String Life

[Alpha-Dave]

Hi folks,

I've been wondering for a while why we change strings so often. I've almost convinced myself that it actually isn't necessary as with a decent EQ you should be able to feed some mids and treble back as the strings age, however nothing has that 'zing' of a new string.

I have to wonder, with modern metallurgical technology is it possible to make a string that always 'zings', but no one has tried it because they'd reduce their market.

Any thoughts?

Cheers,
David.

[Beedster]

[quote name='Alpha-Dave' post='16872' date='Jun 13 2007, 02:00 PM']Hi folks,

I've been wondering for a while why we change strings so often. I've almost convinced myself that it actually isn't necessary as with a decent EQ you should be able to feed some mids and treble back as the strings age, however nothing has that 'zing' of a new string.

I have to wonder, with modern metallurgical technology is it possible to make a string that always 'zings', but no one has tried it because they'd reduce their market.

Any thoughts?

Cheers,
David.[/quote]

Lightbulbs and Japanese bikes spring to mind

Personally, I like old strings. If I wanted to sound like Geddy or Stanley (I'm on first name terms with both obviously) I would probably be changing them every day.

Am I correct in saying that bass strings don't really lose their 'bassness' as they age, just their treble response? If so, it seems to me that the design might be OK after all! Certainly in the old days when I played 'rays, I used to dread new strings and had to back the treble off significantly just to avoid [Sidding Hiss]ing off the rest of the band with my clankiness.
C

[Muppet]

[quote name='Beedster' post='16913' date='Jun 13 2007, 02:42 PM']Lightbulbs and Japanese bikes spring to mind [/quote]

I've got a Japanese bike - is there something I should know? Should I be changing it every three months?

[Shaggy]

I got six years out of my last set of strings - is this a record? I remember reading a famous bassist so famous I've forgotten his name saying he used to rub tomato ketchup onto new strings as he hated the "zing".
Bike-wise I ride a 1972 Norton Commando 750 roadster, which should outlast even my current set of strings.

[David Nimrod]

Is it actually worth boiling bass strings, or is that just be*llsh*t?

Also, what would happen if you boiled Elixirs? ;-)

[NJW]

i love the new string sound, but of course that is entirely subjective.

Boiling bass strings is a bad idea. First of all, it DOES clean out the grime from your string and make it sound 'new'. It can also damage the windings and core, meaning it will sound 'dead' again far quicker, and you hugely compromise the integrity of the string, meaning it could break. Secondly, people usually do it in pans... and the residue that comes out of a boiled string sure ain't something you wanna be mixing with yer 'taters.

For cleaning strings, people recommend using denatured alcohol (methylated spirits to you and me), if you wish to go through the hassle. Personally, I'd just buy new strings.

Edited June 13, 2007 by NJW

[Alpha-Dave]

I tried boiling some Warwick Black labels once, they had more mids back but they still didn't have the 'zing' like a new string.

I'm starting to think that it's a cleaning issue rather than a corrosion issue for everything other than coated strings.

We have an ultrasound cleaner at work that's supposed to remove any gunk from anything, so I'm toying with the idea of sticking a set in there to see if it actually cleans them or not.

Or perhaps an alcohol based cleaner like Vodka might do just as well.

[chris_b]

If you have a string deal then change them as often as you like. I buy my strings and change them every year, whether they need it or not. The various styles of music I play don't need much zing and I can EQ as much top as I need.

DR makes a string spray which is supposed to keep your strings zinging longer than normal.

[lowhand_mike]

i put alot of the zing going away down to dirt and crap getting in the windings and inside the string, my elixirs still seem pretty zingy after 6 months cos i have to be carerful with the treble control on my bass and amp though they are not as bright as when first bought cos you still get a certain amount of dirt build up on the string coating.

as a side point what is it ok to clean the dirt off coated strings like the elixirs? i don't really want to get too much wet stuff near my bass.

and in my old days i didn't change strings that often as i was a student so they stayed there quite a while and still sounded nice. companies are going to put a certain amount of planned obsolesence into their strings so you go buy some more

[NJW]

as i mentioned above, the most common fluid used to clean strings is methylated spirits (denatured alcohol).

[lukeward2004]

I use Elixir Nanoweb strings on all my fretted basses, and I dont clean them EVER. Might wipe them down after a good polish but never a proper clean.

They last me for about a year before I need to think about changing them - lovely!

[lowhand_mike]

[quote name='NJW' post='16964' date='Jun 13 2007, 03:41 PM']as i mentioned above, the most common fluid used to clean strings is methylated spirits (denatured alcohol).[/quote]

yeah but is that ok on the nanoweb coating though? would the meths harm the polymer tube on the strings?

Edited June 13, 2007 by lowhand_mike

[john_the_bass]

elixir apparently recommend not using any product to clean them at all

[P-T-P]

I've been using DR Extras for the past six months or so. One set lasts about 2 months being played pretty much every day and gigged a couple of times a week. Standard steel roundwounds I found would last about 4-6 weeks.

There's not as noticeable a drop in top end as I seem to remember getting with traditional roundwounds which to me always go through three distinct stages: excrutiatingly bright and clanky (unless slapping in which case yum!) -> just right -> utterly lifeless. The change from one stage to another always seems instantaneous (which of course it can't be). The DR Extra's I find are far less clanky at first and then I never really notice the decline until I play a different bass which has newer strings on.

As to the causes of the diminshing treble return, might metal fatigue be a factor and/or might the type of steel used and its suitability for the job be a contributor?

Certainly when it comes to the former, playing identical basses, one strung with new strings, the other with strings of a certain vintage, I notice that the older strings don't feel as difficult to fret as the newer ones.

As for the latter, it seems to me that a new Rotosound swing bass 66 set is immensely more toppy than equivalent strings from other makers. They also feel a darn sight rougher to the touch and take a lot more breaking in than most other similar strings I've tried (Elites, Trace, Lakland, D'adarios) and las a bit longer too.

[NJW]

[quote name='lowhand_mike' post='16998' date='Jun 13 2007, 04:18 PM']yeah but is that ok on the nanoweb coating though?[/quote]

Ahh sorry, misread that part of your post!

[Machines]

I find sweat kills my strings the most. I am a tight when it comes to strings - haven't bought any since November.

An occasional boil does me fine - I don't play for hours on end (maybe 2-3 hours a week tops) and attribute that to how long I keep them for before buying new ones.

That new string zing can be over the top - I prefer strings a few weeks old.

[lukeward2004]

[quote name='lukeward2004' post='16979' date='Jun 13 2007, 03:54 PM']I use Elixir Nanoweb strings on all my fretted basses, and I dont clean them EVER. Might wipe them down after a good polish but never a proper clean.

They last me for about a year before I need to think about changing them - lovely![/quote]


I should probably add I play for an hour a night at home and then 3 hours in the studio twice a week, plus fairy regular gigs, so they do see a lot of action!

[john_the_bass]

i generally string my basses when i break a string - usually 3 months old, but i play with a pick and i hit em *hard*. Saying that, I didn't break a string on the ray and replaced them when they'd gone dead acoustically - there was still enough zing plugged in - but i'm in the don't like zing camp i'm afraid. I prefer em a few weeks old but i do find that once they're worn out, they lose their integrity and don't hold their tuning very well.
I've recently been buying strings in "bulk" and bought 3 sets fender 8250s and 3 sets d'addario half rounds from the states. not bulk i know, but those 6 sets cost me about 50 quid from the US. I play guitar twice a week and probably change guitar strings every 3 weeks or so - I buy these in bulk and pay about £1.10 a set - i've taken a punt on a set of 40-100 nickel roundwounds from the same guy for £3 for a set on the off chance that they're any good - based on the quality of the guitar strings, which i suspect are d'addarios and apparently fitted as standard to yamaha and aria guitars.

[spike]

[quote name='chris_b' post='16954' date='Jun 13 2007, 03:24 PM']I buy my strings and change them every year, whether they need it or not.[/quote]

+1 to that. Takes about a month for new strings to feel properly broken in to me

[Rayman]

I generally leave them on 'till they just go completely dead. I'm expecting the recently put on Warwick Black Labels on my jazz to last a year at least. I had some on a Thunderbird that were still going strong after 18 months, 6 gigs a month plus rehearsals, that's pretty good going.

[Jean-Luc Pickguard]

I keep a spare set of TI flat in my cables bag and always make sure I order a set whenever I buy a new bass. My oldest set is probably about six years old and still going strong.

[BassJase]

I must have severe "acid hands" then, as i change my strings when they start making that "plop" sound (no sustain, just a middle-y fart sound) which can take anything from a couple of gigs to a few weeks to occur.
My hands do sweat a lot when i play though, and i'm currently trying out a few sets of extended-life strings. I've so far tried Elixirs, DR Evergreens, Warwick EMPs and Dean Markley Blue Steels. The Elixirs have been the best so far, as they seem to start off already sounding a little worn-in, and keep that sound for quite a while. The Warwick EMPs sound great and seem to be lasting well, but they feel rough as arseholes and make your fingers sting if you do too much slidey-stuff.
Strings like Elites, Roto's, and Ernie Balls seem to last about 3 hours with me. Wheres that string deal when you need one?

[bass_ferret]

As I use half rounds I change them about once a year whether they need it or not. even when I was gigging lots I still only changed them once a year. When I was using rounds some of them went [Fly a Kite] after the first gig.

As for Elixirs, as they are coated with Gore-Tex I would recommend washing them with something like Nikwax, designed for washing Gore-Tex clothes.

[Kiwi]

If you look at Elixir's website there's a load of guff about how stuff gets in between the windings to deaden the sound. There may be something to this but I don't know. However I think its also worth noting the properties of metal are that its good under expansion, but it can stretch. Part of the legend behind cryogenically frozen strings (like Dean Markley Blue Steels) was that the freezing process aligned the molecules better (tempering process) and made the strings less susceptible to stretching and therefore they lasted longer.

I mean, its all a lot of medicine show at the end of the day. You can potentially still end up with a duff set of strings regardless of how good the manufacturer claims they are. I'd prefer to minimise my risk and buy cheap every time. I tend to use D'Addario Stainless Steel and boil them so long as flat spots haven't been worn in. I've had duff sets from status, rotosound and elite. I use Warwick red label sometimes as well if I want softer sounding strings - the Daddarios are very aggressive so good for the Smiths.

[R,5,R,5...]

Many good points in this thread.

I would be interested in the results of the ultrasound cleaning method. I suppose if the change in sound were indeed due to dirt, this would take care of it. However as many of you suggested, there are probably structural reasons that affect the sound as well.

What I would suggest is to NEVER try to clean silk-wound strings in boiling water. They get soaked and useless.

For me trying to revive old strings just isn't worth the bother. I suppose it could be different if I gigged three times a week, however.