How well does a Jazz cut through?

[Mylkinut]

[quote name='Lozz196' post='1317014' date='Jul 26 2011, 01:35 PM']If looking for a Jazz, this has def got to be on the list:

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=147740"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=147740[/url]

MIJ Jazz, for £350.[/quote]

It's a beauty, there's also a 2008 MIA that turned up on Gumtree yesterday for £450. Was in the market for a Precision but I can't really ignore many of the Jazzes that have been cropping up.

Anyone want to lend me their Jazz for a band practice or 3?

Edited July 26, 2011 by Mylkinut

[mcnach]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='1316812' date='Jul 26 2011, 11:26 AM']True but they can also have a slightly scooped tone and this wont help getting through a loud busy mix, especially if your cabs are scooped as well.[/quote]


but that's just NOT true!!!

they only have a scooped sound if you have both pickups fully on!

In addition, the height of each pickup has a profound result in teh final result when both pickups are "fully on". Worth experimenting with that too.

Edited July 26, 2011 by mcnach

[dan670844]

[quote name='Mylkinut' post='1317223' date='Jul 26 2011, 03:52 PM']It's a beauty, there's also a 2008 MIA that turned up on Gumtree yesterday for £450. Was in the market for a Precision but I can't really ignore many of the Jazzes that have been cropping up.

Anyone want to lend me their Jazz for a band practice or 3? [/quote]


No worries dude when I can get my lazy arsed lot out of London town, even though last time they played down in Bournemouth it was ' Quote one of the best gigs we played, great great crowd' and no one could get them out of Wiggles afterwards Lauren you are a babe he he he!!

Edited July 26, 2011 by dan670844

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='mcnach' post='1317235' date='Jul 26 2011, 04:01 PM']but that's just NOT true!!!

they only have a scooped sound if you have both pickups fully on!

In addition, the height of each pickup has a profound result in teh final result when both pickups are "fully on". Worth experimenting with that too.[/quote]

what a confusing answer.

Im the one who said they have a scooped tone and ive also stated i like running both pups on soooooo, yes it is true.
:-)

[mcnach]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='1317274' date='Jul 26 2011, 04:28 PM']what a confusing answer.

Im the one who said they have a scooped tone and ive also stated i like running both pups on soooooo, yes it is true.
:-)[/quote]



but it's like saying "Bass X hass a very boomy indistinct sound".
Well, if you boost your lows to the max and cut treble entirely... it's true. But then someone else may do teh opposite and say "Bass X has a very thin sound".
Both untrue.
Bass X is capable of that, but that is not THE sound of teh bass, if you see what I mean.

The inherent sound of a Jazz is... well, three basic things: neck, both, or bridge, all very different and only one is very scooped.

What I was objecting was to slapping a label "Jazz=scooped" categorically.

I suspect we've all have heard Jazz basses and know all this... I guess it's easy to get caught up in semantics.

Peace

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='mcnach' post='1317305' date='Jul 26 2011, 04:49 PM']What I was objecting was to slapping a label "Jazz=scooped" categorically.

I suspect we've all have heard Jazz basses and know all this... I guess it's easy to get caught up in semantics.

Peace [/quote]

But i wasnt saying that, at least not without qualifying the statement.

From my earlier post:
"Ive had a PJ but the problem there is you dont get a true Jazz tone as you only have the one single coil bridge pup, and [b]i like the slightly mid scooped tone of both pups on[/b]"

So we both agree with the above, both pups on can give a slight scooped tone (im not the only one saying this), and ive said i like both pups on so it was the "this is just not true" opening line in your post that seemed confusing.
Im no there to argue, just to point out i did say with both pups on and never meant to make it to mean anything else.

Ive only owned a handful of Jazz basses, far less than most people on here but they all sounded different. The HW-1/one definitely had a lot of clarity and growl, were definitely the ones that cut through alot better than the others but lacked a bit of low end, the Lakland DJ5 was warm and solid, a bit too warm for me back then and the CV jazz is pretty close to the Lakland, although with the 74's in it was a nice mid punch to it. I also had 3 MIA's last year and these sounded just perfect to me, full and deep but with the articulation of the HW-1/one's, and these also had less of a scoop with both pups on.

Edited July 26, 2011 by dave_bass5

[mcnach]

[dan670844]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='1317339' date='Jul 26 2011, 05:17 PM']But i wasnt saying that, at least not without qualifying the statement.

From my earlier post:
"Ive had a PJ but the problem there is you dont get a true Jazz tone as you only have the one single coil bridge pup, and [b]i like the slightly mid scooped tone of both pups on[/b]"

So we both agree with the above, both pups on can give a slight scooped tone (im not the only one saying this), and ive said i like both pups on so it was the "this is just not true" opening line in your post that seemed confusing.
Im no there to argue, just to point out i did say with both pups on and never meant to make it to mean anything else.

Ive only owned a handful of Jazz basses, far less than most people on here but they all sounded different. The HW-1/one definitely had a lot of clarity and growl, were definitely the ones that cut through alot better than the others but lacked a bit of low end, the Lakland DJ5 was warm and solid, a bit too warm for me back then and the CV jazz is pretty close to the Lakland, although with the 74's in it was a nice mid punch to it. I also had 3 MIA's last year and these sounded just perfect to me, full and deep but with the articulation of the HW-1/one's, and these also had less of a scoop with both pups on.[/quote]


Dudes Jazz pickups are out of phase always just to varying degrees, so they always cancel each others freq out a little, if it bothers that much get a series switch

[dave_bass5]

Again, let me say I like the tone of the two pups full on. That's highlighted in my post above, where are you getting the idea i don't like it?
Im not complaining, please can this be noted so no more of this derailing goes on.

Edited July 26, 2011 by dave_bass5

[Conan]

I like Jazzes and I like Precisions (and their derivatives). They can be similar or they can be different. Both can be heard in a band mix, but it depends on so many other factors as to how one accomplishes this!

People quote Geddy Lee as an example of how well a J can cut through a band mix. Well, yes, that's true - but Rush are only a three piece and Alex's guitar tends to use predominantly the high and upper-mid frequencies - leaving the whole of the mid and low-mid section to Dirk. So it's maybe not surprising that he cuts through - despite his distorted sound (or maybe because of it?!). Also, I have no idea how Mr. Lee sets up his bass, but I suspect that there is slightly more neck pickup in his tone and the bridge one is rolled off a tad. Dunno if this is true, but my ears suggest it as a possibility.

Taking another prog-rock example, the bassist from Polish band Riverside has a lovely, rich J sound - both pickups full-on I would guess. It sounds really nice, but does sometimes struggle to find it's own niche within that band's mix. Maybe it's the guitar tone? Maybe the addition of keyboards? The way he seems to get round it is to turn up the volume (OK, to be exact, the engineer/sound man turns him up).

Also, as we have established on a number of other threads, everyone's ears are different. Some people just hear some frequencies/sounds better than others.

[risingson]

A lot of misinformation flying round this thread

The short and tall of it is this: I've used a number of different kinds of jazz basses as a gigging musician for the past 5 years and never have I once had a problem being heard, on stage or off. If you're having problems being heard, adjust your EQ, that's what it's there for. If you've been a P bass user then playing a jazz bass live will come as a bit of a shock to you, but you'll soon get used to it. The jazz bass, just like the P bass, is a great design and they both have their merits.

Edited July 26, 2011 by risingson

[dave_bass5]

[quote name='risingson' post='1317647' date='Jul 26 2011, 09:12 PM']A lot of misinformation flying round this thread [/quote]

Like what?

[Stag]

Ummm, doesn't JPJ use one on a lot of the Zep stuff? You can definitely hear him....

[gsgbass]

[quote name='Stag' post='1317837' date='Jul 26 2011, 07:04 PM']Ummm, doesn't JPJ use one on a lot of the Zep stuff? You can definitely hear him.... [/quote]

Yep. You can hear him.

[dave_bass5]

Ive always loved Damon Minchella's work with Paul Weller, again, no problems hearing those great bass lines played on a Jazz.

[Jerry_B]

My favourite Jazz player must be Klaus Flouride, from the Dead Kennedys. His tone [i]always[/i] cut through, whether recorded or live:



That or the bass player from Decima Victima (whose name escapes me right now):



I mention this as IIRC such ideas cropped up in another thread about whether jazzes were 'punk' enough in terms of presence, compared to Pbasses.

[Mr Fudge]

It's all in the fingers ... not the bass ... dig in and your bass cuts through...

simples ...