Markbass...do I regret selling thee and want to buy another?!

[chrismuzz]

F1 + grit pedal is the way to go!

I've never tries their tube stuff and I'm so happy with solid state I don't think I'll bother

[dave_bass5]

While I've never tried their tube heads I do have ther studio 1 amp simulator. This has a T501 head and one of the other tube heads and I really can't hear any tube effect.
Maybe this isn't a true indication of how they sound but I really don't see the point of the tube in these heads.

[JTUK]

Do you guys know what sound you want...have you ever been close to getting it..?
Do you think it is this magical thing that you'll just magic out of the air when you find that certain amp...?

It seems to me that there is way too much idealism about a sound when you aren't sure how to start gong about it.

Your signal chain is made up of a good few parts and then you'll have variables like room, etc etc.. so changing an amp to get to Room A will change a LOT when in room B...does that make the amp crap..?


No.. you need to be able to run with different paramenters of bass signal, amp, cabs, strings and others...

If your bass sounds good from the start, you stand the best chance of getting a decent signal out time and time again..but it might not always be the same.
This is why you don't want to mess with a lot of EQ,...that is another variable to turn over in different circumstances.

IMV, a typical example will be a bass sound with vintage thump..read old gunky strings. This can work really well, but it is also the sound that has least leeway when things are 'off'... you'll find you are adding bass to an already bass gunky sound...so compounding what is upsetting the sound in the 1st place with more gunk..
Of course, you will not worry when it works out to be something you like..but when you don't, start tearing your hair out.
And when you hear players talk about upping the mids to cut through...??? which can totally destroy a sound...but hey, you can be heard, right..??

Once the amp is decent, you should be able to work with it... if you are disatisfied with a slight change of nuance in sound, you'll be forever chasing your tail.
This is why amps with enhance/timbre/VPE etc ...work, as there is less to mess around with and get confused.

You need to start with a good core sound off the bass..and then be able to live and work with the variations that are thrown up all the time.

I'd start with a very clean lively peaky bass sound ( clean strings) and I know that everything can..if need be..be added onto that.
All my amp/cab does is enhance that sound...

Maybe people are not that knocked out with their core bass sound and expect the amp/cab chain to rescue it...when that is a REAL uphill task.

IMO.

Edited August 6, 2011 by JTUK

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='1329509' date='Aug 6 2011, 02:14 AM']While I've never tried their tube heads I do have ther studio 1 amp simulator. This has a T501 head and one of the other tube heads and I really can't hear any tube effect.
Maybe this isn't a true indication of how they sound but I really don't see the point of the tube in these heads.[/quote]

personally there is a point and an amp simulator isnt going to show that very well.

It is hard to describe the difference, but it is significant. Its also more noticable in a head like the LMTube, because you can compare the tube to the SS preamp on the fly. you should definatly go an try one out, for me the tube add a lot more harmonical dynamics transients and all that other stuff.
also the THD percentage is usually higher in a Tube preamp than in an SS.

I dont think we are being deluded when trying different heads to get different sounds, JTUK you are being rather simplistic as I'm sure no matter how good the bass is, if the heads preamp is very coloured and made of inferior quality components you are going to get a very different sound than what you can from a very well made head. then you have to take into account the cabs voicing. Crap head into crap speaker sounds crap, good head into crap speaker sounds crap. crap head into good speaker sounds good.

I can get my sound from either the markbass range or TC but the only reason I switchwas that the marketing deluded me into thinking I needed all those nice lights and features.

[JTUK]

[quote name='Prime_BASS' post='1329575' date='Aug 6 2011, 08:27 AM']JTUK you are being rather simplistic as I'm sure no matter how good the bass is, if the heads preamp is very coloured and made of inferior quality components you are going to get a very different sound than what you can from a very well made head. then you have to take into account the cabs voicing. Crap head into crap speaker sounds crap, good head into crap speaker sounds crap. crap head into good speaker sounds good.

I can get my sound from either the markbass range or TC but the only reason I switchwas that the marketing deluded me into thinking I needed all those nice lights and features.[/quote]


I seem to have had this conversation before about parts and cost..but lets not go back to the Sue Ryder thread...which if I recall will all be moved on by now or modded out of sight.

I'd say that crap at any stage makes the job difficult. A great cab can't rescue a poor head any more than it can influence a poor sounding bass.

Thinking of it as a chain, in hi-fi terms. If you have a weak part and that part is at the source, ie the bass...the rest of the project is compromised.


Some basses sound bad, so the amp is under pressure straight away..and that assumes the amp is any good, so by the time you get to the speaker, you have no chance.
And out of the chain, the cab has the least amount of influence...as the sound character is inherrent and can't be changed. the cab is the cab, non EQ...it just repoduces the end product.

I think you have been brainwashed if you think a cab can make the chain stack any good. All you are amplifying is crap..

[Musicman20]

I definitely agree a crap amp cannot be rescued by a great cab. It might bring out the best, but the best is still crap!

You definitely don't have to believe the hype with the current trend of £1000 cabs. The difference is very very negligible unless you are playing a superb gig/venue.

I've played cheap amps/cabs at great venues and it sounded immense!

But agreed, you put a crap bass sound in, you get crap out!

[Prime_BASS]

I whole heartedly agree with that a crap bass has no hopes.

If I had to say how important each piece of the pie is in terms of slices I would say each gets an equal share (ish) with the bass maybe getting an extra piece and a bit of cream.

If the cab can't voice what you want hear very well or at all then no matter how good the bass and amp are it'll sound (maybe not crap) not as good as if the cab has got decent set of speakers and is the correct size and the port(if it has one) is correctly tuned. Put your hand round a singers throat, she's going to sound choked, no?

If I plug my stuff into an A-typical "bass" cab it doesn't sound the same as war I usually plug into. Probably not crap again but not pleasing to me. Plug in the same bass and amp into a variety of cabs you'll gets different sounds.

Also from what I've seen of published frequency curves speakers "designed" for bass cabs tend to be very bass heavy. I don't want that in a cab it'll sound all mushy and horrible.

I will agree that the right EQing (providing you know how) can help a lot but it doesn't work miracles.

[WalMan]

[quote name='nottswarwick' post='1329286' date='Aug 5 2011, 09:50 PM']What are the LM tube ones like? Can they do the classic MB clean, and also have the tube blended for a bit of grit?[/quote]Love my LMT, and into the BF Super12T sounds great IMO. Pre mix edged just past 12 o'clock, EQ flat and no filter adjustment is looooovely. Grit was what I was after. Set as I do it's more warmth than grit, but nice

Just thinking of a BF Midget for smaller gigs.

[quote name='nottswarwick' post='1329300' date='Aug 5 2011, 10:04 PM']cool. Sorry for the thread hijack. Anyone used a Littlemark Rocker....actually, new thread alert...[/quote]Tried one at the London Show last year, efore I got the LMT as I had the CMD combo and was looking for a little grit. The valve on the Rocker was just too dirty for me.

[dave_bass5]

Ive a lot to catch up on as ive been away but just a few points, IMO of course.

Crap equipment. Well, other than very, very cheap gear (i agreed with John about the SR basses) who's to say whats crap and what's not? IME the GK head i owned was crap, as was the Epifani UL212. Neither cheap but both pieces of gear that i wouldn't touch again.
Ive loved a MAG C-115 deep cab and that cost me £85. I hated a MB 151P traveller and that cost close to £500. So, i think the use of the word crap is a bit meaningless unless you state why its crap, and of course this might only be your opinion so it doesn't really make it crap, just that one person thinks its crap.

I totally agree that it all starts from the bass but IME its the whole chain that gives us our tone. Most heads ive owned have sounded very different, so the amp plays a big part for me, as does the cab. Ive used different cabs with my old set up and had different tones, and no amount of EQ was ever going to balance the differences out.

I do agree that if your using use amounts of EQ then something isnt right, but look at how most users use MB heads. Almost every post ive ever read states the owner has the EQ pretty much flat so there must be sometihng the MB heads have going for them.

[Old Horse Murphy]

I've just bought the Markbass Traveller 2 x 10 and 1 x 15 to go with my Little Mark Tube 800. To say I am happy is a total understatement.

Anyone want to buy an Epifani UL115 going cheap?

[Linus27]

[quote name='Old Horse Murphy' post='1331068' date='Aug 7 2011, 04:54 PM']I've just bought the Markbass Traveller 2 x 10 and 1 x 15 to go with my Little Mark Tube 800. To say I am happy is a total understatement.

Anyone want to buy an Epifani UL115 going cheap? [/quote]

Nick, I am looking at exactly the same rig as you apart from the head which I am looking at either an F1 or a LMIII. Can I bring my Ray round and have a play as I am really usure if I should sell my Aggy cabs for MarkBass ones???

[Old Horse Murphy]

[quote name='Linus27' post='1331241' date='Aug 7 2011, 07:05 PM']Nick, I am looking at exactly the same rig as you apart from the head which I am looking at either an F1 or a LMIII. Can I bring my Ray round and have a play as I am really usure if I should sell my Aggy cabs for MarkBass ones???[/quote]

Of course you can mate

[Linus27]

[quote name='Old Horse Murphy' post='1331250' date='Aug 7 2011, 07:09 PM']Of course you can mate [/quote]

Thanks matey. Will send you a PM now.

[Musicman20]

Well, I think im sorting a deal on my Genz SL900 and going for a LM3 or F500.

I do really like the SL900. It sounds fantastic. But the problem is, the RH750 is also fantastic, and also has no problem in producing a clean tube amp tone. As I like the RH750 a hell of a lot, im going to change the SL900 for a Markbass.

I think its the fact all my amps are very 'tubey' warm and aimed towards a more voiced vintage tone means one has to go for the clean Markbass tone.

Never thought Id actually jump back to Markbass, but they do make excellent gear.

[Prime_BASS]

[quote name='Musicman20' post='1331441' date='Aug 7 2011, 09:59 PM']Well, I think im sorting a deal on my Genz SL900 and going for a LM3 or F500.

I do really like the SL900. It sounds fantastic. But the problem is, the RH750 is also fantastic, and also has no problem in producing a clean tube amp tone. As I like the RH750 a hell of a lot, im going to change the SL900 for a Markbass.

I think its the fact all my amps are very 'tubey' warm and aimed towards a more voiced vintage tone means one has to go for the clean Markbass tone.

Never thought Id actually jump back to Markbass, but they do make excellent gear.[/quote]

I was actually going to say before hand. One doesnt need 2 amps that do the same thing.

Depending on what you are after, the LM3 maybe a goo choice as it sounds naturally cleaner due to the stunning flat response, where as the F500 has drops in the low and high mids and a boost back in the centre mids, which some say give a punchy sort of sound. It's not too over bearing though as the low high and the centre mid are all pretty level. I just think te EQ section is easyier to use on te LMseries as you know it's flat all ready, so if you need cut/boost something it's a bit easyier to do.

[Musicman20]

Yeah, the LM3 was SO easy to use, and I just want a simple amp I can plug my bass into, not fiddle with, and basically use the VLE to taste. Plus I dont need the apparent '900' of the SL900, the RH750 can handle the big gigs.

The F500 is a great bit of kit, despite the fact I think its a bit 'cluttered', but Im thinking that my RH750 has all the bells and whistles (eg worldwide voltage use, mute, semi-para EQ etc) so what I need is an amp that sounds ultra clean and as flat as possible, in a small-ish package.

The LM3 was great when I had it...the low mids are set a bit high, but to be honest, I dont think its that big a deal when none of my cabs are mid scooped (in fact they are all quite punchy in the mids, especially the Aguilar DB).

Weird how things work out.