tharidla Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hello fellow bass players, As most jazz bass players are, I'm on the seemingly never ending quest for the best live setup. I have tried many different amps; combos, seperates, different speaker sizes etc and am still scratching my head. I generally find that if you get a nice sound out of an amp, its generally working at lowish volume so you often struggle to hear yourself well when the band is playing. Pickup sound amplified will always sound a bit sh*t loud because its a pickup. Mic on its own tends to lack definition and clarity. The next thing to try is: Powered speaker i.e. mackie 10" or similar, possibly on a speaker stand at head level. A small mixer to combine pickup and mic input, and to supply phantom power to the mic. Does anyone have experience of this setup, and was/is it a good way to go? Thanks for any input! Matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hi there. Have a read of this thread [url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=131128&hl="]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=131128&hl=[/url] I understand that quite a few players like the QSC K10 powered speaker. Bassace on this forum uses that setup when he is using a microphone, I believe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
franzbassist Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 The Phil Jones [url="http://www.philjonespuresound.com/products/?id=125"]PB300[/url] would also do this job very well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derrenleepoole Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Depends on how much you want to spend I guess. I use a Phil Jones CUB amp. It has two inputs, one for normal bass etc and one for mic. Now, this is only a low 100 watt amp, but it's designs to be used with the Phil Jones powered cabinet giving a total output of about 300-350 watts. It's not a cheap setup though, but it's very flexible and will work for all types of basses equally well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassace Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 I'm getting very good results with a DPA4099/Headway/QSC K10 on a stand with a little bit of pickup blend into the second Headway channel. Very good for trios and quartets in smallish/medium rooms. Probably best ever. Problem is when I turn up for a bigger room I get a bit of off-axis sound from other instruments even into a close-miked DPA and I struggle to cut through. If I play with any more than four I use a pickup and to a certain extent compromise on the sound quality. Also with the mic there is quite a bit of stuff to set up but for all that it can be very rewarding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tharidla Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hi guys thanks for your replies. It seems that this pa speaker/mic thing is more popular than I first thought! The consideration I have now I suppose is cost-just looked up the QSC K10 and headway preamp. £689 and £199. Ow. And that doesn't include the mic! Would this setup be [b]that[/b] much better than a Mackie SRM350 (£320) and a behringer mixer? (£30 on ebay) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassace Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 (edited) [quote name='tharidla' post='1284308' date='Jun 27 2011, 04:51 PM']Hi guys thanks for your replies. It seems that this pa speaker/mic thing is more popular than I first thought! The consideration I have now I suppose is cost-just looked up the QSC K10 and headway preamp. £689 and £199. Ow. And that doesn't include the mic! Would this setup be [b]that[/b] much better than a Mackie SRM350 (£320) and a behringer mixer? (£30 on ebay)[/quote] Not sure as I haven't any experience of a Mackie - Clarky uses one. As someone on TB said 'the 4099 isn't a cheap date'. However, if you get one you have the second option of putting it through the front of house, if there is one, and then it really kills! Edited June 27, 2011 by bassace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gcordez Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Im a big fan of the QSC K10 powered speaker, its sounds great for my upright, electric bass and keyboard... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 [quote name='bassace' post='1284379' date='Jun 27 2011, 05:31 PM']Not sure as I haven't any experience of a Mackie - Clarky uses one.[/quote] My Mackie is not powered - it is though great on a stand behind me at head height for use at serious volume Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halfmanhalfdrum Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 [quote name='tharidla' post='1284308' date='Jun 27 2011, 04:51 PM']Hi guys thanks for your replies. It seems that this pa speaker/mic thing is more popular than I first thought! The consideration I have now I suppose is cost-just looked up the QSC K10 and headway preamp. £689 and £199. Ow. And that doesn't include the mic! Would this setup be [b]that[/b] much better than a Mackie SRM350 (£320) and a behringer mixer? (£30 on ebay)[/quote] Custom Kent Armstrong Mag pickup through Bassbone preamp into Ashdown JJ Burnell, 4x8 & 1x15 ABM Cabs works for me. Huge volume on tap, no feedback and a DB tone that still sounds like a DB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tharidla Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 cool well it looks like I can borrow a mackie so I can at least give it a go for a while before I shell out! Now I just have the mic and preamp to worry about... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPJ Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 My two'penneth I would not recommend those cheap Behringer mixers for live work as the noise floor is pretty high with an annoying hiss. I would recommend a PJB bass buddy as a practical single channel preamp, and don't Radial do a dedicated pickup/microphone blender in their line of DI boxes? I've also tried the Mackie SRM450 as a bass monitor and didn't really like the lack of clarity, I found it just too 'muddy' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bassman Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 (edited) [quote name='JPJ' post='1284631' date='Jun 27 2011, 09:15 PM']I've also tried the Mackie SRM450 as a bass monitor and didn't really like the lack of clarity, I found it just too 'muddy'[/quote] That's a 12" which is very heavy We're talking 10" Mackie which is much better suited for double bass and a lot easier to manage weightwise. I favour small speakers for URB Something else to consider is a [url="http://www.bose.com/controller?url=/shop_online/speakers/portable_amplification_systems/l1_compact/index.jsp"]Bose L1 Compact[/url], it has a mic channel and a line input. Edited June 27, 2011 by Mr Bassman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tharidla Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 hmm bose L1 compact.....that's the futuristic looking pa thing, right? Is that any good for URB then? I would have thought the speakers in the spike thing to small... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bassman Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 [quote name='tharidla' post='1285235' date='Jun 28 2011, 01:20 PM']hmm bose L1 compact.....that's the futuristic looking pa thing, right? Is that any good for URB then? I would have thought the speakers in the spike thing to small...[/quote] These are excellent, I used mine with the Kolstein Travel Bass that Clarky now owns, faithful reproduction and good coverage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPJ Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 (edited) [quote name='Mr Bassman' post='1285262' date='Jun 28 2011, 01:43 PM']These are excellent, I used mine with the Kolstein Travel Bass that Clarky now owns, faithful reproduction and good coverage.[/quote] I don't know. IME they lack the umph you need for DB. We use one with our acoustic dou/trio and the L1 Compact just didn't have enough volume to give good clarity with the DB. They're great for guitar and voice but really lacked when it comes to DB. The regular Bose are probably better suited but stupidly expensive. Edited June 28, 2011 by TPJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bassman Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 [quote name='TPJ' post='1285424' date='Jun 28 2011, 04:54 PM']I don't know. IME they lack the umph you need for DB. We use one with our acoustic dou/trio and the L1 Compact just didn't have enough volume to give good clarity with the DB. They're great for guitar and voice but really lacked when it comes to DB. The regular Bose are probably better suited but stupidly expensive.[/quote] They reproduce what you put in, if you need more umph they don't do that. Friends of mine use one regularly for vocals, key and double bass and they're over the moon with it. I got two for p.a. and only need to use one on most gigs, and that's putting vocals, sax, keys and some bass tn through a Mackie mixer. (I usually have a small bassamp for personal monitoring) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPJ Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 [quote name='Mr Bassman' post='1285510' date='Jun 28 2011, 06:27 PM']They reproduce what you put in, if you need more umph they don't do that. Friends of mine use one regularly for vocals, key and double bass and they're over the moon with it. I got two for p.a. and only need to use one on most gigs, and that's putting vocals, sax, keys and some bass tn through a Mackie mixer. (I usually have a small bassamp for personal monitoring)[/quote] This is the L1 Compact your speaking about? Maybe we just play too loud We use it for on stage monitoring of all vocals and guitar and run the DB through a bass amp otherwise you just lose the db. It works great in coffee house/open mic situations but when we've tried running everything through, it poops out. Mind you we do get loud for an acoustic trio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tharidla Posted June 29, 2011 Author Share Posted June 29, 2011 well I haven't tried one but I would bet any money that for a jazz group where the drummer is swinging quite loud or a big band etc, The bose L1 wouldn't produce enough ummph. Also it depends on the bass, I play an old french bass with medium high action, and it packs some punch acoustically, which is really what I want to get through the amp that I'm using. The pickup doesn't really cut it. It sounds plastic and doesn't reproduce the hollow resonance of the bass. Incidentally, I got hold of a mackie 10 today and tried the pickup and and SM58 through it seperately (I don't have a mixer yet). With fishman preamp it sounded remarkably as good as any other bass amp. The mic sounded much better, really ballsy, punchy and resonant, although in need of some EQ. So I guess I need a mixer preamp, if anyone is wanting rid of one please feel free to get in touch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tharidla Posted June 30, 2011 Author Share Posted June 30, 2011 [quote]I'm getting very good results with a DPA4099/Headway/QSC K10 on a stand with a little bit of pickup blend into the second Headway channel.[/quote] Also I've been looking into this headway preamp thing-I notice that the eq on the module is for the combined signal, so you can't eq each channel seperately. Is this not really really annoying?!!? What if the mic is too boomy and you want to dial out some of the low end but keep the low end from the pickup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bassace Posted June 30, 2011 Share Posted June 30, 2011 [quote name='tharidla' post='1287215' date='Jun 30 2011, 01:26 AM']Also I've been looking into this headway preamp thing-I notice that the eq on the module is for the combined signal, so you can't eq each channel seperately. Is this not really really annoying?!!? What if the mic is too boomy and you want to dial out some of the low end but keep the low end from the pickup?[/quote] IME you can just about get away with it if you are putting in a small amount of pickup to tighten up the mic sound, and such is the Headway's spec that you don't get boom - more likely a bit too much top if you turn up. If you need more volume from the pup the best thing is to put another preamp in the line. Although one more component to consider it's not as daft as it sounds, with the Headway taking the place of the front end of a conventional bass amp. It would be much better though with a full two-channel Headway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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