So, I will agree wholeheartedly with all the"marmite" comments, and you should play as many as you can before committing your dosh. You should also decide whether you want an unbound 60s reissue, a bound 70s-90s type, or a modern bound one. Bound looks cooler due to triangle inlays, binding etc, unbound ones are more comfy and "authentic" and have the low output pickups that sound better (IMHO) if you want the Squire/Glover clank or the Macca boom. And they all play differently. Bloody minefield are Ricks...

[KevB]

[quote name='achknalligewelt' post='1105988' date='Jan 28 2011, 10:48 AM']Thanks, everyone. Now I just need to find one to play...[/quote]

If you're ever in Nottingham on a Sunday let me know, if you come along to a jam session that happens every Sunday near me you could get up with some people and play my ric. I don't take it every week so I'd need to know in advance.

[Mr. Foxen]

Gonna be making new ridge saddles once some workshop time frees up. If someone has an old set they could send me, would make life easier/faster, I'm basing them from a Jap bridge, so might need a fettling to fit a genuine bridge.

[4000]

[quote name='robocorpse' post='1106171' date='Jan 28 2011, 01:28 PM']I've owned around 15 Ricks, and I've never had 2 that were quite alike. My least favourite ones were 1974-79, they feel somehow thinner and stiffer, and have pickup issues (due to the early version of the Hi-Gain pups with iron-impregnated rubber polepieces) and weird action issues. Best one I ever had was a V63 reissue (which I still own), which is an absolute monster and does take some getting used to, but the TONE is incredible (a few people played it at the Surrey Bassbash recently). There are all sort of problems they can suffer (lifting bridges, pickups dying on one string are the usual probs) but I have only had 2 that had the neck joint problem where the body wings stay straight, and the glue joint allows the centre blank to bend slightly, so you get the "lines of death" round the heel. AVOID THOSE AT ALL COSTS, they are irreparable without MAJOR surgery and a refinish. I had a '67 and it was no better than the 80s ones, but the '69 I had was absolutely GLORIOUS (but someone offered me a price I couldnt refuse...) I have owned 2 4001CS Chris Squires and they were like chalk and cheese, one was an absolute dog, the other was gorgeous but had bad paint issues, I have since sold both of them. I still own 3 Ricks and am unlikely to ever part with 2 of them, but I hardly ever play them now as I'm too scared to take them out of the house. So, I will agree wholeheartedly with all the"marmite" comments, and you should play as many as you can before committing your dosh. You should also decide whether you want an unbound 60s reissue, a bound 70s-90s type, or a modern bound one. Bound looks cooler due to triangle inlays, binding etc, unbound ones are more comfy and "authentic" and have the low output pickups that sound better (IMHO) if you want the Squire/Glover clank or the Macca boom. And they all play differently. Bloody minefield are Ricks...[/quote]

My least favourites are '74-'79 also, and I remember that '69 well....

[BTS_Spacebass]

I've wanted a Ric since before I actually played bass, and tomorrow i'm buying one. haven't tried it or even picked one up before if memory serves but I know its gonna be cool. I'll let you know my thoughts.

Tx

[robocorpse]

[quote name='4000' post='1106540' date='Jan 28 2011, 06:16 PM']My least favourites are '74-'79 also, and I remember that '69 well....[/quote]

Yeah, it was a corker wasn't it!.
Oh, if you were wondering, your CS was the one with the paint issues (flaking at screws and that Frank Bello signature on the top bout)

[Cairobill]

I bought an absolutely mint 1978 4001 off Simon on the board. After experimenting with various strings, pick fingers etc I found out that the thing REALLY likes to be strung with thomastik jazz flats, which are very low tension, and played with a pick a la mccartney using the much derided pickup cover as a palm rest.

I usually play j basses with fingers but the Rick brings out a mellower, more rootsy and 'songwriterly' side to my playing.

It is amazing to play and sounds unreal. Very, very good indeed. The slightly shorter scale length makes it feel dinky compared to my j bass. It also really encourages melodic playing. I love this bass, it's wonderful. They also have this odd ability to sound totally consistent across the entire register that I have found in very few basses.

I do like that Geddy/Squire clonk and grind but the purity of the sound with flats is something to behold. It also fits like a glove in the mix whereas a rick with roundwounds will have a very 'look at me' kind of sound.

Beautiful basses but I really had to look, weight and neck profile vary a lot. Mine is super thin and under 9lbs.

Nick

[Norm]

Always wanted one 'cos of Bruce Foxton, then Geddy Lee & the fact they look (IMO) the mutts nuts but have ever never played one.
Cost was always an issue but now reading about all these potential problems has put me right off.
Still on second thoughts trying to find a good 'un would be fun & the fact they are a difficult beast makes them stand out a bit.

To the OP, best of luck & let us know how you get on.
Cheers,
Norm

[4000]

[quote name='robocorpse' post='1107475' date='Jan 29 2011, 06:37 PM']Yeah, it was a corker wasn't it!.
Oh, if you were wondering, your CS was the one with the paint issues (flaking at screws and that Frank Bello signature on the top bout) [/quote]

Yeah, it certainly had some paint issues. Weird how neither of my CSs worked for me tonally.
The '69 was lovely, although the action was way too high for featherfingers here. It was possibly the nearest Ric I've come across, in terms of both tone and looks, to my '72 (the main difference of course being the '72 has much, much lower action which suits me better).

Edited January 30, 2011 by 4000

[4000]

[quote name='Cairobill' post='1107504' date='Jan 29 2011, 06:52 PM']They also have this odd ability to sound totally consistent across the entire register that I have found in very few basses.[/quote]

One of my favourite traits. Despite having owned many of the better-known makes out there, both mass-produced and boutique, I've never found anything that matches them in this regard.

[bassmachine2112]

This is a hard or easy question to answer-you could say if you have to ask then a Rick is not for you but with the outlay required then it is a very reasonable question.
I have heard over the years the gripes of precision necks being too big and can I fit a jazz neck or can I fit a p-bass neck neck to a jazz cause the jazz is too small.so you see the fenders have their ergonomic moments as well,stingrays with being too heavy/don,t like the sound and numerous gripes of all the other basses-neck dive.
It seems that Ricks with their profile seem to attract the knockers.
I have over the years used/played most of the types and for overall sound if set up,dialed in nothing sounds like one cause they are very rich in frequencies to the point where there is too much and some subtle eq can work big wonders. Phil Lynot once said "that you play a precision but a Rick plays you"as too playing comfort if they dig in a bit put on a wrist sweat band and problem solved.
I can make a Rick sound like other basses but nothing sounds like a Rick.
The old chestnut which era is best-4001 versus 4003 I have had both.I will stick with my 4003,bridges again how many people have changed their fender bridges out for badass,gotoh,schaller etc.I have changed mine for a hipshot,my p-bass has schaller tuners,wizard thumper pup and a high mass bridge so I,ve done more work on the perfect bass than the marmite one.
The only other thing is you do need is good amps and cabs.
I could write a book on this subject but if your a Rick player then you will love it like the rest of us.

[RickIronWitch]

i love the look and the sound of these, everytime i go on to a bass website its in my face, ebay, its in my face. Everytime i listened to a new band that tone was present, it was driving me wild. buying one wasnt an option, but i got my hands on my friends 91' and... i was shocked with how bad the neck felt in my tiny hands, pretty deverstated that i'll never own one and feel comfortable playing it.

[omikin]

Regarding bridges, what was said about being able to slip a sheet of paper under the back of them has made me very nervous. My '81 4001 has about a 1.5mm lift at the back of the bridge. It's solid as a rock and stays in tune etc no problem but is this something I should be looking to get fixed or is this just how they are?

I'm a bit panicky now...
[attachment=70399:photo_3.JPG]
[attachment=70398:photo.JPG]

On topic, however, I can say I love my 4001 enormously. The tone is absolutely unrivalled by anything else I have played and suits my pick style perfectly. I agree the ergonomics are not to everyone's taste but for me they're not a problem. Lovely low action and great Ric growl.

As everyone else has said, you need to try one out properly to see how you'll get on with one, but I think you may well fall in love...

[Cairobill]

A little bit of tail lift seems to be as standard on most 4001s. The 4001 is designed to be played with light gauge flats (thomastik jazz flats being the ones that sing on my bass they're 43 to 100) and installing rounds with regular to high tension will bring on a bit of lift although most ricks remain useable with much worse lift than this.

I wouldn't worry about it, it's standard issue and a subject of (often heated) debate on various forums. Swap out to a hipshot like for like replacement if you're worried. Alternatively, give the thomasltik jazz flats a try. First flats I've used seriously and I love them. Think smooth low action and big, sonorous, sustain for ever McCartney tone ALL the way up to the upper register of the bass. What Ricks do best in my opinion.

[Bassassin]

Tail lift is part of the Rick character - it's just something they're prone to. Basically it's a design fault of the bridge & has been this way since the early 70s, when the solid aluminium "gap tooth" tailpieces were discontinued. I think Mr Foxen's exaggerating a bit about the sheet of paper, 2 or 3 mm shouldn't make any difference in real terms, there should still be an adequate break-angle over the saddles to keep the strings securely seated.

Of course, a man with replica (and bend-resistant) Rick tailpieces to sell might be prone to exaggerate...

Tail-lift's sometimes attributed to overtightening the screws underneath the saddle assembly - this part of the tailpiece sits in a body route but doesn't make contact with the wood so tightening the screws tends to pull the metal down & encourage bending. RickResource guys often recommend a wooden shim in the hole, or a stack of washers around each screw so it seats down tight.

Personally I think Rickenbackers choose you - I absolutely love the sound & the look, but have never owned a real one. I have 3 Japanese copies, which were of course quite modestly-priced compared to the real thing, and being accurate copies they have many of the foibles of the original as well as the good things. I suppose this makes me think that I'm paying 4 figures for a bass - I'd really expect to want to play it [b]all[/b] the time - and this isn't my experience with my Fakers!

Having said that, if the right Rick came along at the right time I probably would go for it...

J.

[4000]

[quote name='RickIronWitch' post='1108097' date='Jan 30 2011, 01:12 PM']i love the look and the sound of these, everytime i go on to a bass website its in my face, ebay, its in my face. Everytime i listened to a new band that tone was present, it was driving me wild. buying one wasnt an option, but i got my hands on my friends 91' and... i was shocked with how bad the neck felt in my tiny hands, pretty deverstated that i'll never own one and feel comfortable playing it.[/quote]

Don't forget that depending on year (heck, depending on day of the week!) they can have big necks, pencil necks and everything inbetween. The only thing that's reasonably consistent is the string spacing. This is why you can't just try one and judge them all by that.

Oh, and with regards to tail lift if it's a couple of mm or so don't worry about it. Almost all the post-aluminium bridges suffer a little tail lift with heavier strings. It's when it really stats to flex you should start panicking...

Edited January 30, 2011 by 4000

[omikin]

thanks for the reassurance!

will try out those thomasltik jazz flats... never used flats before. as it currently has 45-105 roundwounds on it i'm guessing i'll need to get the neck and saddles adjusted for the revised string tension?

[BTS_Spacebass]

Picked mine up yesterday. It was a gamble but it paid off. Sounds great, looks great, feels great (neck did feel alittle slow at first but I think its a different feel to my last 2 basses so thats allowed). Super happy and worth every penny

Win

T

[Cairobill]

My misspelling - thomastik jazz flats. Quite expensive but of course, you won't have to change them

If you find that the action is 'medium' with the roundwounds on, you might find that you don;t need to tweak the bass once the flats are on. My Rick just seemed to relax, go aaaahhh, and became a slinky, low action, dub/abbey road monster once the thomastiks went on. Plus they feel very nice to play and I'm no means a flats fanatic (I use DR hibeams on all my other basses).

Good luck

N

[quote name='omikin' post='1108226' date='Jan 30 2011, 03:29 PM']thanks for the reassurance!

will try out those thomasltik jazz flats... never used flats before. as it currently has 45-105 roundwounds on it i'm guessing i'll need to get the neck and saddles adjusted for the revised string tension?[/quote]

[jonsmith]

I definitely wouldn't wouldn't worry about being able to get a sheet of paper under the bridge. That's not real tail lift as far as I'm concerned. Tail lift that actually causes problems, while obviously not unheard of, is not totally widespread. Not great if you do get it, but if it does occur it's easily rectified with a new bridge. The closest I've come to having this problem is in the photograph below. This '75 was strung with horrible extremely high tension roundwounds when I got it. I swapped them for Tomastik Jazz Roundwounds, but took them off after a few weeks as they were just too floppy for my liking. It's had Rotosound Roundwounds on it for the past five years and hasn't moved at all in that time.

[Cairobill]

That a double neck? Impossibly cool...

[quote name='jonsmith' post='1108562' date='Jan 30 2011, 07:50 PM']I definitely wouldn't wouldn't worry about being able to get a sheet of paper under the bridge. That's not real tail lift as far as I'm concerned. Tail lift that actually causes problems, while obviously not unheard of, is not totally widespread. Not great if you do get it, but if it does occur it's easily rectified with a new bridge. The closest I've come to having this problem is in the photograph below. This '75 was strung with horrible extremely high tension roundwounds when I got it. I swapped them for Tomastik Jazz Roundwounds, but took them off after a few weeks as they were just too floppy for my liking. It's had Rotosound Roundwounds on it for the past five years and hasn't moved at all in that time.[/quote]

[Starless]

An over-priced, dodgy QC novelty bass that has been sold over the years on the back of photos of McCartney, Squire, Geddy Lee, Glover et al. They've all moved on to other things when the novelty wears off. I've had four over the years, and all now gone. Never lasted beyond the novelty phase. Won't be getting a fifth one, no point. Fenders and Musicmans much better quality with no ridiculous design 'features' that hamper just about any playing style. There are much cheaper ways of getting a temporary buzz.

Edited January 30, 2011 by Starless

[jonsmith]

[quote name='Starless' post='1108658' date='Jan 30 2011, 08:57 PM']They've all moved on to other things when the novelty wears off.[/quote]

Apart from Chris Squire of course, who seems to have managed to cope with it as his main instrument for the past 45 years.

[4000]

[quote name='Starless' post='1108658' date='Jan 30 2011, 08:57 PM']An over-priced, dodgy QC novelty bass that has been sold over the years on the back of photos of McCartney, Squire, Geddy Lee, Glover et al. They've all moved on to other things when the novelty wears off. I've had four over the years, and all now gone. Never lasted beyond the novelty phase. Won't be getting a fifth one, no point. Fenders and Musicmans much better quality with no ridiculous design 'features' that hamper just about any playing style. There are much cheaper ways of getting a temporary buzz.[/quote]