Deflated bassist

[Prime_BASS]

After recording session over the weekend, I realise how crap I am. Even the singer noted "you are one of the best bassists I've seen, but you are also the most inconsistent".... In terms of pulling it off and not that is.

I'm putting in the hours of practice and I've played a tonn of gigs but he is right. Sometimes I'm just sh*t, and sometimes I feel like I'm making it intentionally hard for myself. I wish I could turn up and play roots and fithes with a pick and a bit of distortion, but it's not interesting enough for me at all and I'll just give up playing.

I know I can get it right on the night sometimes but not often enough and it's making me rather depressed and since coming home from the studio I've not even bothered setting up my gear again.

Have I faced an inconvenient truth, and give up to start spanking the tiny sixers again? How can I recapture the magic and be content with my abilities. ?

I don't know what is wrong with me.

[risingson]

Enjoy bass playing for what it is, don't overcomplicate things and let the music breathe by not overplaying and creating space for the rest of your band. They should be just as aware of not overplaying as you should too, it's not just a bass player thing.

It's really easy for people to offer advice here without necessarily knowing what kind of player you are and what kind of music you're into. Got any live material to share of your band or artists you particularly enjoy?

[Prime_BASS]

I'm just bout to upload our latest track to our Facebook page which is in my sig.
I had to do all the mixing myself so forgive me for it's amateurness.

Personally I'd rather sound a mixture of Rage, Midget and Mad Capsule Markets, and I'd say my Writing style is similar to the bassists of all three. I just don't seem to be very consistent in how well I would play, and hearing how bad I played over the weekend put another downer ontop of the fact that I wasn't totally happy with how the sound engineer insisted we set up and the recorded sound from my rig was pretty naff. It was one of those days that just didn't go aswell as it could of.

[AndyTravis]

I have days where I can't do what I think I can on bass.

I just put it down and walk away.

Other days I can barely function, yet my feel, and note choice seems pefect.

I've noticed red-light fever is important for me too, I hate recording, but only on a track by track basis, so if one song isn't working, I move on quickly. Sometimes I jam with the drummer, just nonesense, that can help.

It's frustrating, but 15 years in, i'm still down on myself, but I accept defeat and leave it. The next day is always different.

I suppose putting pressure upon yourself won't help, sometimes i'm good, rarely I am awesome, sometimes i let myself down, sometimes i impress myself. But i'm still me with my bass.

And I played simple EFFECTIVE lines, i feel better now i don't confuse the sh*t out of myself trying to be a hero.

Edited July 25, 2011 by AndyTravis

[risingson]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1315328' date='Jul 25 2011, 01:29 AM']I'm just bout to upload our latest track to our Facebook page which is in my sig.
I had to do all the mixing myself so forgive me for it's amateurness.

Personally I'd rather sound a mixture of Rage, Midget and Mad Capsule Markets, and I'd say my Writing style is similar to the bassists of all three. I just don't seem to be very consistent in how well I would play, and hearing how bad I played over the weekend put another downer ontop of the fact that I wasn't totally happy with how the sound engineer insisted we set up and the recorded sound from my rig was pretty naff. It was one of those days that just didn't go aswell as it could of.[/quote]

Cool, I'll check it out. In the meanwhile, relax a bit. Just enjoy playing music for what it is, and most often you'll be your own worst critic if you'll pardon the cliche.

Take practical steps to resolving your issues like getting your timing together with a metronome and making sure the notes you're choosing are the right ones at the right time. Most people would rather hear a bassist play one or two correct notes a bar as opposed to two right notes and 7 wrong/badly chosen ones. Simplicity is sometimes the key, and I think once you can realise this then it can be easier to sit back and enjoy the music that you're playing.

Edited July 25, 2011 by risingson

[Lozz196]

[quote name='risingson' post='1315330' date='Jul 25 2011, 01:39 AM']Cool, I'll check it out. In the meanwhile, relax a bit. Just enjoy playing music for what it is, and most often you'll be your own worst critic if you'll pardon the cliche.

Take practical steps to resolving your issues like getting your timing together with a metronome and making sure the notes you're choosing are the right ones at the right time. Most people would rather hear a bassist play one or two correct notes a bar as opposed to two right notes and 7 wrong/badly chosen ones. Simplicity is sometimes the key, and I think once you can realise this then it can be easier to sit back and enjoy the music that you're playing.[/quote]

Spot on, sometimes showing technical ability can really detract from the song. Lock in with the drummer, and see where that takes you.

[Blademan_98]

[quote name='risingson' post='1315330' date='Jul 25 2011, 01:39 AM']Cool, I'll check it out. In the meanwhile, relax a bit. Just enjoy playing music for what it is, [b]and most often you'll be your own worst critic[/b] if you'll pardon the cliche.[/quote]

A cliche but true! I think pretty much everyone goes through this at some time or another.

Stick with it

I started to play other instruments just to keep my interest (keyboard etc). Even thinking of picking up a saxaphone!

Consistancy can be hard to achieve, but it's a state of mind, rather than skill level (IMHO).

Blademan

Edited July 25, 2011 by Blademan_98

[chrismuzz]

I find I play the worst when I know I'm being recorded! And I play my best at rehearsals. Typical eh?

[JTUK]

It's an experience thing.

[gary mac]

In your original poat you mentioned about root/fifths. I would agree that it can be very boring but it can actually be a good exercise in discipline and give you the opportunity to not only lock in with the drummer but also give you chance to concentrate on what the other instruments are doing.

A bass player who locks in with the drums and plays what is needed for the song, even if it happens to be a root/fifth line will always, in my opinion be more impressive than an overly busy player who sacrifices the groove.


Don't give up on the bass, it seems like you have the talent and are just suffering a bit of uncertainty concerning your abilities.

Good luck with it.

[Norm]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1315296' date='Jul 25 2011, 12:24 AM']After recording session over the weekend, I realise how crap I am. Even the singer noted "you are one of the best bassists I've seen, but you are also the most inconsistent".... In terms of pulling it off and not that is.

I'm putting in the hours of practice and I've played a tonn of gigs but he is right. Sometimes I'm just sh*t, and sometimes I feel like I'm making it intentionally hard for myself. I wish I could turn up and play roots and fithes with a pick and a bit of distortion, but it's not interesting enough for me at all and I'll just give up playing.

I know I can get it right on the night sometimes but not often enough and it's making me rather depressed and since coming home from the studio I've not even bothered setting up my gear again.

Have I faced an inconvenient truth, and give up to start spanking the tiny sixers again? How can I recapture the magic and be content with my abilities. ?

I don't know what is wrong with me.[/quote]

PrimeBass, I feel you are being a bit too hard on yourself. Sure, we all have a downer somedays where it feels like nowt is going right, thats just part of the artistic, creative process & mindset. A pressure situation like recording can compound that, especially if the vibe isn't quite right. Try something different for a couple of days, leave the bass alone. Play another instrument, listen to some completely different music than usual. Come back to it fresh.
All the best,
Norm

[Monckyman]

In my experience recording can bring any musician low.
It`s process of highlighting the smallest flaw and presenting it to everyone for criticism can be pretty disheartening and it applies to any muso, but especially singers!
Don`t be disheartened though, it`s an experience everyone experiences at some point.
You can improve your technique if you like, and practice in more demanding ways, but as the others above have stated, it`s more of a head thing, and allowing yourself to relax and enjoy the vibes, rather than striving to sound uber original and interesting all the time is definitely the answer.
Good luck!
MM

[Musicman20]

Swings and roundabouts I guess. Don't be too hard on yourself.

My teacher (I had lessons for 2 years when I was about 13/14) forced me to record with an older set of guys when I was 15. At that time, they were quite a professional covers/originals band (they played two different sets).

For some reason, recording didnt phase me one bit. It still hasnt to this day, although recently I havent really recorded with anyone who has exceptional chops or anything like that, so Ive always been relaxed.

BUT, and this isnt really related to bass, I had a deflating moment this weekend as well. So, I know what you mean. I played a gig on Saturday night, and I must admit as a band we were excellent. Its good when a vocalist compliments your playing! Plus a few audience gave a few compliments, which is a nice feeling.

I decided to practice more golf on Sunday, and a friend took me to a 9 hole course for a non competitive practice run. He has been nore than helpful, but wow do I feel out of my comfort zone! Not only do I have barely any equipment (to which the rather rude staff made comments on - complaint going straight to them today) Im actually still a total beginner. Its nothing like other sports where you can pickup a ball (eg football) and have a kick about with friends...it demands so much more from beginners.

So, all in all, Im still a total golf newbie, and I dont like being the beginner!

Edited July 25, 2011 by Musicman20

[Linus27]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1315328' date='Jul 25 2011, 01:29 AM']I'm just bout to upload our latest track to our Facebook page which is in my sig.
I had to do all the mixing myself so forgive me for it's amateurness.

Personally I'd rather sound a mixture of Rage, Midget and Mad Capsule Markets, and I'd say my Writing style is similar to the bassists of all three. I just don't seem to be very consistent in how well I would play, and hearing how bad I played over the weekend put another downer ontop of the fact that I wasn't totally happy with how the sound engineer insisted we set up and the recorded sound from my rig was pretty naff. It was one of those days that just didn't go aswell as it could of.[/quote]

Sorry to go a little off topic but do you mean the band Midget who were a three piece, around 10 years ago and did a song called camouflage? If so I know then and we did tons of gigs together. Great that they are being remembered if so.

[ZMech]

Isn't thinking you're rubbish part of the learning process? No matter how good you are, once you realise there's a next stage to acheive, and what the vital aspects are, any deviation from that and you'll think you played awfully.

[aldude]

[quote name='AndyTravis' post='1315329' date='Jul 25 2011, 01:38 AM']... Sometimes I jam with the drummer, just nonesense, that can help.[/quote]

This! If you just mess about a bit then that might remind you why you play bass in the first place ... fun?

[LawrenceH]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1315296' date='Jul 25 2011, 12:24 AM']I'm putting in the hours of practice[/quote]

What/how are you practising? From my own somewhat painful experience inconsistency is down to poor technique and that's what you have to focus on in practice. I DON'T mean widdling away doing fast runs but looking closely at your hands and the way they move when you're playing a particular line. I learnt a lot simply from watching the right hand of good jazz players on youtube vids. Even on complex lines their hands stay in comfortable positions, and their movements are very economical. The more you flail around the less control you have, the more hit-or-miss it becomes.
I have periodically gone back to specific exercises to iron out problems - I see this aspect of technique as an issue of biomechanics.

[charic]

Maybe start from scratch, pick up a song that you think is really easy and work up from there again, also maybe sit down with a teacher and just make sure your not making a glaring mistake.

Otherwise just record more often and eventually it'll become second nature. Your probably overthinking it.

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='Linus27' post='1315470' date='Jul 25 2011, 10:20 AM']Sorry to go a little off topic but do you mean the band Midget who were a three piece, around 10 years ago and did a song called camouflage? If so I know then and we did tons of gigs together. Great that they are being remembered if so.[/quote]

Yes, I actually have one of the bass players basses. Used it to record with aswell.

[quote name='LawrenceH' post='1315532' date='Jul 25 2011, 11:04 AM']What/how are you practising? From my own somewhat painful experience inconsistency is down to poor technique and that's what you have to focus on in practice. I DON'T mean widdling away doing fast runs but looking closely at your hands and the way they move when you're playing a particular line. I learnt a lot simply from watching the right hand of good jazz players on youtube vids. Even on complex lines their hands stay in comfortable positions, and their movements are very economical. The more you flail around the less control you have, the more hit-or-miss it becomes.
I have periodically gone back to specific exercises to iron out problems - I see this aspect of technique as an issue of biomechanics.[/quote]

Well I'll do all sorts from learning lines from different genres to widen my musical vocab' to going over theory stuff and practicing simple stuff, every so often I'll make a point to make sure my pinky is being used as much as possible as I often find it's dead weight.

Cheers for all the kind words guys, they'll be a track to listen to on the band page in my sig by the end of tonight so hopefully you guys can actually hear what I'm doing right/wrong.

I guess I'm going to go back to plying some blink 182 on guitar or shits and giggles to try and relax a little.

[Gust0o]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1315296' date='Jul 25 2011, 12:24 AM']After recording session over the weekend, I realise how crap I am. Even the singer noted "you are one of the best bassists I've seen, but you are also the most inconsistent".... In terms of pulling it off and not that is.[/quote]

I listened and didn't like the singer. Horses for courses, eh?

That's some hard feedback to take, all told. I know how touchy-feely bands can be - you never really want to be overly critical of someone else's efforts, so you get the sh*t sandwich. Some nice bread and sweet promises to pad it all out, with a thin smear of sh*te in the middle, for taste. "You're the best, but..."

Did he say any more about what it is he finds inconsistent? That would be a quick route to any problems - either with your playing or his hearing.

For the rest of it, don't be so hard on yourself. Do what the track requires, and regard that as the ultimate arbiter. Practice where necessary, but don't wear yourself out or try and up the technical ante if it's satisfying a whim only.

Sorry to hear you sounding down about this

[Linus27]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1315554' date='Jul 25 2011, 11:22 AM']Yes, I actually have one of the bass players basses. Used it to record with aswell.[/quote]

Cool stuff, which one is it. I remember him using Stingray copies live.

Just for you,

Edited July 25, 2011 by Linus27

[molan]

I remember reading a book that was really helpful in terms of how you 'think' about playing which basically said if you concentrate too hard and try to think about every note then you'r playing can become worse.

It was more or less saying, as others have, that relaxing a little and trying not to over-think about everything can lead to a much more natural and organic feel to your playing.

Really helped me to overcome some live performance barriers at the time

[mcnach]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1315296' date='Jul 25 2011, 12:24 AM']After recording session over the weekend, I realise how crap I am. Even the singer noted "you are one of the best bassists I've seen, but you are also the most inconsistent".... In terms of pulling it off and not that is.

I'm putting in the hours of practice and I've played a tonn of gigs but he is right. Sometimes I'm just sh*t, and sometimes I feel like I'm making it intentionally hard for myself. I wish I could turn up and play roots and fithes with a pick and a bit of distortion, but it's not interesting enough for me at all and I'll just give up playing.

I know I can get it right on the night sometimes but not often enough and it's making me rather depressed and since coming home from the studio I've not even bothered setting up my gear again.

Have I faced an inconvenient truth, and give up to start spanking the tiny sixers again? How can I recapture the magic and be content with my abilities. ?

I don't know what is wrong with me.[/quote]



Sometimes I feel like that too.
I may get compliments from bandmates, from some audience members... that's nice. BUt then I get home and I listen to myself play and I feel sometimes that I just have no ideas, no ability...
Recording sessions only makes it worse... asn it seems that what you can breeze through at a gig just doesn't work when teh light is on, and I question everything... and I listen to teh recording and all I hear is inconsistencies, errors in timing... then the others nod and say it's good and we move on (so I think "don't they care? don't they notice?") or they say "yeah, let's do it again"... and makes me feel I'm slowing things down unnecessarily because what I am playing is not technically difficult.

But the feeling goes away after a while and I just cannot imagine not playing bass. I'll just keep trying, playing, practicing, and invariably, everytime I look back at what I was doing 6 months earlier, a year earlier... I find that I have actually learnt a lot in this period. Sometimes it is difficult to realise how much we learn because it happens in small steps, little by little. But think about what you were doing this time last year. Listen to recordings of ideas (if you have them.. I always have my Zoom H2 handy and record clips of things that I find interesting or that I'd like to work on later)...

And as for the recordings...
Do you have any of the RHCP multitracks that are around the internet? I have the whole of BSSM and a few other individual songs (Can't stop, Tell me baby, Dani california...)
Isolate the bass and listen to it.
Noises, inconsistencies, sometimes bum notes...
If Flea doesn't worry terribly about those, and the result sounds as good as it does... maybe I should stop getting depressed about that too and focus on teh other bits, the bits that Flea does so well, the actual music, and keep at it.

Bottomline is... sometimes I feel like I am totally useless. But I am a happier useless man if I strap a bass on me. And the feeling doesn't last long, usualy a gig cures it

Hang in there!

[BigRedX]

Are you playing complicated stuff because it's what the song needs or is because otherwise you don't find the music interesting enough? If it's the later then maybe you should consider that this isn't the right band for you and that's the real problem.

If you're really into the music (and unless you're doing it simply to make a living you ought to be) then what the overall song sounds like is far more important than complex playing, and as a musician you should be able to feel that.

Alternatively if it is simply a question of red light fever then you just need to do more recording. Or may be the atmosphere in the studio is wrong. IMO this is the most important thing when it comes to recording. A good studio is all about getting the best performance down and part of that is making the band feel comfortable. It doesn't matter how much flashy gear you have if the atmosphere isn't the right one to bring out the best in the performers.

[skankdelvar]

Some excellent advice above.

There's another perspective, though. It might be a question of goals and 'fit'.

In deriving inspiration from players you admire, you may be trying to play stuff you're never going to competently deliver. There might be other music / styles / lines you could play better. I read somewhere that the stuff you don't - or can't - play will define your unique voice with as much validity as the stuff you can.

By all means try out the advice that others have given you. If it doesn't work, play along to some really simple jam tracks with your brain switched firmly off. Don't ask yourself how someone else might play it. Don't think about theory. Just let your motor skills and your sub-conscious do the work for a change.

You might not end up sounding like your musical influencers, but you might be the best bass player of your kind. Being unique is a good thing.