BassHertz Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 I am creating a site to help those who are new to recording their bass guitar in to a computer via DAW software. Please take a look - any constructive criticism will be greatly appreciated. I am no expert but I hope that my limited knowledge will be of help to others Or if you have any hints and tips and would like me to add them to the site please feel free to share them here. you can access the site at [url="http://www.recordingbass.co.uk"]http://www.recordingbass.co.uk[/url] I look forward to hearing your comments ADMIN/MODS: if this inappropriate please remove this post, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 I'll try and read a page a day . On homepage I'd add a few bits: -Tools for setting up and restringing the bass -Spare strings/batteries/cables not essential until you need them but when you need them you NEED them... -Certain condensers need phantom power or battery (could be worth a mention on the home page) -I think Protools should definitely get a mention on the DAW's You could go for the semi serious stuff such as snacks etc too though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 You could really do with explaining phase alignment between the mic and the DI, otherwise its pot luck as to whether your two signals are in phase or not. Not in phase == no bass.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 To be honest the compression explaination is a tad, well, limited..... And a cookie cutter 'use these sounds to get a decent sound' approach isnt going to work (you dont know at what level they recorded the bass at for one thing, or what technique they used) Its a website's worth of info on its own unfortunately! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 More accurate level setting guide would be to say that if they are recording at 24bit they really want to be hitting no higher than -12dB (and possibly -18dB) on the way in. If they are recording at 16bit then they have less headroom to play with - so avoid 16bit.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1321449579' post='1439242'] To be honest the compression explaination is a tad, well, limited..... And a cookie cutter 'use these sounds to get a decent sound' approach isnt going to work (you dont know at what level they recorded the bass at for one thing, or what technique they used) Its a website's worth of info on its own unfortunately! [/quote] You should know unfortunately I missed the famous speech though. I was too busy A/B'ing in the other room Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Bass guitars page you mention the Jazz bass is the industry standard. I would put the PBass on par if not infront, could be worth a mention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1321449719' post='1439246'] You should know unfortunately I missed the famous speech though. I was too busy A/B'ing in the other room [/quote] Shame on you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1321449439' post='1439240'] You could really do with explaining phase alignment between the mic and the DI, otherwise its pot luck as to whether your two signals are in phase or not. Not in phase == no bass.... [/quote] You know, the whole time I was at uni not once did someone mention that. It makes perfect sense as soon as I read it but I'm just shocked it never came up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassHertz Posted November 16, 2011 Author Share Posted November 16, 2011 Wow thanks guys, I really appreciate the feedback @ Charic - very good points i will definitely add them and you are right about the pbass..especially as I recorded the samples with a P-Bass lol @ 51mon - I think i will have to do some reading on phase alignment and regarding compression, I agree with you that its a bit thin. I was aiming this site at beginners but I think think I will add an "advanced compression" page - cheers mate. (any more info could you PM me - sorry a bit cheeky ) I will add your info on recording levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 Actually there's a thought. Next time you do one of those Compression chats can you record it please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1321449841' post='1439252'] You know, the whole time I was at uni not once did someone mention that. It makes perfect sense as soon as I read it but I'm just shocked it never came up. [/quote] Dear god, really? Thats tragic, hold on, were you studying Chemistry? That might explain it.... Phase issues with multiple mics or multiple any sources in any recording situation is just a huge thing to take into account. Its made way simpler with the use of plugins like Phasebug at mix time now, but nothing beats getting it right there and then. There are hardware solutions to phase alignment too, other than moving the mic, which are super useful if you dont hit a DAW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1321461400' post='1439450'] Dear god, really? Thats tragic, hold on, were you studying Chemistry? That might explain it.... Phase issues with multiple mics or multiple any sources in any recording situation is just a huge thing to take into account. Its made way simpler with the use of plugins like Phasebug at mix time now, but nothing beats getting it right there and then. There are hardware solutions to phase alignment too, other than moving the mic, which are super useful if you dont hit a DAW. [/quote] Multiple mics was covered but never mic and DI. Although my lecturer was a little bit.. different Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='BassHertz' timestamp='1321450569' post='1439263'] Wow thanks guys, I really appreciate the feedback @ Charic - very good points i will definitely add them and you are right about the pbass..especially as I recorded the samples with a P-Bass lol @ 51mon - I think i will have to do some reading on phase alignment and regarding compression, I agree with you that its a bit thin. I was aiming this site at beginners but I think think I will add an "advanced compression" page - cheers mate. (any more info could you PM me - sorry a bit cheeky ) I will add your info on recording levels. [/quote] The search function on this site is your friend here, I've spouted off about setting up a compressor and how one works so many times its beyond daft Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1321461556' post='1439452'] Multiple mics was covered but never mic and DI. Although my lecturer was a little bit.. different [/quote] Maybe he never tried it - cant believe that, how odd... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1321461589' post='1439454'] Maybe he never tried it - cant believe that, how odd... [/quote] This is a lecturer who told a judge (during the lecture over his mobile on loudspeaker) "No I won't be coming to court today, I've still got the taste of toothpaste in my mouth and I'm teaching at the moment" then hung up... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassHertz Posted November 16, 2011 Author Share Posted November 16, 2011 Thanks 51m0n i will try to find some of your posts when I get back from college later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 16, 2011 Share Posted November 16, 2011 [quote name='charic' timestamp='1321461879' post='1439457'] This is a lecturer who told a judge (during the lecture over his mobile on loudspeaker) "No I won't be coming to court today, I've still got the taste of toothpaste in my mouth and I'm teaching at the moment" then hung up... [/quote] Class! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHUFC BASS Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) A good site mate and something that should be of use to beginners. A few pointers and suggestions if I may... I'd make more of a mention on headphones and studio monitors. These really will be the only way to determine how good the sound is that you're recording and emphasis should be made on getting the best you can afford. The flatter sound with the least colouring as possible - Berydynamic DT880 headphones and Yamaha HS80s are what I'm using at present. Also, your recording system seems geared heavily towards a Windows environment which is OK but MACs are just as popular, if not more so - certainly in professional studios. Might be worth mentioning something on them too. I'm guessing that your article is geared towards home recording - if so, you should really expand on room acoustics and what pitfalls to avoid such as bass traps etc. and also something on ambient room sound, room size, sound damping and amplifier positioning. This is really important, and can really affect the sound you recording if going down the mic'ing up route. Also, and I know this may be personal preference, but I tend to avoid using condenser mics on both guitar and bass cabs and prefer dynamic mics instead. I just tend to find you get more of a natural sound with dynamic. It may be my room acoustics but I have experimented with several mic combinations and positioning but I still don't think you can beat a direct input / dynamic bass drum mic (I use an Audix D6) for getting a great sound. The importance of recording with new, or newish strings should also be stressed. It really makes a difference to your sound IMO and can really improve a cheaper bass' sound. Remember the old recording mantra - "sh*t In - sh*t Out" which really is true as I've found out to my peril. Its also worth mentioning that mixing desks, certainly in a home environment, really aren't necessary as many audio interfaces come with their own software mixing desks. Certainly this was the case for me. Since I got a Presonus Firestudio and a Focusrite DSP24 I've used the software mixing desk, rather than my Mackie desk. Some Youtube videos would go a long way to demostrating some of your points and techniques. Edited November 22, 2011 by WHUFC BASS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassHertz Posted November 22, 2011 Author Share Posted November 22, 2011 Thanks for your comments WHUFC Bass - some really useful point there - Its good to hear about the types of equipment other people are using for recording especially microphones. Most of the feedback I am getting all falls into the same areas that you mention. I was hoping to add more to the site this past weekend but I got two college assignments thrown at me during last week - I agree that mixing desks aren't a necessity anymore but some people including myself prefer to fiddle with real controls rather than the mouse and it also depends on your recording process - some folks record the bass last so they will equalize it to fit into the mix just before recording to save a lot of time spent on post processing (i do this sometimes). I use an old 1980's Soundtracs desk as after the DI because I have a lot more control of the sound and the level with the use of a nice warm sounding eq and the fader before sending to the audio interface for recording. It would be very difficult to cater for every musical style on the site, for instance a reggae player like myself who swears by the thick dull sound of flatwounds will not be changing his strings every time he records - metal players will probably place all sorts of effects in the signal chain and will probably have their bass tuned down. I will add some info on room acoustics (thanks for reminding me ) and some info on speakers and headphones. Also a good point about the MAC I chose Reaper because its free as most newbies dont usually have the funds to splash out on a MAC and Logic Pro 9. Your comments are most appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 EQ'ing on the way to the recording interface is a very brave thing to do and not usually recommended. Just thought I would throw that in Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51m0n Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 Reaper isnt free, its just very cheap ($60 IIRC), and it runs on Mac as well as PC32 & 64 bit native. New strings are the way to go for almost all situations bar Motown and some reggae (although try a new set of flatwouinds and just use a really nice filter to take out the top, you will get a better sound 9 times out of 10 in the final mix, honest). Post processing eq is fine, if you really know what you are doing. A section on proper eq use (cut first, cut narrow, boost wide etc) would be really good, it mystifies most people how to use a real parametric eq. The fact is for surgical cutting of the pants part of a sound a big ole analogue eq isnt a patch on a good vst eq, but for adding that something sweet and broad a good analogue eq is just fantastic (Pultecs are still traded for mega money for a reason). Finally - dont get me started on how much I dislike using kick drum mics on bass and the kick again (and why its generally a bad idea IME & IMO) - its boring for us all, and will no doubt get everyone all upset again. But it is valid nevertheless especially in a studio.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1321960560' post='1444763'] Reaper isnt free, its just very cheap ($60 IIRC), and it runs on Mac as well as PC32 & 64 bit native. New strings are the way to go for almost all situations bar Motown and some reggae (although try a new set of flatwouinds and just use a really nice filter to take out the top, you will get a better sound 9 times out of 10 in the final mix, honest). Post processing eq is fine, if you really know what you are doing. A section on proper eq use (cut first, cut narrow, boost wide etc) would be really good, it mystifies most people how to use a real parametric eq. The fact is for surgical cutting of the pants part of a sound a big ole analogue eq isnt a patch on a good vst eq, but for adding that something sweet and broad a good analogue eq is just fantastic (Pultecs are still traded for mega money for a reason). Finally - dont get me started on how much I dislike using kick drum mics on bass and the kick again (and why its generally a bad idea IME & IMO) - its boring for us all, and will no doubt get everyone all upset again. But it is valid nevertheless especially in a studio.... [/quote] Do you mean pre eq processing is fine? I agree it can be fine but if you mess it up then there's no going back hence why it isn't usually recommended Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassHertz Posted November 22, 2011 Author Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) To be honest I dont spend too much time playing with the mouse I have an ADAT machine connected to a MOTU 828MK2 giving me 16 outputs which I run back into the Soundtracs, most of my mixing and eq'ing is done there. In the DAW (usually Logic Pro) i may add the odd insert effect and compressors to individual tracks/instruments. I like a mixture of both worlds. But I am a die-hard knob twiddler I agree that parametric equalizers need to be explained especially the "Q" control but again needs to explained in a simple manner that newbies can understand the difficult bit is wording it lol. Can anyone recommend a good modelling device with usb or firewire connection for direct recording? The Korg Pandora has been mentioned to me before. Edited November 22, 2011 by BassHertz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHUFC BASS Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 [quote name='51m0n' timestamp='1321960560' post='1444763'] Finally - dont get me started on how much I dislike using kick drum mics on bass and the kick again (and why its generally a bad idea IME & IMO) - its boring for us all, and will no doubt get everyone all upset again. But it is valid nevertheless especially in a studio.... [/quote] I'm intrigued ! Please tell me more. What mics do you normally use for mic'ing up bass amps ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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