Help for a Wee Lass?

[squillybet]

Hey Guys and Gals!

So Basically this is a plea for help (unsurprisingly!)

I used to play bass a lot when I was younger and got pretty good (even if I do say so myself!). I then had a child and subsequently ended up with no time for playing in any form really. So I have recently decided that life without bass is pretty pointless now that I have some time to pick it back up, this is indeed what I'm attempting!

The problem with this is that I suck... badly and where as before I started playing bass as a favour for a friends band so was just learning all of their stuff, I've now decided I'd quite like to do this properly but I have no idea where to start! I taught myself last time but without a band I just dont know what to do with myself!

Any Ideas?

Cheers

Sarah

(also I'd like to say that my new favourite smiley is <he makes me happy!)

[Gareth Hughes]

Hey Sarah -

Welcome!!! And glad to hear you're back to the bass. Where to start? Anywhere - really anywhere. As much as I favour learning as much theory and technical know-how, I'd put nurturing your passion for playing bass before all of that. Next time you hear a great bass line, sit down and work it out. Then balance that with the theory. Have a look at the Major's lessons here for starters: [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=74284"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=74284[/url]

[wal4string]

[size="3"][/size][quote name='squillybet' post='1231946' date='May 15 2011, 01:40 PM']Hey Guys and Gals!

So Basically this is a plea for help (unsurprisingly!)

I used to play bass a lot when I was younger and got pretty good (even if I do say so myself!). I then had a child and subsequently ended up with no time for playing in any form really. So I have recently decided that life without bass is pretty pointless now that I have some time to pick it back up, this is indeed what I'm attempting!

The problem with this is that I suck... badly and where as before I started playing bass as a favour for a friends band so was just learning all of their stuff, I've now decided I'd quite like to do this properly but I have no idea where to start! I taught myself last time but without a band I just dont know what to do with myself!

Any Ideas?

Cheers

Sarah

(also I'd like to say that my new favourite smiley is <he makes me happy!)[/quote]

Hi Sarah,

It's a big learning curve but very enjoyable, couple of things which I feel is a must and will pay dividends later on, a finger per fret, also, practise with a metronome. I have the app for my smartphone "Allegro Metronome", I have just bought myself a headphone amp, there are several which are bass specific but I opted for "The Palmer Pocket Amp" £68.00 (from eBay with a 5 year guarantee) really sturdy and will last for years, works great even with a cheap set of phones and the big plus is you can noodle away without disturbing the little one.

As Gareth said the Major is a good source plus uTube has tons of movies.

I am also sure there will be a great deal more advise coming along shortly so watch this space



[color="#00BFFF"][font="Arial Black"]Break a string.[/font][/color]

Edited May 16, 2011 by wal4string

[Doddy]

[quote name='wal4string' post='1232200' date='May 15 2011, 05:19 PM']It's a big learning curve but very enjoyable, couple of things which I feel is a must and will pay dividends later on, a finger per fret, also, practise with a metronome.[/quote]

I'm going to offer a couple of alternatives to this.
While the finger per fret method is great,depending on your hands it may be impractical in the lower range.You might be better off
using a 1,2,4 fingering over 3 frets in the first few positions before moving to one finger per fret at around the 5th-7th fret area,
or where ever is comfortable.
Metronomes can be useful,but I never recommend them initially. Say you are learning an arpeggio exercise,it is more important
at this stage to play the exercise correctly and accurately rather than in time. Later on you can use a metronome if you want
(although I very rarely do),but I think it's much better to focus on actually playing and understanding what you are doing rather
than trying to play everything in time.

Check out the book,'The Complete Electric Bass Method'(I think) by Ed Friedland. It's a good book,as it takes you from the very basics
to some more difficult stuff. However,if you can,find a good teacher. You'll learn more and progress a lot faster than you would on your
own.

[FayeAutumn]

I would recommend the book '100 Tips For Bass Guitar You Should Have Been Told' by Stuart Clayton (ISBN: 9781844920044) which my (at the time) partner bought for me and I've found really helpful.

[LemonCello]

Hi Sarah and welcome back to the Bass!

Agree with all the foregoing and just to add that I'd go get yourself a good teacher, one that you really 'click' with. There are some stunning bass players out there (not all good teachers) but if you find one with both qualities, they will inspire you and you will get back up to speed in no time!

Good Luck,

LC

[wal4string]

[quote name='Doddy' post='1232233' date='May 15 2011, 05:43 PM']I'm going to offer a couple of alternatives to this.
While the finger per fret method is great,depending on your hands it may be impractical in the lower range.You might be better off
using a 1,2,4 fingering over 3 frets in the first few positions before moving to one finger per fret at around the 5th-7th fret area,
or where ever is comfortable.
Metronomes can be useful,but I never recommend them initially. Say you are learning an arpeggio exercise,it is more important
at this stage to play the exercise correctly and accurately rather than in time. Later on you can use a metronome if you want
(although I very rarely do),but I think it's much better to focus on actually playing and understanding what you are doing rather
than trying to play everything in time.

Check out the book,'The Complete Electric Bass Method'(I think) by Ed Friedland. It's a good book,as it takes you from the very basics
to some more difficult stuff. However,if you can,find a good teacher. You'll learn more and progress a lot faster than you would on your
own.[/quote]

I could not disagree more. A finger per fret on the first 4 frets when learnt gives you great strength and dexterity, all too often students of mine have suprised themselves after just a few lessons how they are able to play a finger a fret which makes playing in the higher register so much easier. The 1,2,4 method is a throwback from double bass. But we are talking bass guitar here, and not double bass. Plus regards a metronome, they can be slowed down you know? and the bass is part of the rhythm section so an arpeggio played out of time is never good. I was fortunate to be taught by by someone who I clicked with straight away and later learned he had taught several well known players (I loved that guy, and he was no youngster at the time, so sadly no longer with us) he never once showed me how to play, he just explained how to play and was so thrilled when I got it right. I was fortunate to find such a good teacher, however it was not just luck, it was at the College of Music and Drama here in Cardiff. Like all things, you get what you pay for so a cheap teacher is not always the best. You could spend a fortune on books and DVD's but more often than not they gloss over the beginners point of view and jump straight into far more advanced that can be beyond a new learners ability, so again I stand by my first post, check out the internet, there is tons of good learning material there.

[Monckyman]

I stopped playing when i became a parent also.
No matter, you are interested again and that`s all that matters.
Take it easy, find a couple of basslines you really enjoy and learn them.
I`d also go with the 1 finger 1 fret.
When you think you have a degree of control over the instrument again, stretch yourself a bit, find some harder lines/songs to learn. Youtube is your friend here. Loads of instruction.
If you aren`t enjoying it, don`t do it.
Simple.
Good luck
MM

[squillybet]

Cheers everyone! It's all really great advice!

[Doddy]

[quote name='wal4string' post='1233833' date='May 17 2011, 12:02 AM']I could not disagree more. A finger per fret on the first 4 frets when learnt gives you great strength and dexterity, all too often students of mine have suprised themselves after just a few lessons how they are able to play a finger a fret which makes playing in the higher register so much easier. The 1,2,4 method is a throwback from double bass. But we are talking bass guitar here, and not double bass. Plus regards a metronome, they can be slowed down you know? and the bass is part of the rhythm section so an arpeggio played out of time is never good.[/quote]

As regards the fretting hand-while playing finger per fret does give dexterity,it is not a comfortable position for a lot of players.
I'm fully aware that the 1,2,4 fingering is a double bass thing,as I play it myself,however it is still a perfectly viable technique
in the lower positions on the electric bass and is used by a lot of people.Like I said earlier,you should move to finger per fret
higher up the 'board,but there is no point straining your hand in the lower positions,especially if it causes discomfort.

As far as the metronomes are concerned,I believe it is better to play and understand whatever material you are studying
without using a metronome. You say that 'playing an arpeggio out of time is never good',no it's not-in a gig situation.The
same way that playing the notes wrong but in time is never good. In the practise room it doesn't matter if you are in time
or not,at least initially-what is important is playing the notes correctly and understanding them. Again,like I said earlier,if
you want to use a metronome later on,you can,but initially I wouldn't.


Edit.....I'm not being purposely argumentative here,just saying how I have always approached things both personally and
with my students.

Edited May 17, 2011 by Doddy

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='Doddy' post='1233862' date='May 17 2011, 01:24 AM']I'm fully aware that the 1,2,4 fingering is a double bass thing,as I play it myself,however it is still a perfectly viable technique
in the lower positions on the electric bass and is used by a lot of people.[/quote]

I do it a lot and I've got pretty long fingers. If I have to I can do a finger per fret but it's more comfortable not to, and I'd rather not hurt myself than be macho about how far my fingers are spanning.

[dan670844]

[quote name='squillybet' post='1231946' date='May 15 2011, 01:40 PM']Hey Guys and Gals!

So Basically this is a plea for help (unsurprisingly!)

I used to play bass a lot when I was younger and got pretty good (even if I do say so myself!). I then had a child and subsequently ended up with no time for playing in any form really. So I have recently decided that life without bass is pretty pointless now that I have some time to pick it back up, this is indeed what I'm attempting!

The problem with this is that I suck... badly and where as before I started playing bass as a favour for a friends band so was just learning all of their stuff, I've now decided I'd quite like to do this properly but I have no idea where to start! I taught myself last time but without a band I just dont know what to do with myself!

Any Ideas?

Cheers

Sarah

(also I'd like to say that my new favourite smiley is <he makes me happy!)[/quote]

I would get learning some songs that you like, get yourself something like a Korg PX4D, you can connect your bass and Ipod cd player whatever to it. Find the tab whatever for the songs at first then try to work it by ear and just play along, that way you can play when the kids are asleep, pref with a glass of wine, It works for me!. In combination with this look at the bass line and start looking a bit of theory, timings etc. You will begin to see the patterns, and why they are playing the note of the chords /scales and whatnot. When you look at tab try to look at it from the context of either a scale or an appregio, you will find it is so much easier to play as you will get the fingering right and play how the original player played it. You will find it easier to move around on the fret board if you do that. When you are listening to a tune in the car work, around the house, whatever, work out the timing /structure of the piece of music, count it out 1 2 3 4 one bar etc, you will see that most tunes are entirely predictable and always follow the same pattern, in, 4/4 (4 beats in a bar) for example Intro 4 bars, verse chorus verse middle 8 whatever. If you are listening to music you can be learning as with bass it is as much about the rhythm as the notes you play. Once you feel up to it get out there and play. If you learn in this way you will have purpose and you will be suprised how quick you pick it back up. Playing with other people not even in a band context just a jam session will get you up to speed very quickly, it will happen so fast you won't even know how you got there hahha! Cheers D

[Doddy]

[quote name='dan670844' post='1234040' date='May 17 2011, 10:29 AM']Find the tab whatever for the songs at first then try to work it by ear and just play along,[/quote]

Don't find the tab. The OP says she want to learn 'properly',in which case if you are going
to learn songs,listen to them and get your ear together. If you are going to read,ignore the
tablature and learn to read music instead,while you are still in the early stages of learning.

[WILD FROG SHOT]

Here we go...

Edit: apologies that's not very constructive.

As others have said, a good teacher would be a great place to start; they can help you explore music the way you want to and help you not to pick up any bad habits along the way.

Edited May 17, 2011 by WILD FROG SHOT

[Bilbo]

[quote name='WILD FROG SHOT' post='1234478' date='May 17 2011, 04:01 PM']Here we go...[/quote]

Naaa. S'easy...

[Truckstop]

Here we go... what?
Paul's re-iterating that Sarah wants to learn how to play the bass guitar properly. If she said "I want to learn a few tunes and start a cover band" or whatever, then yeah. Get some tabs and just bash the tunes out.
Not argumentative in the slightest!

Truckstop

[squillybet]

Doddy you'll be pleased to know that I can already sight read music! Yay for me! I get the finger a fret thing but 1,2,4? Could someone enlighten me I feel like I'm being a little slow here!

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='squillybet' post='1235204' date='May 18 2011, 08:39 AM']I get the finger a fret thing but 1,2,4? Could someone enlighten me I feel like I'm being a little slow here![/quote]

Leaving out your ring finger because it's the weakest one, so you just span three notes instead of four in the lowest positions on the bass. It's easier on your wrists and hands to do that where possible.

[dan670844]

[quote name='Doddy' post='1234064' date='May 17 2011, 10:50 AM']
Don't find the tab. The OP says she want to learn 'properly',in which case if you are going
to learn songs,listen to them and get your ear together. If you are going to read,ignore the
tablature and learn to read music instead,while you are still in the early stages of learning.[/quote]


In that case only a teacher can help to get the right fingering etc , I too hate tab, ear is everything on any instrument, reading is good also I concur, but not absolute unless you are going to do it for a job. Just for the record I can read ( I learnt the the trumpet first) if you would care to read my post again I said you can use it for guidance, but I did say use your ears,I said this as most people don't read and if they get stuck early on its ok to use, no one is gonna burn yah. All very well saying read but a lot of popular music is not available in STD as its pointless writing out a whole load or roots and fifths's in Std notation 'ala rock etc. Who's gonna turn your page while you churn though that! if you reach a certain standard, most things are entirely predictable as far as bass lines go for a lot of music and a few minutes listening will put you right for the bits that aren't. Of course there are exceptions. Std notation is great it teaches you the notes the emphasis and dynamics of a piece of music. Everything has its place. But you have to start somewhere listening to music and working it out with bass in hand, using a few aides, is the fastest way to learn and most rewarding way as you can chart your progress. The best way are lessons of course but at £25+ per hr not everyone can afford them and finding them at time thats suitable is also very difficult. These days you can get decent books, look at lessons on the internet its free! and its at a time that is suitable for you.

Edited May 18, 2011 by dan670844

[dan670844]

[quote name='squillybet' post='1231946' date='May 15 2011, 01:40 PM']Hey Guys and Gals!

So Basically this is a plea for help (unsurprisingly!)

I used to play bass a lot when I was younger and got pretty good (even if I do say so myself!). I then had a child and subsequently ended up with no time for playing in any form really. So I have recently decided that life without bass is pretty pointless now that I have some time to pick it back up, this is indeed what I'm attempting!

The problem with this is that I suck... badly and where as before I started playing bass as a favour for a friends band so was just learning all of their stuff, I've now decided I'd quite like to do this properly but I have no idea where to start! I taught myself last time but without a band I just dont know what to do with myself!

Any Ideas?

Cheers

Sarah

(also I'd like to say that my new favourite smiley is <he makes me happy!)[/quote]

If you want a sensible explanation of the finger per fret 1234 1 2 4 etc and how to do that near the nut (where you may have to stretch some depending on the size of your fingers) There is a guy called Dave Marks (bass player) on Youtube. All its about really is not stretching to much and not making your hands do things they were not designed to do. The first 5 frets on a bass you should not really do one finger per fret as it puts a lots of stress on the tendons in your hands. There is an easy technique you can do to cover the low end. Also try to keep your rists straight, a lot of people have to give up playing, as they damage their tendons as they don't follow these rules. He will explain it better than me ha ha

Being a bass player you have to look after your hands, this is the most important lesson anyone can ever teach.

Edited May 18, 2011 by dan670844

[dan670844]

[quote name='dan670844' post='1235772' date='May 18 2011, 02:42 PM']If you want a sensible explanation of the finger per fret 1234 1 2 4 etc and how to do that near the nut (where you may have to stretch some depending on the size of your fingers) There is a guy called Dave Marks (bass player) on Youtube. All its about really is not stretching to much and not making your hands do things they were not designed to do. The first 5 frets on a bass you should not really do one finger per fret as it puts a lots of stress on the tendons in your hands. There is an easy technique you can do to cover the low end. Also try to keep your rists straight, a lot of people have to give up playing, as they damage their tendons as they don't follow these rules. He will explain it better than me ha ha

Being a bass player you have to look after your hands, this is the most important lesson anyone can ever teach.[/quote]


Haha my last post. This is how I would do it

1/ Learn how to hold the bass fret and pluck properly so you don't get any injury
2/ Learn a few tunes as I described try using your ears but use supporting literature thats freely available on the internet if you get stuck this is a fun way to get you moving around the board.
3. Learn apreggios the notes that make up chords, then you will start to have a pallette to weave yah lines i.e minors majors 7th etc
4. Learn the time sigs, work out how to count out and work out the structure of a tunes, so you know where you are. I guess you already know this
5. Learn scales and modes and how to apply them to progressions and chords see the patterns across the neck?
6. Work with a drummer drum machine to hear what the drums are saying and how to intereact with them I.e. Kick usually beat one, Snare, high hat etc. this is your rhythmic palette to create your line
7. Learn about anchors pivots and lead in's to make interesting lines to express movement, dynamics in a piece.
8. Listen to lots of music different styles you will begin to really here the power of the bass
9. Learn about playing dynamics how hard to hit and when to do it to open up the dynamics of a song, never play flat, (dont buy a class d amp)
10. Most of this stuff is free available on the net you tube videos lessons check out dave marks , marloweDK etc
11. Have fun enjoy, always learn, everyone is always learning no matter how good they are check out john c mayer for his humbleness and good nature, the boy can play........ i.e. Don't become arrogant when you get good and jump so far down someone's throat (at any opportunity) so you come out their bum hahha. If you are in a studio with someone all day and night, on tour, it pays to be good natured and chilled, if you don't you never get the good jobs................................................................................................
................................................................

Edited May 18, 2011 by dan670844

[slobluesine]

get along to some local Jam nights Sarah, jams are great way to meet other musicians maybe find a band