Which One To Convert To Fretless?

[Phaedrus]

I own Tune TWB53FM, Yamaha BB605 & soon will aquire a Yamaha RBX375.

My friend has songs he's recording and a fretless sound would really suit some of them. My covers band does a couple of songs I'd like to use fretless on.

I'm not talking Jaco or Mick Karn playing - just simple roots with very occasional gliss & vibrato & simple upper register scales/fills.

I'm thinking the RBX is the one I'd least mind having modded, but think the Tune may actually be better suited to a conversion.

If I were to buy new, I'd be spending very little - €400 or less, with any trade-in taken off that. It'd have to be a 5-string.

What say ye?


Mark

Edited April 29, 2008 by Phaedrus

[Rich]

I have an RBX765A which I've just had defretted, and it makes a great fretless. Lots of [i]mwah[/i] and a great feel. Go for it, but have it done professionally.

[Phaedrus]

Absolutely - I'd imagine removing the frets would be pretty straightforward, but filling the gaps is surely a professional job.

Thanks,

Mark

[skywalker]

Hi Mark

Might be easier just to change the neck - I did it on my old crap P-copy and got a really nice fretless out of it for next to nothing.


Steve

[lonestar]

[quote name='Phaedrus' post='154555' date='Mar 10 2008, 02:27 PM']Absolutely - I'd imagine removing the frets would be pretty straightforward, but filling the gaps is surely a professional job.

Thanks,

Mark[/quote]

Depends on your woodworking skills. I defretted my hartke rosewood board and filled the slots with mahogany veneer, which cost about 4 quid purchased online. and took a couple of evenings from start to finish. It did involve quite a lot of cutting and sanding. You just really have to take your time.
I actually found removing the frets quite easy as long as they come out cleanly without damaging the edges of the slots. you can get special pliers for this but flush cutting wire cutters will do it.
There are quite few web resources for this kind of job but I've lost the site that I referred to.
This one might give you an idea of what's involved. I didn't bother heating the frets. [url="http://www.geocities.com/charlesarms/defretintro.htm"]http://www.geocities.com/charlesarms/defretintro.htm[/url]

Happy to help with any more advice that I can.

mike

Edited March 10, 2008 by lonestar

[BigRedX]

2 1/2 years ago I was in the same situation as you. I thought about converting a bass I didn't use much to fretless but realised that the reason I didn't use it much was because I didn't really like it and was unlikely to like it much more without frets. I liked all my other basses too much as they were to contemplate taking the frets out. In the end I was lucky enough to score a cheap Wesley Acrylic bass off eBay that had already been defretted. That was good enough for me to get to grips with and I didn't have to worry about spoiling one of my other basses if I couldn't get on with it.

If you have a bass you like but don't use much then getting it defretted could be a option. Alternatively get a Squire VM Jazz fretless. That's what replaced the Wesley. Great bass for very little money.

[Phaedrus]

Hmm...

I just read a few online descriptions of guys defretting their basses. They range from pretty competent and successful to bedroom-botchey and amateur.


They all follow the basically similar steps:

1. Protect the neck & body during the work.
2. Carefully remove the frets. Various methods can be applied. The more careful you are with this, the less corrective work you'll have to do later and the cleaner/more professional result you'll achieve.
3. Clean the fingerboard & fret slots. Again, various methods can be applied.
4. Fill the fret slots. It seems either real wood or flexible filler can be used.
5. Clean it all up again - sand-check-clean & repeat as necesary. It seeems there are radiussed sanding blocks available, so a choice has to be made here.
6. Coat the finished work with an appropriate product.

I'm confident that I'm competently handy, and I understand the thoery & principles of neck construction and the fit of the frets in the fingerboard, so I may just try it myself.

I'll need to read more later, but now I've put myself under pressure to finish a report and slideshow for an 11am meeting, [i]and[/i] fit in my brekky.

DAMN YOU OCD!!


Mark

[BigRedX]

Before you start just think of the value of the bass you're converting with its frets still on. Plus the cost of any extra tools and consumables you'll need. Plus your time. Then consider the Squire VMJ is around £200.

[MB1]

MB1.
I kid you not try a Warwick Streamer fretless Rockbass before you get the pliers out.Rather good, passive and wont break the bank!

[Phaedrus]

Hi,

The bass in question is a Yamaha RBX375. I'm getting it for free. The donor (my nephew) insists he won't take money off me. It's been gathering dust on its one string in his bedroom for almost a year. He's graduated (in his perception) to guitar.

I don't want to de-fret my BB605 - it's just too useful as a workhorse fretted bass. And my Tune is like a custom boutique bass to me, so chopping that (even professionally) would probably sting too much, even though I have a feeling it might actually be the bass that's better suited to a conversion. But when I go for a Warwick Corvette $$ 5, I'll have to trade/sell my most expensive bass to fund it, and the Tune is my most expensive bass (currently retails in Ireland at €850 (£600-ish) new).

I've played the RBX (a few rehearsals and one gig) and I do like it. It's not a top-end bass, but definitely not a dog. It's currently €330 new from MusicStore. I can't remember if the tuning was 100% stable, as would obviously be essential on a fretless, but I equally don't remember it going out of tune when I played it.

I'm sure I've got all the tools I'd need out in the shed. I'm a bit of a tool collector nerd anyway. I even have a convex rasp I got when I was making my own weathered washed-up-on-the-beach-look timber shelves for my living room. And I've got a 3-leg mechanical bearing puller. And if I need a new tool, I'll be happy to get it.

I'm curious about the "veneer" strips most seem to be describng as fret-slot fillers/markers. Is this the same veneer stuff you'd find on kitchen counter-tops & stuff like that? That seems odd. That's usually not wood. Any advice on that would be apreciated.

FWIW is there a 5-string VMJ? It's a pretty bass, well suited to fretless "style" cos of the obvious Jaco link. I can't see one on Thomann or MusicStore. I did look at the passive Streamer, and thought it'd be a great bass for the money, but the RBX for free is even better value.

I know Stewblack has (had?) a Jack & Danny 2200A active fretless 5-string and seemed to be quite pleased with that. It costs just €200 or so, which if it had solid stable tuning and good tone would be an option.

But like I say, the RBX is a pretty decent bass to begin with, so I reckon a well executed de-fret would possibly (probably?) result in a better fretless bass than either the VMJ, Rockbass Streamer or J&D 2200A, or any similarly-priced equivalent. Obviously I could be wrong. I do like these kind of projects, so there'd also be the personal satisfaction of pulling it off after some research & effort.

I do want a 5-string fretless. I don't want to have to tax my brain by having to adjust between a 4 and a 5. And I'd also like it to have a 2-octave fingerboard, again to reduce the brain-adjustment factor (my fretted basses have 24-frets). By all means, flame for that if ye want (hell, I might even deserve it), but it is a 5 that I want.


Thanks,

Mark

[BOD2]

Where's the pictures Phaedrus, mate ! I'm so disappointed

I would say go for the de-fret option on the RBX. You've got nothing to lose really on that one. If it all goes horribly wrong you could always replace the neck back to a fretted job. Also, it sounds as if you like a "project" and this would be quite a good one.

"Veneer" is a just a term for a thin strip of wood. It's not the same as the stuff for kitchens as that is not solid wood. I'm sure you'd be able to get veneers locally somewhere (a cabinet maker - an undertaker even ? ) or on the net otherwise.

On the defretting side, one tip I've heard is that you can sometime use heat applied to the fret (with a soldering iron) to help loosen them. I think this mainly applies iof the frets have been glued in - it loosens the glue - but the heat would cause movement of the fret through expansion anyway and that might also loosen it in its slot.

Good luck !

[Phaedrus]

I'm thinking the Squire Vintage Modified Jazz might be the best option. I just don't have the time to de-fret a bass.

The Squire seems to get good reviews and I guess a low B might prove to be superfluous on a fretless (?), so a 4-string would probably suffice.

What do you guys think?

Anyone on here got a Squire Vintage Modified Jazz fretless?

MB1 mentioned the Rockbass Streamer fretless - what other options (apart from the VMJ & the Streamer)would be worth looking at for under €300-ish? I can browse all the websites - it'd be nice to hear opinions from folk who've actually used these basses.


Thanks,

Mark

[niceguyhomer]

[quote name='Phaedrus' post='187938' date='Apr 29 2008, 11:46 AM']I'm thinking the Squire Vintage Modified Jazz might be the best option. I just don't have the time to de-fret a bass.

The Squire seems to get good reviews and I guess a low B might prove to be superfluous on a fretless (?), so a 4-string would probably suffice.

What do you guys think?

Anyone on here got a Squire Vintage Modified Jazz fretless?[/quote]


Mark, there's one for sale on here now for £150 but I think it's collection only from London.

[BigRedX]

I used to have a Squier VMJ Fretless.

Excellent - in fact when I bought it in January of last year it was the best fretless I'd played that cost under £1000. Since then I'd add the Ibanez GW35 to that list. The only reason I still don't have it is because I've since bought 2 better (but much more expensive) fretless basses and therefore it wasn't really getting played any more.

Whether you go for the Squier or the Rockbass will depend on whether Fender or Warwick basses are most comfortable. Personally I've never got on with Warwicks and apart from the £4K Jack Bruce Cream Reunion model I've found the fretless Warwick particularly nasty to play.