Rumble Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 I recently swapped a MB LM II for an Ashdown ABM 500 running through my Epi 410UL to try and get a little tubey goodness into my sound. Unfortunately, the tubey goodness seems to have introduced a bit of boom with it. The church I'm playing in is a typical high-ceiling-solid-walls affair, so I don't know whether than has anything to do with it? I can dial out the boom by trimming back the bass, but that seems to negate the point of getting the ABM in the first place. Am I expecting too much given the acoutics of the room? The other possibility is that I've read the Epi 410UL described as being a bit boomy in the low end. Would I be better with a 2x12 to give the low end whilst also offering a few more mids?? Opinions and experience welcomed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 I can't advise on the cab, but have you tried just dropping either the 180hz or 340hz slider to see if that helps? The other thing that might help is a Gramma Pad (if your cab is on a stage/wooden floor). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 Have to say this seems an odd match to me.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 4, 2011 Author Share Posted October 4, 2011 I think I know where you're coming from, but to avoid assumptions, why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted October 4, 2011 Share Posted October 4, 2011 [quote name='Rumble' timestamp='1317751109' post='1394176'] I think I know where you're coming from, but to avoid assumptions, why? [/quote] If you're asking me about the Gramma Pad, then it's because it reduces the vibrations that can be enhanced by hollow stages/wooden floors. if you're asking JTUK, then I haven't a scooby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 4, 2011 Author Share Posted October 4, 2011 Sorry, xgsjx, I was actually referring to JTUK's post. Having done a bit of research it looks like the Epi cabs perform optimally with High wattage power amps combined with a pre, so that might be a way to go?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 In terms of quality, the Epifani trumps the Ashdown, IMO. All the Ashdown heads I have used are a bit basic and one dimensional which is fine if they produce the sounds you want/like. If you have to start to Eq them, then you get into trouble which is a bit like the Ampeg model. ..good sound but it had better be the one you want and can work with. I think Epifani cabs work better with a more willing adaptable amp..possibly with a semi para 4 band EQ..so something like an SWR SM, Eden, Thunderfunk, maybe..!! But then again, my personal taste would start there with any cab. I like para's As for the match, I think you need to back either the Ashdown sound bias and match the amp to another Ashdown type cab...or back the Epi model and go a bit more modern Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgsjx Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 Semi para 4 band? LMII maybe? Wait a min, didn't the ABM replace that? If you're after a valve sound why not get a clean amp (like the LMII or whatever else) & add a pedal such as the DHA VT1 or a Sansamp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 5, 2011 Author Share Posted October 5, 2011 Do you guys think that the power + pre-amp thing isn't necessarily required to get the best out of the cab? The alternative is to go with something SWR, Eden maybe EBS with plenty of ooomph?? JTUK - I know what you're saying about the option of matching the Ashdown head with an Ashdown Cab, but I agree that it looks like a slightly backward step. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 [quote name='Rumble' timestamp='1317817276' post='1394862'] Do you guys think that the power + pre-amp thing isn't necessarily required to get the best out of the cab? The alternative is to go with something SWR, Eden maybe EBS with plenty of ooomph?? JTUK - I know what you're saying about the option of matching the Ashdown head with an Ashdown Cab, but I agree that it looks like a slightly backward step. [/quote] The advantage of the 4 band semi para EQ is that you can notch a specific frequency and boost or cut it...within the freq steps of the amp of course. This gives it a lot of control IMV. The old SM series SWR were very good at this and consequently a very powerful tone shaping amp. It had a valve pre as well. The minus side was that this took a lot of getting use to. Eden did the same sort of thing...4 band, with valve pre and had a different voicing. I have way more time of a SWR model so I preferred this amp but would have been quite happy to have gone the Eden rioute. The newer Thunderfunk models have valve simulation and 4 band but it is really hard to get a poor sound out of one, IME... so therefore very plug'n'play and a MAJOR plus over the SWR, IMO. I still like to use the SWR but have less tendency to put up with it not working as well, so quickly. Still a great amp though, for all that and when it is on..it is ON, IMO. As these are my currents amps (SWR and TF) I haven't looked at the EBS model in the FS....but I would be interested to hear that and the Epi... One final thing..which I really believe...is a decent set of new-ish strings is the first step into cleaning up your sound from boom.. as clunky old strings are notorious for it....IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 5, 2011 Author Share Posted October 5, 2011 JTUK, thanks for your comments and suggestions. The strings on the bass are pretty new so they shouldn't be an issue. I'm also a bit like you in that I prefer the plug and play type of amp, but I guess I could get used to the semi-para EQ. Will probably keep my eye out on the for sale thread in case anything comes up. OOI, what's your opinion on the power+pre option?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatbass787 Posted October 5, 2011 Share Posted October 5, 2011 Seen Pino use an ABM head with Epi 410 lots of times so compatability shouldn't be an issue, just tame the low end a tad by backing off gently on the bass end of the eq till you get the sweet spot for the room Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTUK Posted October 6, 2011 Share Posted October 6, 2011 [quote name='Rumble' timestamp='1317845763' post='1395432'] JTUK, thanks for your comments and suggestions. The strings on the bass are pretty new so they shouldn't be an issue. I'm also a bit like you in that I prefer the plug and play type of amp, but I guess I could get used to the semi-para EQ. Will probably keep my eye out on the for sale thread in case anything comes up. OOI, what's your opinion on the power+pre option?? [/quote] Not sure what is to be gained apart from power ..... Personally, I don't like to run higher powered amps over the rated cab output as you can't tell how loud is, say 7 on the dial..or flat out on the power amp and the gain trimmed on the pre... Therefore, you are more dependant on hearing your cab being overdriven... which in bad acoustics or with FX.s could be a potential minefield. Having said that, if you are running a big stage rig then this would be the better way, IMV... I would be checklng out Aguilar, Demeter, Alembic. as those come with valve stages, IIRC... I have heard good things about Mike Pope...but never got near one. Expensive way to go about it maybe...but the louder you go, gets more cost effective, potentially I think you'll be paying £500 for the pre alone...for starters Atm, my fave way of EQ'ing...is ..er ..not to, as the TFB550-B is very good straight out of the box. The SWR SM takes more work but is just as capable..IF..you have the time. Both feature a 4 band para EQ..which you can just notch for any problems..but with both those amps, I rarely even have to use it. The last time I played a big hall, high roof and a bit too much bass..I just rolled off the bass control....and a bit of enhance/timbre bias..and that was it. Sound checked in less than 5 mins. For a pro rig/large stage...into 2 large cabs, I would consider the pre/power amp route...or just run a power amp off my best amp but atm...most of my gigs are well covered with 550watts max. If you are running a hi-powered stage rig, you should have decent volume in the side-fills anyway so cosmetics come into play more than they need to with personal rigs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 6, 2011 Author Share Posted October 6, 2011 Hmmm, having looked around the rack based pre's certainly aren't cheap so that idea has probably bitten the dust. I may well keep my eyes open on the for sale forum, but in the meantime if its good enough for Pino then maybe I should stick with it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluRay Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 [quote name='phatbass787' timestamp='1317852814' post='1395554'] Seen Pino use an ABM head with Epi 410 lots of times so compatability shouldn't be an issue, just tame the low end a tad by backing off gently on the bass end of the eq till you get the sweet spot for the room [/quote] + 1. ABM eq takes a little bit of fiddling with, but if you persevere you shouldn't need to buy different gear. Its worth switching the pre-shape off too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 10, 2011 Author Share Posted October 10, 2011 I think I probably will persevere for a while at least. I've never been particularly good at EQ so this might be my chance. I saw a great demo of EQ'ing a semi parametric on Youtube the other day to give me some tips; basically the guy just kept twiddling everything in every direction until he got the sound he wanted! Sounds time consuming, but actually only took him about 20 seconds max. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fingerz Posted October 10, 2011 Share Posted October 10, 2011 (edited) Hi mate, Is your Epi cab a series 2 or series 1? From personal experience I can say that the S2 models are much more scooped in the mids than the older s1 cabs which, though quite shaped in their own sound, still retained a lot of mid range punch and growl if needed. Although the s2 is great, loud, and portable, it may be part of the problem if that's what you have. Obviously if you know that then you can start to work around it with the amp... But then I'd agree with other comments (again from personal experience) that the Ashdown stuff is very weighty on the low end and not the most 'mid' range presence in its inherent sound. So you're getting loads of bottom end which is probably just too much in your environment-always a nightmare anyway! I remember the Ashdown EQ being pretty powerful and maybe even using the 'Shape' or 'flat' (can't remember which) to cull a bit of that boomy low end will help massively.. WHen you turn up the volume in the kinda venue you're talking of the sound can change massively! Doh! Hope that's of some help dude. Edited October 10, 2011 by fingerz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 11, 2011 Author Share Posted October 11, 2011 Thanks for your suggestions. My Epi cab is the S1 version so it shouldn't be too mid-scooped. One of the earlier comments also questionned whether my strings might be a bit less-of-life and I said that I didn't think they were. Well, I've just had the chance to do a little compare-and-contrast; I have new strings on order - say no more! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danhkr Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 [quote name='Rumble' timestamp='1317731739' post='1393772'] I can dial out the boom by trimming back the bass, but that seems to negate the point of getting the ABM in the first place. [/quote] I don't see why, eq controls are there to be cut as well as boosted and there's plenty of scope either way on an ABM. It's a new amp, start with a flat eq and spend a bit of time with it, and again, don't be afraid to cut! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 Whatever way you do it, just sap some dB's from around 100Hz. You'll be OK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rumble Posted October 14, 2011 Author Share Posted October 14, 2011 I'll try that and see where i get. Guess I could always boost some of the lower mids if I need to bolster the low end. Ta for all your suggestions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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