Beedster Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share Posted April 18, 2011 [quote name='dan670844' post='1203540' date='Apr 18 2011, 01:15 PM']This brings me onto the wider issue as I said before there where not as many pre cbs fender basses as people think, esp Jazzers. Combine that with worldwide sales, natural attrition and what not. There seems to be many more basses around than there used to be and this has come about just as old fender iron has got popular and valuable. Fender basses were very expensive in the early to mid sixties and I would guess the average bass player would make do with other offerings, I don't think they flooded out the gates quite as people believe.[/quote] Mmm, if you're right it's worrying stuff, and makes you wonder how many cherished vintage basses might have been knocked up in China or Eastern Europe. Or the UK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molan Posted April 18, 2011 Share Posted April 18, 2011 [quote name='Beedster' post='1203978' date='Apr 18 2011, 07:24 PM']Mmm, if you're right it's worrying stuff, and makes you wonder how many cherished vintage basses might have been knocked up in China or Eastern Europe. Or the UK [/quote] I must admit I've been quietly amazed at the number of these vintage basses that pop up all the time on EBay. . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share Posted April 18, 2011 [quote name='molan' post='1203985' date='Apr 18 2011, 07:28 PM']I must admit I've been quietly amazed at the number of these vintage basses that pop up all the time on EBay. . .[/quote] Yep, and with T&C statements such as "All sales are final, ask your questions before bidding", which hardly inspire confidence! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conan Posted April 18, 2011 Share Posted April 18, 2011 With the silly prices that people are prepared to spend on 'Vintage' Fenders, I am actually surprised that this doesn't happen more often. People believe what they want to believe, and sadly there will always be shysters out there with more knowledge and/or less scruples that will try to part you from your cash. Second-hand Trace Elliot cabs now - that's a different market altogether. Some lovely guys selling real, genuine quality gear out there at brilliant prices... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomBassmonkey Posted April 18, 2011 Share Posted April 18, 2011 I dunno, maybe it's because I don't buy into the whole vintage instrument thing. Technology's moved a long way in the last 50 years and it doesn't make sense to me to fork out more for an instrument made using old techniques and out of date machines than for a modern one. If they genuinely were better, they'd still be made using the same methods. If I was going to buy a vintage bass, I'd do all the homework and I'd never buy one off ebay or the like unless I could have it checked over by an expert of my choice first. Even if I bought one from a shop (however reputable) I'd take it to someone who really knows what they're talking about straight away and have it looked over. As shown by the recent Truckstop/Bass Direct thread, even people with the best intentions can make obvious mistakes. If you buy a bass that you feel is worth the money, then there's no problem IMO. If you paid a premium because of it's age, then that's your choice but if you find out the bass isn't as old as it says then you still paid the same amount of money for the same instrument, if you paid extra because of the date it was put together irrespective of how it plays, then feel it's somehow worth less because you find out it's a more recent instrument, sorry but I still fail to see the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share Posted April 18, 2011 [quote name='ThomBassmonkey' post='1204176' date='Apr 18 2011, 09:37 PM']I dunno, maybe it's because I don't buy into the whole vintage instrument thing. Technology's moved a long way in the last 50 years and it doesn't make sense to me to fork out more for an instrument made using old techniques and out of date machines than for a modern one. If they genuinely were better, they'd still be made using the same methods. If I was going to buy a vintage bass, I'd do all the homework and I'd never buy one off ebay or the like unless I could have it checked over by an expert of my choice first. Even if I bought one from a shop (however reputable) I'd take it to someone who really knows what they're talking about straight away and have it looked over. As shown by the recent Truckstop/Bass Direct thread, even people with the best intentions can make obvious mistakes. If you buy a bass that you feel is worth the money, then there's no problem IMO. If you paid a premium because of it's age, then that's your choice but if you find out the bass isn't as old as it says then you still paid the same amount of money for the same instrument, if you paid extra because of the date it was put together irrespective of how it plays, then feel it's somehow worth less because you find out it's a more recent instrument, sorry but I still fail to see the problem.[/quote] I don't disagree with any of that Thom, but it doesn't change my views about the guys building the 'replicas' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wesfinn Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 (edited) [quote name='ThomBassmonkey' post='1204176' date='Apr 18 2011, 09:37 PM']I dunno, maybe it's because I don't buy into the whole vintage instrument thing. Technology's moved a long way in the last 50 years and it doesn't make sense to me to fork out more for an instrument made using old techniques and out of date machines than for a modern one. If they genuinely were better, they'd still be made using the same methods.[/quote] I think the reason people like the old way of building is because of the small imperfections and the hands on approach. Your right in the sense that a CNC can make a better guitar that a person because the tolerances are are so precise. Its just not cost effective to build them the old way big scale either. The reason i make fender replicas isn't because I want to rip off an old guitar but because I feel as though i'm recreating history. Which is why I go to extremes such as making my own truss rods etc it's all an experience for me. If I could have any job in the world it would be working for Fender in 50's and 60's. Every thing they did was so ahead for its time and they could make a guitar almost as quickly as a cnc nowadays. What this guy is doing on ebay I have no problem with as he is open about it. I don't agree with the date stamp though, I feel it is a bit unnecessary. any way heres a nice little video for you all to remember the good old days [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nswcAPvH0P8"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nswcAPvH0P8[/url] Edited April 19, 2011 by wesfinn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan670844 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Beedster' post='1203978' date='Apr 18 2011, 07:24 PM']Mmm, if you're right it's worrying stuff, and makes you wonder how many cherished vintage basses might have been knocked up in China or Eastern Europe. Or the UK [/quote] I have old basses / guitars genuine ones that I know the history, even down to when they were bought, family heirlooms you might say! one thing I can say is they don't really age like all these relics etc. All the parts seem to age at different rates, even things like pickup covers age differently. On a strat I have two looking like dot cottons teeth whereas one is still white. Some of the relicing looks a bit too authentic............ To echo another poster, I would never pay the money for these old guitars, the fact is the modern ones are better made, on CNC lathes etc progress has been made! the only thing I would say is the old pickups are better as they where handwound rather than machine wound. I think a random winding like on transformers produces a better result. But you can buy handwound (scatterwound) pickups like wizards, so no problem and some manufacturers like seymour are offering machine simulated handwounds with good results. I guess its a fashion thing, if that is really your bag buy a roadworn .................. can wait for the next fashion, hope its Aria clicky-clack 80's sounds as I have a loft full of those to shift ha ha Edited April 19, 2011 by dan670844 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Jack Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Veering slightly off topic, this is actually very nice: [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Keller-handmade-Pre-CBS-64-jazz-boutique-aged-bass_W0QQitemZ150586982204QQcategoryZ4713QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp5197.m263QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DSIC%26itu%3DUCI%252BIA%252BUA%252BIEW%252BFICS%252BUFI%26otn%3D15%26pmod%3D150587027342%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D8562364543666372327"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Keller-handmade-Pre-...364543666372327[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Omnomnomnomnom [quote name='Happy Jack' post='1204554' date='Apr 19 2011, 11:08 AM']Veering slightly off topic, this is actually very nice: [url="http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Keller-handmade-Pre-CBS-64-jazz-boutique-aged-bass_W0QQitemZ150586982204QQcategoryZ4713QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp5197.m263QQ_trkparmsZalgo%3DSIC%26itu%3DUCI%252BIA%252BUA%252BIEW%252BFICS%252BUFI%26otn%3D15%26pmod%3D150587027342%26po%3DLVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D8562364543666372327"]http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Keller-handmade-Pre-...364543666372327[/url][/quote] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Count Bassy Posted April 29, 2011 Share Posted April 29, 2011 If I could make a neck as good a this one claims to be I would want to stamp my own name on it, not Fenders. He's open in his description, but why not put a date stamp- of 2011 on, and his name? - unless it's intended to deceive? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BB3000S Posted April 30, 2011 Share Posted April 30, 2011 [quote name='Count Bassy' post='1215451' date='Apr 30 2011, 01:57 AM']If I could make a neck as good a this one claims to be I would want to stamp my own name on it, not Fenders. He's open in his description, but why not put a date stamp- of 2011 on, and his name? - unless it's intended to deceive?[/quote] Agree completely. As for the exactness of the Keller "replicas", to me the truss rod sits too low in the wood - shouldn't it touch the fingerboard? Thus: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beedster Posted April 30, 2011 Author Share Posted April 30, 2011 [quote name='BB3000S' post='1215490' date='Apr 30 2011, 07:03 AM']Agree completely. As for the exactness of the Keller "replicas", to me the truss rod sits too low in the wood - shouldn't it touch the fingerboard?[/quote] On the earlier slab boards yes, but not on the later veneer-type boards (i.e., post '62) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BB3000S Posted April 30, 2011 Share Posted April 30, 2011 [quote name='Beedster' post='1215503' date='Apr 30 2011, 09:08 AM']On the earlier slab boards yes, but not on the later veneer-type boards (i.e., post '62)[/quote] Ah, I see - thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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