Secondary instruments

[nobodysprefect]

I've been learning a little guitar lately (and boy, has it REALLY taken the shine off of guitarists...) and I used to play piano as a kid.

So: which instruments do you play in addition to bass (or is bass your secondary instrument) and how has it shaped your conceptualization of music and or bass technique and roles in music? Is there a secondary instrument that'd be really useful for a bassist (piano, methinks) - either in that it's easier to write music on or that it's easier to much around theory bits or perhaps it's a good addition to your live performance?

I'm having hard time thinking up an instrument that'd be helpful to learn if you wanted to use it to enchance a performance where you also had the bass gig. Much easier to do on, say, keys and another instrument. We just don't get to say:'Well, I'll play bass on intro and verse then switch to didgeridoo for choruses.'

Perhaps a tapping specialty instrument?

For learning theory and writing music I'm having hard time thinking of anything better than piano.

One occasion where I did instrument switching mid-song succesfully was swapping to electric upright for the bridge on a number we used to do.

[Happy Jack]

Piano - and I still routinely visualise the keyboard when working out certain relationships.

[dudewheresmybass]

i play Guitar as a secondary instrument - as i teach both as well as being a playing pro, and also regularly attack Banjo, ukelele, as gigs demand!.
I have a reasonable ability with keyboard instruments, cello (to Grade 7- as a child), and i also used to play bagpipes!
I still get the yearning to have a bash at mandolin though!

Edited March 17, 2008 by dudewheresmybass

[Deep Thought]

Bit of guitar, bit of harmonica.

[Hit&Run]

Guitar, but not very often. I keep meaning to change that.

[Alun]

Bit of guitar,ukulele and hand percussion, smaller bit of piano, even smaller bit of drums and penny whistle. I almost think of upright and fretless as secondary instruments too as I mainly play fretted.

Piano is commonly recognised as the most useful second instrument due to the way the notes are visually laid out. However, a good bit of notation software will teach you as much IMO. Not as much use on a gig though

Cheers
Alun

[BigRedX]

I spent most of the 80s playing synth. I joined the band as a bassist, but they wanted someone who could slap which I couldn't but I liked the music and got one well with the other members so switched to synth full-time (in the ended we never bothered getting bass player in)

I played guitar in the final incarnation of my last band once again having joined as a bass player. After two years the drummer left and the guitarist decided to call it a day too because he didn't think we'd find a good enough replacement. It turned out we got an even better drummer with a month of advertising but after nearly a year of auditioning guitarists none of whom were suitable I'd taught myself all the guitar parts so we looked for a new bass payer instead (and of course found one straight away!)

[gypsymoth]

guitar & drums, because I needed to. could keys be next?

[Bassassin]

I'm another bedroom g*it*rist - I'd say 90% of my writing is done on guitar. I have written on bass, but I often struggle to compose other instrumental parts to go with basslines - whereas the other way around, I can come up with what I like to think are creative & complementary lines.

I went through a phase in the early 90s when I wasn't gigging at all, just writing & recording - probably about 5 years, thinking about it - and I was pretty much exclusively playing guitar at that point, only picking up the bass when I needed to record it.

It's somewhat different these days though - my writing's been going through a somewhat fallow patch for the last 18 months or so, and I'm rusty as feck when I pick up a guitar now!

I messed around with keyboards a bit in the 80s but never really developed any proficiency to speak of.

Jon.

Edited March 16, 2008 by Bassassin

[Machines]

I have a guitar too, same one I bought 6 when I first started learning 6 years ago. Went through a phase of buying guitars but they all sound the same .

[WalMan]

Bit of guitar & keyboards

As a child I had piano & trumpet lessons then taught myself guitar before moving to bass

[dub_junkie]

guitar a very close second for me..gotten more work as a guitarist than bassist the last few years but bass still my first choice

[s_u_y_*]

Started off as a piano player... but found more and more people were in need of a bass player, so I made the jump. I really only get to play piano during Christmas time because I know this woman who likes to put on Christmas shows for her church.

[Breakfast]

Guitar, Mandolin and Drums. I love playing drums very much indeed and of all the instruments I play it's probably the one I am most "natural" at playing, however I haven't owned a kit the last few years and rarely had as much chance to practice compared to the other things I play so I'm pretty bad at it.

Currently having a bit of hankering to play again so I may see about renting some in a rehearsal room and getting a couple of my friends along for some stupid jamming fun.

[OutToPlayJazz]

I'm a professional double bass player & cellist as well as pro electric bassist.

I suppose my second instrument(s) are piano, violin, viola, classical guitar & I've been seriously working on my electric guitar for the last year or so, if only for teaching purposes. (No delusions of becoming a great guitarist!)

I really admire anyone who can play wind/brass instruments. Tried both trumpet & flute in the last couple of years and failed miserably!

I am however, very inspired by Bela Fleck to get a 5-string banjo & learn that... Hmmmm...

Edited March 16, 2008 by OutToPlayJazz

[Mikey D]

1. Electric Bass
2. Double Bass
3. Piano
4. Drums

I had to take up double bass as part of my course and have actually beena self taught pianist for quite a few years. Piano has very helped my understanding of harmony and great for ear training and I use it for composition.

Drums has helped my time and how to interact with a drummer, and how to explain what I want when playing with a new drummer.

I also play a very little bit of guitar, but since i sold my 8 string guitar a few months ago I haven't touched one.

[barneythedog]

Saxophone - started on Clarinet at the tender age of 8, progressing to sax at about 13.

Guitar - always loved playing, having never been without one for the last 30 years. Strictly rhythm tho, I don't want to make it cry or sing ... :brow:

Keys - had piano lessons for a couple of years, and played synth for a band in the late 80's. Undoubtedly THE best instrument to help improve your overall musical understanding.

[Jase]

Pah! all you talented people make me sick

I'd really love to be able to play drums or maybe piano, singing would be great too.
I really admire players who can play, study or adapt to more than one instrument.

[nobodysprefect]

Nice to see so many peeps sharing their dark secrets, eh? =) I'd have to add the bit about improving communication between players of different instruments to the list. It's pretty hard to say what you'd like someone to try by referrring to such and such record, 'only play it with a bit more of a latin feel.'

Guitar's pretty well represented, and with reason - it's one of the easier and readily available instruments, I'd wager. Heckuva lot easier to adequately *accompany* a bit of singing with the guitar than with the piano - definitely harder still with the bass or the wind instruments. (there's an artist I regularly back who might at the drop of a hat decide he wants me to do the chordal accompanying on the bass. fun times! It's my own fault for letting on I could play chords on the thing. Stupid noodling on the breaks dammit!)


[quote name='OutToPlayJazz' post='158614' date='Mar 16 2008, 11:37 PM']I really admire anyone who can play wind/brass instruments. Tried both trumpet & flute in the last couple of years and failed miserably![/quote]

This. I've played with classical wind players who could actually play in tune* while burning on the horn (did that sound dirty? It did to me, a little) and it was humbling. Some of those guys have the best ears! All I could muster when I gave the trumpet a try was a few sorry bleats and very, very, sore lips!

*also, I've heard there are guitarists who can make their bends in tune! Whoa! That's some heavy duty badness there! Not to mention the rarer than rare vocalist who doesn't go flat all the time. Often spoken of, rarely sighted. Almost never heard.

Of course, we get a lot ton of leeway in our intonation given the paucity of upper harmonics in our tone. (with the more traditional swing or bop tone) Then again, this is a double-edged sword, as hearing your own in-or-out-of-tuneness can be a pain if the band is playing too loud. Very annoying. (In-ears for the win?)

[Jamesemt]

Yeah taking it a stage further, I've been in band situations (playing bass) where I'm a better guitarist than the two guitarists...very frustrating. Why are so many guitarists reluctant to let rip with solos these days? I never had a problem with that

Thankfully now in a band situation where I am the weakest link (although they don't realise, cos I practice the stuff so much at home )

[nobodysprefect]

[quote name='Jase' post='158723' date='Mar 17 2008, 02:30 AM']Pah! all you talented people make me sick

I'd really love to be able to play drums or maybe piano, singing would be great too.
I really admire players who can play, study or adapt to more than one instrument. [/quote]

I think it's more a question of time to invest in learning another skill. A bit of economics, if I may commandeer the bandwidth:

Let us assume (note that economics is pretty much equivalent to trying to reach a point abstracted to uselessness via climbing imaginary ladders) that a person's musical skills can be represented as the function of time spent on practising (a scary assumption, that. I gotta PRACTICE to get better? Man, what a drag) and the function can be approximated to something like f(x) == your musical skills, f'(x) == xa^c/x where a == an individual's inherent talent, c == constant and x == time practiced. Note f'(x) is then the advancement you see for a given chunk of practice. (your marginal benefit) Now it is trivial to note the diminishing returns and that at some point where x >> c (say, if c == 1 x == 1000) the marginal improvement is hardly noticeable.

In real world you'd need to account for things like
1) it's really sticking to practicing that counts, you can't make a single huge time investment and get to super skills
2) your skills detoriorate with inuse
3) the approximation is way off

but the take-home lesson we can extract is this: as you need to sleep and eat (perhaps also work) you can't get infinitely good. Steve Vai used to practice for 12 hours a day at one time! Many individuals find that as the years go by and their dissatisfaction at their lack of skill diminishes in relation to their hours available for practice and desire to learn another instrument that it's rational to start learning another instrument. Keeps you fresh, to boot!

[wulf]

Besides bass, I've dabbled in a number of other instruments. I'm a passable guitarist and have also played a bit of mandolin. In fact, anything in that whole group of instruments is approachable (I'm sure there is a technical term for guitary instruments). I've also played a bit of double bass.

I'm far less competent on drums and keys; I can play bits and pieces but haven't reached any particular level of skill.

More recently, I have tried learning a bit of flute. My wife plays and I want to understand it better so, when I try to help her with the theory side, I can express concepts in suitable ways rather than always thinking in fretboard terms.

I think it is definitely worth learning at least a bit about other instruments, including those outside the group that includes bass guitar, in order to broaden your musical horizons.

Wulf

[jakenewmanbass]

Double bass, bass guitar equal first instrument
Voice, guitar, piano, drums, percussion, all to a reasonable level but I would only really record my BVs, percussion playing or kit looped in pro tools.
If you go to my MySpace on the link in my sig. On the first track on the player I play double bass, cahon, shaker, tambourine, and claps. And I helped arrange the BVs, and partly produced the track. It was recorded at Sleeper Studions in Hampstead which is owned by Guy Chambers.
Oh and the desk we used was used for Dark side of the Moon.

[Jase]

[quote name='nobody's prefect' post='158752' date='Mar 17 2008, 07:37 AM']I think it's more a question of time to invest in learning another skill. A bit of economics, if I may commandeer the bandwidth:

Let us assume (note that economics is pretty much equivalent to trying to reach a point abstracted to uselessness via climbing imaginary ladders) that a person's musical skills can be represented as the function of time spent on practising (a scary assumption, that. I gotta PRACTICE to get better? Man, what a drag) and the function can be approximated to something like f(x) == your musical skills, f'(x) == xa^c/x where a == an individual's inherent talent, c == constant and x == time practiced. Note f'(x) is then the advancement you see for a given chunk of practice. (your marginal benefit) Now it is trivial to note the diminishing returns and that at some point where x >> c (say, if c == 1 x == 1000) the marginal improvement is hardly noticeable.

In real world you'd need to account for things like
1) it's really sticking to practicing that counts, you can't make a single huge time investment and get to super skills
2) your skills detoriorate with inuse
3) the approximation is way off

but the take-home lesson we can extract is this: as you need to sleep and eat (perhaps also work) you can't get infinitely good. Steve Vai used to practice for 12 hours a day at one time! Many individuals find that as the years go by and their dissatisfaction at their lack of skill diminishes in relation to their hours available for practice and desire to learn another instrument that it's rational to start learning another instrument. Keeps you fresh, to boot![/quote]


Ohhh, don't mind me mate, I was just tipping my hat to players who can make their "secondary" instruments sound good

[Jase]

[quote name='jakesbass' post='158813' date='Mar 17 2008, 10:18 AM']Double bass, bass guitar equal first instrument
Voice, guitar, piano, drums, percussion, all to a reasonable level but I would only really record my BVs, percussion playing or kit looped in pro tools.
If you go to my MySpace on the link in my sig. On the first track on the player I play double bass, cahon, shaker, tambourine, and claps. And I helped arrange the BVs, and partly produced the track. It was recorded at Sleeper Studions in Hampstead which is owned by Guy Chambers.
Oh and the desk we used was used for Dark side of the Moon.[/quote]

Sounds really good jake, your a bit like a guitar player I work with, on our myspace he wrote and recorded the vocals, backing vocals, guitar elec and acoustic and piano.