Why so long to set up?

[Mykesbass]

Slightly OT but it is amazing how much difference individuals can make to the set up and break down. I was working as manager/tour manager for a fairly well. known Texan blues guitarist/singer and we had the breakdown down to a fine art on the first tour - 15 minutes and we were all down at the merch stall selling CD's.
Next tour, different drummer who liked to "wind down" straight after the gig, all of a sudden we were up to 11/2 hours. Had a chat and agreed the wind down would be after all the gear was in the van and evrything wernt smoothly from there on. Talk to the guys, tell them it is part of the job and don't let it happen again!

[scalpy]

My old band once supported a band at Hammersmith Uni I think it was when the drummer took an hour to soundcheck the kick drum. We were going crazy after 5 minutes! In my experience once the gear is set up the best guys are soundchecked and happy by the end of the first chorus of the one tune they try. 3 hours for your rig is too long as I'm sure you'll be pointing out to the band. I used to set up an 18 piece soul band in that time, by myself!

[nottswarwick]

[quote name='Merton' post='1345728' date='Aug 19 2011, 06:41 PM']Thing is we all know certain parts of the set up so just get in with our bit whilst mercilessly ripping the piss out if each other [/quote]

Defo we do that too

[Mr Fudge]

We do sound and lights and unless its a few flights of stairs or half a mile trek to the stage we can do

Full 2K PA
1 bass and rig.
2 guitar and rigs.
3 keyboard.
4 vocal mikes.
1 electronic drum kit.
x2 powered monitors
lights.
selection of assorted plastic birds.
Full band soundcheck.

Usually about an hour. We all multi-task. My bass rig and sounsheck takes about 5 mins max.


Packing away is another story though ....

Edited August 19, 2011 by Mr Fudge

[Tlbasss]

[quote name='Bilbo' post='1345436' date='Aug 19 2011, 01:47 PM']I pride myself on my shut downs. Quickest from last note to fully loaded car is 4 minutes (the stage/my set up was in front of some French doors and my car was right outside). Set up i snormalyy 15 minutes max (no rigs or lights )[/quote]

Brilliant! i take longer because I chat too much!

[gapiro]

[quote name='Dave Vader' post='1345495' date='Aug 19 2011, 02:43 PM']4HOURS!?!?!?!? In the Pig?!?!?!
Are you bringing the gear in one lead at a time, on foot, from bideford?
I still think turning up 2 and a half hours early to allow time for our 45 minute set up and soundcheck to go horribly wrong is too much. But it makes us more relaxed when everything does go wrong as *I* have time to fix it.

Yes vocal PA and backline will do, maybe stick the bass drum in the PA as well, that should do it for most pub gigs round here. (and don't let my drummer and guitar player tell you otherwise, their channels are often muted, and only plugged in to make them feel better)[/quote]
Actually I make our guitarists turn their amps right down and prefer it out of the PA. It makes them stay in their area of the stage, and I give em a smack with a headstock if i see them attempt to go near it after we have soundchecked. It also makes our sound far more balanced out front ime

[gjones]

I've played in bands for years including my fair share of weddings. All we ever used was a decent 600 watt PA with a desk for vocals and keyboards and everyone else just used backline which sounded fine. I went to a friends retirement party the other month and the band had brought so much gear I think they thought they were playing wembley not a retirement do in a British Legion Hall. It took them 4 hours to set up everything and although the sound was very good it was definitely overkill.
My impression was that because the band was pretty successful on the wedding/function circuit and they'd invested so much money in their gear that they felt they had to use it at every gig but in reality a smaller setup would have made much more sense.

[funkypenguin]

My band has a similar setup (minus the bass bins) and we can get the drum kit, backline and PA set up, cables run and soundchecked in an hour....your guys need to up their game, especially if your client is being kept waiting to cut the cake...

[burgundymouse]

[quote]had another fag and two pints of London Pride [/s]finished dismantling his kit and put it all away.[/quote]

I think I was married to this drummer once!

[Ian Savage]

[quote name='Happy Jack' post='1345550' date='Aug 19 2011, 03:23 PM']Do NOT allow the drummer to set up first. Do the backdrop (if any), the lights (if any), and above all the PA first.[/quote]

That said, you DO need to know how much space the drums take up so that you don't end up having to shift things a foot this way and six inches that way in order to fit the drums in after the PA/lights. Many drummers will have themselves a rug/carpet/whatever which'll mark out 'their space' (and the really organised/anal ones, like me, will have where their stands go marked out on said carpet to allow them to set up quicker). If your drummer doesn't have one, it's well worth suggesting.

EDIT: Oh yeah, three hours is ridiculous. Last band I was in I'd get my carpet and stool down (drums), rig the monitors while the singer was doing the FOH and the guitarists were setting up, then I'd set up while one of the guitarists was doing the lights and the singer, rhythm guitarist & bass player were mic checking. Half an hour including load-in if pushed, an hour absolute tops if we were having a natter and a drink.

Edited August 20, 2011 by Ian Savage

[icastle]

Of course, if the band aren't capable of setting up in less thatn 3 hours you need to do the maths the other way round and make sure you're setting up three hours before you're due to play...

When we play functions we setup during the afternoon so that we just get on the stage when we arrive back there and play - we never faff about wiring stuff up and soundchecking in front of the audience.

[paul_5]

3 hours is pushing it a bit, certainly if your clients are kept waiting. I've drummed for gigs when I've had literally 20 mins to unload, set up and count everyone in (early Sat Nav mishap), whoever's causing the delay needs a bit of a friendly prod. Generally it's the guitarist who fiddles about with FX settings. Kindly inform them that that's what the EQ on the amp is for - use that to 'tune' the rig to the room.

[RockfordStone]

I can personnly set up my rig in less than ten mins, most venues i play half hour is a luxury, normally we are expected to do it in 15 mins or less. 3 hours seems excessive to me

[ficelles]

Get an engineer. I've set up a 5k rig with 4 foldback mixes and most of the channels on a 24-channel desk used in less time on my own.

ficelles

[mrtcat]

Just get a routine. If travelling separately I give everyone a staggered arrival time.

I always get there 20 mins before the drummer (if he travels with me he's under strict instruction that he helps me first before setting his kit up - the drums can get in everyone's way and slow the whole process to a crawl). In that time I set up backdrop, mixer / outboards / amps, run all cables from pa hub to where tops and subs will sit but leave all the cabs in the van. Then the drummer arrives and sets up (at the same time I sneak my bass amp in and do lights). Then guitarist and singer arrive. While they set themselves up I mic the kit (drummer still tinkering throughout). Once singer has plugged all mics into mixer he and guitarist haul in the cabs from the van while I put the top stands up and voila! We're ready to sound check in under an hour from my arrival.

Same process applies whether we play pubs, clubs, corporate or wedding. First impressions and all that.

[paulbass]

I guess every band is different but that does seem an awful long time...the band i'm in takes about 45 mins to set up and do a sound check.I think if you take longer than a drummer to set up theres a problem.Drummers have more to carry and set up than anyone else.It must be a very long day for you guys if you consider it takes 3 hours to set up then theres your set and then you got to pack it all away.If you all go through a PA i would recommend an engineer and trust his ability...nothing worse than having 4/5 musicians all putting their oar in during the sound check...you would have a nightmare if you were ever in a studio and everyone doing the mix.

[TimR]

How many gigs have you done and how often do you gig?

There's always a learning curve.

Moving PA speakers shouldn't happen, you should put them up and they should stay where you put them.

Drummer in first at the back with bass amp and guitar amp either side and position PA speakers and monitors. Drummer, bass player and guitarist set up gear (silently) then [b]one[/b] person does mics, mic stands, and PA wire up. Start at speakers and work back to mics. If two people do this something simple will get overlooked and you'll take ages debuging the install, or someone will twiddle the wrong fader and deafen the band with feedback when someone plugs in a mic. Quick sound check to make sure all PA works and set rough levels. Then everyone puts cases out in cars and lights are put up. Should take about 45mins if the cars are close to venue and access is easy.

IEMs are probably overkill unless you have a dedicated sub mixer that you can operate yourself but that introduces a lot more wiring problems and time.

I've played at small gigs where the amount of gear has frightened me. At the first gig I played with my latest band I arrived a bit late. The guys had already set up all the gear on stage; mixer and 2 PA amps, 7 guitar rack, plus some other stuff. Leaving us with so much unneccasary gear on stage that there was no room for us. I got them to move it all into he wings and said "People have come to see us play, not to see how much gear we have." - you can guess the guitarist's reply to that!

[Pete Academy]

Way too long.

[tauzero]

All my bands do setup within an hour. Two are vocal PA and backline, but for the ceilidh band, everything goes through the PA (four instruments, one vocal mic, one mic for miscellaneous use). I do PA and my rig. Everyone else sorts themselves out.

[BenTunnicliffe]

I reckon that's quite a while to be setting up and I've only had issues getting everyone's everything together in under an hour when there's been divas wanting stuff moved but then not helping to rearrange second only to people being late which really gets to me when I'm dealing with watch-owning adults.

I like to get there with more time than it takes to set up and soundcheck and then have a nice amount of time with everything just sitting there 'cause I find it looks messy when the audience arrive and you're running around not in gig gear uncoiling leads and then losing the impact of one tune because you've ran a verse and chorus in soundcheck. Not always possible but that's what I like so I can chill out for a bit before jumping into it.

Had any improvements?

B

[mike257]

Three hours is nuts - typical gigs for originals bands you get 15 minutes to changeover from the band before you, or half an hour on bigger support shows. I know that doesn't include any PA/Soundcheck/Lights, but each of you should be able to have your backline up individually in 15 mins no problem! I think you guys should look at what you're doing, and see which bit takes the longest and where it's going wrong.

The suggestion about a marked-up drum carpet is great if your drummer is settled in his set-up. In my last band, I could put the drummers kit up/down faster than he could, so I always helped him do that before I got on with my own gear - it's worth getting your head round how his stuff goes together if he's taking the longest to set up. Even just marking up his stands with which cymbal they are for and taping the positions on for the height adjustment etc means any of you can throw them up pretty quick and he can fine tune while you do your own stuff.

[Sibob]

Our setup is (venue dependant):
Full PA, 2x bins, 2x tops etc, fully mic'd kit, 4 vocals, guitar backline mic'd, bass backline DI'd, lights etc.

Normally takes us about an hour chilled setup, but we've done it as fast as 40mins when pushed, thats loading from the van to ready-to-play. Everyone knows their job and what needs doing. We do a lot of gigs, so we're simply well practised. We never soundcheck either, we just know our sound, our gear and what is needed.
Quickest setup we've done was a rushed stripped down setup, no bins/drum mics/DI's etc, and that was 20mins from arriving in van to playing first song lol

Si

[TimR]

It's definitely an experience/practice thing. The more you do it the better you get.

You'll also get an element of "just wanting to be out of the house" from some members. In my last band the drummer was having issues with his wife. Whenever he organised a gig we had to be at the venue ridiculously early. This in turn led to problems with the sax player and vocalist who couldn't understand why they had to be at a venue 2 hours before soundcheck.

Fair enough drummer and PA should be early but everyone else should take about 15mins max.

[algmusic]

[quote name='TimR' post='1347945' date='Aug 22 2011, 12:59 PM']It's definitely an experience/practice thing. The more you do it the better you get.

You'll also get an element of "just wanting to be out of the house" from some members. In my last band the drummer was having issues with his wife. Whenever he organised a gig we had to be at the venue ridiculously early. This in turn led to problems with the sax player and vocalist who couldn't understand why they had to be at a venue 2 hours before soundcheck.

Fair enough drummer and PA should be early but everyone else should take about 15mins max.[/quote]

this annoys me.. I hate unnecessary 'meet' times. If it's not my gig, a huge gig or someone I don't know well, I'll get there when I'm told, but if it's my gig or a shared project, I stamp out that nonsense. We all have busy lives and simply waiting for hours is stupid.

[mikeydee]

My function band is comprised as follows

two vocal mics
two brass mics
guitar with mic if needed
keys and bass DI
We have a 1k PA, FOH and monitor mix onstage and lots of lights.

We can do setup in an 60 - 90 mins. It's always easier when you are familiar with the venue I find . . .