Can someone sell me on a fretless.

[dave_bass5]

Ok. Ive never even played a fretless but a lot of people seem to have them.

I know what they sound like but im wondering if anyone uses one in a covers band.
i would like to get one as ive always liked the sound of them but im not sure if i would use it live other than for a few slow songs (or some Gary numan, 80's stuff).

Any thoughts? Im not after advice on what to get, just how useful having one could be.

[David Nimrod]

I don't think you should really ask whether they'll slot into a covers set...

If you play one for a while, new ideas will form around their unique sound.

It's a very different instrument, and most importantly:- great fun to play.

[Scoop]

I also play (and gig) as a guitarist, and at one gig we needed a bass dep so we contacted a Liverpool Muso called Andy Frizzel who plays with a Frank Zappa tribute band called the Muffin Men. He's an astonishingly talented multi-instrumentalist and one of the best bassists I know.

He turned up for a rock covers depping gig, having never seen us play before and knowing only half the set, with a fretless five string. His reasoning was that using a fretless on a dep gig means that if you cock up the tune you can slide up to the corect note without anyone really noticing. He was so adept at it that I reckon it's probably the best bass performance I've ever been involved with, either as a bassist myself or playing another instrument in a band with a different bass player.

Astonishing.

In the right hands a fretless can be a devastatingly effective tool. Sadly, they don't include my hands - I've been jonesing after a fretless for ages but the truth is that whenever I pick one up I play a bit of Mick Karn's Japan stuff and then go blank about whatever else to do with the damned thing.

I play a lot of altered tunings on guitar like Open G and DADGAD - many of my guitar playing mates have reached a stage in their lives where they simply can't be bothered to learn new stuff like that. I feel pretty much the same way about the fretless. I'm too old to get that technique nailed and too set in my ways. Sad. But I'm a curmugeonly old git at the best of times.

[Beedster]

Just play what you would play on a fretted but on a fretless, you'll find it really improves your ear and provide far more tonal range. I play blues and Motown stuff on an old Fretless Precision and it sounds fantastic. First time I turned up with it to rehearsal the guitarists was not only blown away with the sound (which was far more nasal and penetrating without losing any bottom end), but with the fact that I could play a guitar without frets.
I guess it's also more challenging, and I like that. I can get pretty bored playing "Heard it through the Grapevine" for the 800th time. Playing fretless requires a lot more concentration and attention to detail, and is thus ultimately more rewarding.
Give it a go, but don't try to walk before you run - playing and sounding like Jaco/Karn/Palladino is not a realistic short term goal, playing simple bass lines in tune and in time is however a very good start, and - in all seriousness - quite an achievement
Chris

[martthebass]

I'd agree with Beedster. I've had 2 fretless's (Fretlii?) in the past and on both occasions they ended up as bedroom toys and got sold on (the present toy is a 5 string - we'll see how she goes). On the rare occasions that I did gig with one I enjoyed it but found it hard to concentrate on my backing vocals so alas......
On jam nights I've had plenty fun (Cream covers etc) but you always get one smart arse who hits you with - 'what's the point of that -you're just posing' - sad but true.
I'm, working up to number 3 but I'll have to decide what goes to allo one in (3 bass rule from 'she that must be obeyed').

[jwbassman]

My main bass is a fretless 5 - so what does that make me?

That said my main gig is with a bigband so it's entirely appropriate - also use it for small jazz gigs and most of the show work I do...

I tend to use my pbass for the blues rock trio because it is more the sound that is required, i have used the fretless in the past but it overall just doesn't seem to work as well (even thought there are a few original songs we do where it is perfect). The rest of the band took instantly to the p first time I used it so it tends to get that gig now.

I'd be quite happy to use either bass in any of the given senarios it's just that one is more suited to a given situation than the other...

The fretless does sound very cool and it's worth having one just for that unmistakable mwah, go on you know you want to

[David Nimrod]

[quote name='Beedster' post='163929' date='Mar 26 2008, 05:09 PM']...playing simple bass lines in tune and in time is however a very good start, and - in all seriousness - quite an achievement [/quote]


That's pretty much my aim on [b][i]fretted[/i][/b] basses...

[wateroftyne]

Fretless ain't just for sounding like Jaco or Gary Numan. Beedster nails it...

[BigRedX]

I went over the last 3 years from never having played any fretless to using it for 75% of my bands current set. When I joined the band I could hear fretless lines for some of the songs so I took a risk and bought a cheapy off eBay. Never really looked back and now have 3 very nice fretless basses by Gus, Pedulla and Lightwave which all have very different sounds and feels. I nearly always start a new bass line on fretless first and only switch to fretted if I think it suits it better.

[7string]

Yup, fretless is far from a one-trick-pony.

I do think they're handy for a covers gig, but when you start playing a fretless it quickly becomes part of your overall playing. Like others on here, I switch between fretted and fretless for a variety of stuff and not just fretted=fast, fretless=ballad.

They can be a pain to play in tune, but persevere and the results are fantastic.

By the way, Tony Franklin on the first Blue Murder album and Marco Mendoza on "Screaming Blue Murder" prove that a fretless can hold it's own in a heavy rock setting!!

Edited March 26, 2008 by 7string

[dave_bass5]

Thanks for all the replies.

I think i may look for a very cheap one to start on. Just for home use.

Thing is (and i guess this is why i posted the question) i love my Lakland DD and it does all i need so i cant see how a fretless would fit in.

Of course for original stuff you can write on it but for what i do i cant think of any songs that were played on Fretless.

I do agree it can be a bit of a show off instrument if played the right way but nothing wrong with that.

I also agree with Beedster, its a challenge and thats a good thing as i too am fed up with 90% of my set list. Ive always looked on a fretless as being hard to play and while im not very good anyway i can see it adding interest to the songs i can play already.

Anyway, food for thought. ill get this weekends gigs out of the way and go looking for something.

[The Funk]

My cousin, a very good blues rock guitarist, had a sell-out phase a few years ago where he joined an indie rock band (who toured on the same bill as The Libertines and The Strokes). As he was the only guitarist who could keep time, he got shunted to bass. He picked up a great fretless Warwick Corvette 4-string and just played that the whole time - having never played bass before.

It's not as hard or as niche as people can sometimes make out.

[Scoop]

[quote name='The Funk' post='164188' date='Mar 26 2008, 11:53 PM']It's not as hard or as niche as people can sometimes make out.[/quote]

But there's the rub, innit? Your cousin came to fretless from a guitarist's perspective never having played bass before. It was a new instrument and he had no preconceptions and preset ideas. For the likes of me, age 47 wth 33 years of playing fretted bass under my belt, the fretless is a very strange animal indeed. For me, it IS as hard as as niche as people make out.

[Jase]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='163871' date='Mar 26 2008, 04:11 PM']Ok. Ive never even played a fretless but a lot of people seem to have them.

I know what they sound like but im wondering if anyone uses one in a covers band.
i would like to get one as ive always liked the sound of them but im not sure if i would use it live other than for a few slow songs (or some Gary numan, 80's stuff).

Any thoughts? Im not after advice on what to get, just how useful having one could be.[/quote]


Go for it! Fretless can be used in any band situation plus they're highly addictive

[The Funk]

[quote name='Scoop' post='164199' date='Mar 27 2008, 12:16 AM']But there's the rub, innit? Your cousin came to fretless from a guitarist's perspective never having played bass before. It was a new instrument and he had no preconceptions and preset ideas. For the likes of me, age 47 wth 33 years of playing fretted bass under my belt, the fretless is a very strange animal indeed. For me, it IS as hard as as niche as people make out.[/quote]

That's fair enough. If it's not worth the extra work in your eyes, then don't bother with it.

When I started playing fretless about a year ago I found it fairly easy to adjust. I'd been playing fretted bass for 13 years previously. Just play exactly what you'd play on your fretted and keep your ears open to spot intonation problems. The only real difference is the way you play vibrato. Instead of doing a guitar style bend, you just do a long double bass style glide back and forth.

If you want to play it, get a fretless version of your fretted bass. I found that helped. I knew where the notes were without looking - but the dots were there for when I could hear I missed.

If you try to play Jaco stuff that you can't play on fretted, it's going to take work.

Like I said, if you just don't like playing fretless bass then don't bother with it. There are enough other cool bass things to do.

[paul, the]

Not convinced on fretless, yet, myself. I think the umph provided by frets are so important for rhythm and definition.

I'd only want that open tone in jazz and ambient music (Eberhard Weber sort of thing); and there, upright is king.

[Beedster]

[quote name='paul, the' post='164224' date='Mar 27 2008, 01:34 AM']Not convinced on fretless, yet, myself. I think the umph provided by frets are so important for rhythm and definition.

I'd only want that open tone in jazz and ambient music (Eberhard Weber sort of thing); and there, upright is king.[/quote]

Not sure 'umph' is a function of the frets. My fretless Precisons (all three of them) have as much umph as my fretted. The perception of lack of power on fretless is perhaps a function of the type of lines we acssociate with fretless players/specialists, and not necessarily of fretless bass per se.
Chris

[The Funk]

[quote name='Beedster' post='164237' date='Mar 27 2008, 05:46 AM']The perception of lack of power on fretless is perhaps a function of the type of lines we acssociate with fretless players/specialists, and not necessarily of fretless bass per se.[/quote]

Could be that. Could also be that some fretless basses are designed to have a more double bass style attack and decay. So you end up with no sustain on those models.

[Rich]

[quote name='7string' post='163987' date='Mar 26 2008, 07:07 PM']By the way, Tony Franklin on the first Blue Murder album and Marco Mendoza on "Screaming Blue Murder" prove that a fretless can hold it's own in a heavy rock setting!![/quote]And Steve DiGiorgio proves that fretless can hold its own in a thrash setting

Fretless is brilliant, it's like a whole new instrument.

[Beedster]

[quote name='Rich' post='164245' date='Mar 27 2008, 07:26 AM']And Steve DiGiorgio proves that fretless can hold its own in a thrash setting

Fretless is brilliant, it's like a whole new instrument.[/quote]

Or a whole old instrument

[JakeBrownBass]

i've got a cheap fretless for sale here,

[url="http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=15760"]http://basschat.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=15760[/url]

Its really good quality to!

-Jake

[Funkydunc]

[quote]For the likes of me, age 47 wth 33 years of playing fretted bass under my belt, the fretless is a very strange animal indeed[/quote].
I am a little youger at 45 with 25 years of playing bass! Twice in the past I have failed when trying to add a fretless to my arsenal. However a couple of years ago I tried for a third time and it clicked so dont think that all time on fretted will preclude you from the fretless. It is different but can be the right choice in a number of places. I play mostly in a contemporary christian music setting and for the slow contemplative numbers its perfect. Must try it with some of the more up beat numbers though - I've never thought about trying it for them, thanks!

Dunc

[Born 2B Mild]

[quote name='dave_bass5' post='164070' date='Mar 26 2008, 09:11 PM']I think i may look for a very cheap one to start on. Just for home use.[/quote]

Necks on fretless, usually come with either dot marks on the top side, and a completely clear fret board, or have lines across the neck where the fret wire would be. Can I humbly suggest that you don't buy the former for your first fretless experiment? If you can, get to a shop that has both types in, so you can see the difference. Playing without good fret markers is, I reckon, where many of the 'tried and gave up' folk stumbled.

[Machines]

I defretted my Yamaha 5 string about a year ago, it'll never get used out the house (for the forseeable future) but I love playing it and will never sell it. I don't play it enough though..

[mic mac moe]

My first bass was a fretless.An Aria SB.You know the bass you REALLY shouldn't have sold? Thats another story!!!I have had a lot of fretless basses in the last few years and I always feel that I'm not complete without one.The best was a '96 precision in C.A.R. This bloody curse of the gas!!!