Learning the intervals of chords

[daz]

I have made a small pocket booklet by folding a piece of A4 four times. On this i write down the scales, so i can whip it out and learn it whever i have a spare five. [b]Doddy [/b]made me realise it is important to know the scales and chord tones properly, in as much as with learning shapes if I am not concentrating I might name of the minor third of G minor is A# instead of Bb, etc.

[JTUK]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1316263596' post='1376397']
Nah I know all that stuff, it's the actual names of the notes I don't know, which means when I'm busking a tune I don't know I have to be very conservative about what I play because I can't be trusted to find a given interval for a given chord without first thinking of where the root note is and spotting the interval in relation to that.
[/quote]

??? so you know the the scale you are using but not the root note ..???

If someone says play a G, you must know the notes within that chord that will work, so that is why if you know the scale shape, even if you don't or can't work out the individual notes quickly, you are still on safe ground.

Am I missing something..??

From my POV, players should know..as building blocks... the notes right across the fretboard, but sometimes...and this applies to gtrs a lot, they know shapes a lot better than scales.
Once you know your basic scales, you know'll what constitutes a diminished or augmented or 9th or 13 etc etc ... because the scale will walk you right through them.

[JTUK]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1316118802' post='1374894']

I'm alright finding the root of a chord anywhere on the neck, although I could get better, but my main problem is I don't know what the intervals in each chord are. As in, I don't know that Eb is the 3rd in Bmaj. Or if I do, I can't think of it very quickly.

[/quote]

In that case, you know that ANY major third is two tones or 4 frets on the neck from root.....
A 6th is a tone and half down from octave...for example.

and if you know that, and you are busking, you don't have to think about what the note is called...
Keep the shape and you keep in tune.

If people can't keep this shape as they can't use 4 fingers all the time, this falls apart a tad, but you should be using 4 fingers as a matter of course.

[fatback]

Totally agree with the all over the fingerboard and including inversions point. Really hard work but well worth it, even if like me you end up spending a month on one key .

[thisnameistaken]

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1316370892' post='1377091']
If someone says play a G, you must know the notes within that chord that will work, so that is why if you know the scale shape, even if you don't or can't work out the individual notes quickly, you are still on safe ground.

Am I missing something..??[/quote]

It's more about knowing what I'm doing. I would feel a lot more confident and I'm fairly sure I would play more fluently and with less mistakes if I didn't rely on what little knowledge I have right now. It would also make it easier to communicate ideas with other musicians especially non-guitarists, and it would make songwriting easier too, and also working out harmony parts and stuff. Generally I think it would be beneficial to everything I do.

[quote name='JTUK' timestamp='1316371515' post='1377107']If people can't keep this shape as they can't use 4 fingers all the time, this falls apart a tad, but you should be using 4 fingers as a matter of course.
[/quote]

I think fingering is something that is best decided by the instrumentalist according to their own physical ability. You are also assuming I am talking about bass guitar. I play double bass too, and all the accepted wisdom states that I [i]shouldn't[/i] be using 4 fingers as a matter of course.

[daz]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1316377584' post='1377281']

It's more about knowing what I'm doing. I would feel a lot more confident and I'm fairly sure I would play more fluently and with less mistakes if I didn't rely on what little knowledge I have right now. It would also make it easier to communicate ideas with other musicians especially non-guitarists, and it would make songwriting easier too, and also working out harmony parts and stuff. Generally I think it would be beneficial to everything I do.



I think fingering is something that is best decided by the instrumentalist according to their own physical ability. You are also assuming I am talking about bass guitar. I play double bass too, and all the accepted wisdom states that I [i]shouldn't[/i] be using 4 fingers as a matter of course.
[/quote]

well said that man.

[ZMech]

Had a massive slap in the face that made me realise i seriously need to do this. Have been doing a good amount of scales practice on the double bass, and have done quite a lot of major scales along one string. However, as soon as I switched to minor, I had to suddenly stop and think about what I need to play. I know the intervals are 2 1 2 2 1 2 2, but that didn't really help. So now I'm starting to do it saying each note out loud first lets see if it helps

[jakenewmanbass]

I advocate learning this [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/76477-major-harmony-arpeggio-and-scale-exercise/"]http://basschat.co.uk/topic/76477-major-harmony-arpeggio-and-scale-exercise/[/url] exercise in twelve keys, in both directions backwards upside down etc etc
I posted it some time ago... if the link doesn't get you the exercise let me know and I'll send it to you.
I give it to all my students and tell them to spend their whole lives working on it

[thisnameistaken]

Cheers Jake - is that attachment a pdf file? It's got an odd extension that I can't open.

[jakenewmanbass]

Hi Kev, yep should be a pdf but looks a bit odd doesn't it...!
hopefully this is it...

[attachment=89739:Arpeggio and diatonic exce.pdf]

hmmm! that doesn't seem to work either, that was a fresh upload.... MODS! HELP!

Edited September 19, 2011 by jakesbass

[lowdown]

[quote name='jakesbass' timestamp='1316423078' post='1377714']
Hi Kev, yep should be a pdf but looks a bit odd doesn't it...!
hopefully this is it...

[attachment=89739:Arpeggio and diatonic exce.pdf]

hmmm! that doesn't seem to work either, that was a fresh upload.... MODS! HELP!
[/quote]
It works for me, right click and 'open in new tab'
Left click and it will open, but not in a new tab.
Right click and 'save target as' works of course.



Garry

[thisnameistaken]

Weird. If I rename Jake's file as .pdf it's fine, wonder why the extension is being substituted? Perhaps a 'Site Issue'

Anyway thanks Jake I've got the document, I'll give it some attention tonight.

Edited September 19, 2011 by thisnameistaken

[jimbobothy]

I've recently got the bassline publishing book 'The Bass players guide to Scale and Modes', does a lot of stuff already mentioned focusing on knowing what you're playing rather than mechanical repetition , which is nice.

[xilddx]

[quote name='thisnameistaken' timestamp='1316426392' post='1377772']
Weird. If I rename Jake's file as .pdf it's fine, wonder why the extension is being substituted? Perhaps a 'Site Issue'

Anyway thanks Jake I've got the document, I'll give it some attention tonight.
[/quote]
It's very good. I can actually sing it faster than I can play it mind! But that is very important to me.