Warwick Go Mental.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='Dirk_Warwick' timestamp='1327063126' post='1505865']
Hello everyone,

regarding the prices, one have to take into account that the [b]quality standards have risen[/b], production fulfills highest ecological standards, employees are reasonably paid, all woods are air dried for at least 3 years, lacquering is absolutely state of the art, and so on. Of course these things result in a pretty high price.

Dirk
[/quote]
go back far enough and they were all handmade.

[charic]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1327066799' post='1505944']
go back far enough and they were all handmade.
[/quote]

It also raises an interesting question, has anyone here ever had a duff warwick? I've never played one I didn't think was excellent quality, there were I couple I didn't get on with but the Quality was still there..

[jackers]

[quote name='muttley' timestamp='1327062024' post='1505842']
It's not "fancy maths", just basic arithmetic. I've also made some big assumptions hence my question mark at the end of my final sentence. IANAE but I have at least tried to compare apples with apples (even if they are still different varieties ). Just complaining that they have gone up in price is meaningless; everything else has gone up too.
[/quote]

You make a sensible point, but you are making the massive assumption that everyone's salary increases at the same rate as prices on goods rise, which in most cases simply isn't true. The salary I get now is the same figure I would have gotten 5 years ago, but now my living expenses are significantly more than what they would have been at that time.

[Dirk_Warwick]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1327066799' post='1505944']
go back far enough and they were all handmade.
[/quote]

Of course you are right, but nowadays handmade has (or at least should have) a different meaning and handmade does not necessarily lead to better results. Today production at Warwick means handmade but with the help of machines that most manufacturers simply can not afford. These tools help improve quality beyond measures. That does not mean that older Warwicks are of minor quality or that other brands do not offer quality instruments, but today Warwick goes one step further.

[shizznit]

[quote name='charic' timestamp='1327067066' post='1505951']
It also raises an interesting question, has anyone here ever had a duff warwick? I've never played one I didn't think was excellent quality, there were I couple I didn't get on with but the Quality was still there..
[/quote]

[font="Arial"]I have been to the Warwick factory and it's not like a production line like Fender which is reminiscent of a car plant. There is obviously a production line method being used in the Warwick factory, but the guys on the floor do take a lot of attention building the basses especially during the finishing and QC stages. There is still very much a handmade element to every bass they build there.[/font]

[font="Arial"]Personally speaking, every bass I have had has been bullet proof and the quality and craftsmanship has been brilliant. I have owned stock off the rack and custom made models and there has been no significant difference in the quality of all of the instruments.[/font]

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='charic' timestamp='1327067066' post='1505951']
It also raises an interesting question, has anyone here ever had a duff warwick? I've never played one I didn't think was excellent quality, there were I couple I didn't get on with but the Quality was still there..
[/quote]

No, I've not heard much... maybe a couple of stories years back.... certainly not as much as other brands.

[LukeFRC]

[quote name='Dirk_Warwick' timestamp='1327067591' post='1505964']
Of course you are right, but nowadays handmade has (or at least should have) a different meaning and handmade does not necessarily lead to better results. Today production at Warwick means handmade but with the help of machines that most manufacturers simply can not afford. These tools help improve quality beyond measures. That does not mean that older Warwicks are of minor quality or that other brands do not offer quality instruments, but today Warwick goes one step further.
[/quote]

Hello Dirk, I'm guessing you have a connection to warwick. If so it is great to see you on the site. (and thank you for making my main bass ) if I am wrong...
I personally, and I guess speaking as a graphic/communication designer, think that warwick's biggest problem is a communication one- you hear folk who have been to the factory, or worked with the distributer hinting how actually we are all wrong and they are brilliant basses, if we just knew what they knew.... there was a fascinating thread last year about it when the new korean models came out, lots of people didn't understand what was going on, and a fella came up and explained actually there was a brilliant plan under way and all these amazing things going on, that he couldn't fully explain. So if what we believe from people 'in the know' warwick are doing some amazing-brilliant things in the way they produce basses in germany and abroad- problem is that isn't getting communicated- I think they need a new advertising/communication agency; to explain [i]why[/i] warwick make better basses than anyone else- and position theme within the culture of popular music successfully

[Chris2112]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1327069024' post='1506004']
No, I've not heard much... maybe a couple of stories years back.... certainly not as much as other brands.
[/quote]

The only ones I've played were either Rockbass items or Corvettes. The Rockbass and Streamer Standard model, understandably never going to set your world on fire. The Corvettes that just seemed naff were early millenium ones like the FNA, the necks were massive and the set up was poor, and it just sounded naff. Even with a setup, I don't think it would have impressed a great deal. And then there are the $$ basses and other ash bodied Corvette types that never sounded great to me.

The proper top end Warwick stuff is quite genuinely incredible, to be fair.

[Dirk_Warwick]

[quote name='LukeFRC' timestamp='1327069805' post='1506023']
Hello Dirk, I'm guessing you have a connection to warwick. If so it is great to see you on the site. (and thank you for making my main bass ) if I am wrong...
I personally, and I guess speaking as a graphic/communication designer, think that warwick's biggest problem is a communication one- you hear folk who have been to the factory, or worked with the distributer hinting how actually we are all wrong and they are brilliant basses, if we just knew what they knew.... there was a fascinating thread last year about it when the new korean models came out, lots of people didn't understand what was going on, and a fella came up and explained actually there was a brilliant plan under way and all these amazing things going on, that he couldn't fully explain. So if what we believe from people 'in the know' warwick are doing some amazing-brilliant things in the way they produce basses in germany and abroad- problem is that isn't getting communicated- I think they need a new advertising/communication agency; to explain [i]why[/i] warwick make better basses than anyone else- and position theme within the culture of popular music successfully
[/quote]

Yes, I am affiliated to Warwick and part of my job is to improve the issues you described. Well, I already mentioned some important points but I'll gladly outline some points a bit more comprehensively.

Quality:

Even though machines are actually involved in the production process, you should not think of a production line like with an automobile manufacturer. Each intermediate product, no matter if it is a piece of wood or an almost finished instrument is handled with care by human employees during all stages of manufacturing. Nevertheless, machines are way more precise than humans at some tasks, that is for sure. Best known example is certainly the CNC. The more subtle working processes like sanding, quality checks, wood selection, installation of electronics and so on are still done by employees. You must know that Warwick's approach is to achieve the ultimate quality. A bolt-on neck for instance can be hardly removed from the body, even if you take out the screws. Our coatings have higher standards than in the automobile industry and are environmental freindly like almost any other material we use.

Sound:

Some of the greatest bass players there are relate on the Warwick sound and most of them even pay for their instruments. I don't think players like Robert Trujillo, Bootsy Collins, Jonas Hellborg, Larry Graham, and so on would play Warwick if they were not absolutely convinced of the quality and sound.

Environment:

Warwick lately received the FSC certifaction, is EMAS III certified as well, has the largest solar power plant in the region, only uses "green" electricity from sustainable energy sources, uses geothermics, has purchased the most energy-efficient machines there are, is almost independant in terms of energy and will certainly be completely autarchic within the next years. There are more projects to come, but these are the main points for now.

Well, these are some points out of a whole lot. If you have some more questions or if you would like to know something about a Warwick instrument in particular, ask me and I will give or get you the answer ;-)

Best,

Dirk

Edited January 20, 2012 by Dirk_Warwick

[Musicman20]

[quote name='Dirk_Warwick' timestamp='1327081421' post='1506219']

Warwick lately received the FSC certifaction, is EMAS III certified as well, has the largest solar power plant in the region, only uses "green" electricity from sustainable energy sources, uses geothermics, has purchased the most energy-efficient machines there are, is almost independant in terms of energy and will certainly be completely autarchic within the next years. There are more projects to come, but these are the main points for now.

Dirk
[/quote]

Dirk - great to see you on the site. Thanks for the input. Can I ask why the new standards you adhere to should cost the customer? Ethically the customer may feel a little better, but not financially.

[Linus27]

[quote name='charic' timestamp='1327067066' post='1505951']
It also raises an interesting question, has anyone here ever had a duff warwick? I've never played one I didn't think was excellent quality, there were I couple I didn't get on with but the Quality was still there..
[/quote]

Well, I have an December 2011 German made Streamer LX. The battery clip has snapped off in the first two weeks and the split precision pickups wobble so bad that I have had to take them out, wrap plumbers PTFE tape around the bolts and then re-screw them back into the brass slots to stop the wobble. I questioned this on the Warwick forum and it seems that i am not the only one who has had the wobbly pickups. This is on an £1800 bass that is brand new. Not sure I would call it a duff Warwick but its not the quality I was expecting for my £1800 and if I am totally honest, I am very dissapointed.

Edited January 20, 2012 by Linus27

[warwickhunt]

[quote name='Linus27' timestamp='1327082821' post='1506254']
Well, I have an December 2011 German made Streamer LX. The battery clip has snapped off in the first two weeks and the split precision pickups wobble so bad that I have had to take them out, wrap plumbers PTFE tape around the bolts and then re-screw them back into the brass slots to stop the wobble. I questioned this on the Warwick forum and it seems that i am not the only one who has had the wobbly pickups. This is on an £1800 bass that is brand new. Not sure I would call it a duff Warwick but its not the quality I was expecting for my £1800 and if I am totally honest, I am very dissapointed.
[/quote]

For the battery cover to snap off within two weeks of owning a new bass does seem extreme (I'm assuming that the battery was being changed for the very first time, so these clips went on the very first usage). It certainly isn't unheard of for the battery covers to give up the ghost (I presently have 3 Warwicks and one is taped on, whilst one of them is jammed in place) and is probably second only to 'chocolate fire-guard' jack sockets for common Warwick faults. As for the pick-up mountings - Warwick pups are mounted on springs (almost like shock absorbers) which have always had some give in them, I've known people add foam under the pups to firm it up and at the extreme for someone to put a block of wood underneath the pup so that it was fixed at a set height but it's down to personal preference and not everyone will like the 'spring-loading'... of course yours could have a separate issue!

Saying all of that I have NEVER seen a Warwick with a misaligned/incorrectly fitted bridge or skew-whiff neck alignment... not something I could say about F*nd*r. In fact there's a brand new (Road-Worn) bass for sale on here at the minute that has this very issue and it must be the third I've seen on here in as many months. Now THAT I'd have issue with.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='warwickhunt' timestamp='1327085440' post='1506326']


Saying all of that I have NEVER seen a Warwick with a misaligned/incorrectly fitted bridge or skew-whiff neck alignment... not something I could say about F*nd*r. In fact there's a brand new (Road-Worn) bass for sale on here at the minute that has this very issue and it must be the third I've seen on here in as many months. Now THAT I'd have issue with.
[/quote]

50% of Fenders/Laklands seem to get it wrong...I don't see why....I know what you mean as well...way off!

[Linus27]

[quote name='warwickhunt' timestamp='1327085440' post='1506326']
For the battery cover to snap off within two weeks of owning a new bass does seem extreme (I'm assuming that the battery was being changed for the very first time, so these clips went on the very first usage). It certainly isn't unheard of for the battery covers to give up the ghost (I presently have 3 Warwicks and one is taped on, whilst one of them is jammed in place) and is probably second only to 'chocolate fire-guard' jack sockets for common Warwick faults. As for the pick-up mountings - Warwick pups are mounted on springs (almost like shock absorbers) which have always had some give in them, I've known people add foam under the pups to firm it up and at the extreme for someone to put a block of wood underneath the pup so that it was fixed at a set height but it's down to personal preference and not everyone will like the 'spring-loading'... of course yours could have a separate issue!

[/quote]

It was not the battery cover it was the two terminals that the battery clip onto. The battery clips into the two metal terminals and the two metal terminals sit in an ovel piece of plastic. This oval piece of plastic snapped away from the two metal terminals.

Also, my pickups, they are not mounted on springs. The bolts go through the pickups and screw into a brass ferrule that is inserted into the wood in the pickup cavity. With the pickup removed, if I screwed the bolts into the ferrule as they should be, the bolt wobbles as if the thread is not tight enough. Wrapping a little PTFE tape around the thread of the bolt gave a tighter fit and stopped the wobble. There was no springs used at all on my LX4.

[shizznit]

[quote name='Linus27' timestamp='1327092416' post='1506480']
It was not the battery cover it was the two terminals that the battery clip onto. The battery clips into the two metal terminals and the two metal terminals sit in an ovel piece of plastic. This oval piece of plastic snapped away from the two metal terminals.

Also, my pickups, they are not mounted on springs. The bolts go through the pickups and screw into a brass ferrule that is inserted into the wood in the pickup cavity. With the pickup removed, if I screwed the bolts into the ferrule as they should be, the bolt wobbles as if the thread is not tight enough. Wrapping a little PTFE tape around the thread of the bolt gave a tighter fit and stopped the wobble. There was no springs used at all on my LX4.
[/quote]

Ahhh...come to think of it, the same thing happened with one of my Corvette Prolines. Your description brought it all back to me (I am getting old!)

[Linus27]

[quote name='shizznit' timestamp='1327093558' post='1506501']
Ahhh...come to think of it, the same thing happened with one of my Corvette Prolines. Your description brought it all back to me (I am getting old!)
[/quote]

I would have to agree with you, your spellings gone to pot and you can't remember your EQ settings. Its all down hill for you from now on

[shizznit]

[quote name='Linus27' timestamp='1327093914' post='1506505']


I would have to agree with you, your spellings gone to pot and you can't remember your EQ settings. Its all down hill for you from now on
[/quote]

Yeah, I'll be arriving at my gig tonight with my new mobility scooter. Now that's the new rock 'n' roll entrance!

[Chris2112]

I've got a new set of strings waiting to go on the Streamer, and a stack of Depeche Mode songs to start transcribing. If only my tuner hadn't ran out of battery! Means I'm having to hold off changing the strings until I can grab another 9v battery!

[Linus27]

[quote name='Chris2112' timestamp='1327365793' post='1510225']
I've got a new set of strings waiting to go on the Streamer, and a stack of Depeche Mode songs to start transcribing. If only my tuner hadn't ran out of battery! Means I'm having to hold off changing the strings until I can grab another 9v battery!
[/quote]

Why Depeche Mode? You in a Depeche Mode cover band?

[Chris2112]

[quote name='Linus27' timestamp='1327394167' post='1510337']
Why Depeche Mode? You in a Depeche Mode cover band?
[/quote]

Not a cover band, though we are planning on doing a few Depeche Mode covers. I'm singing Gahan's parts and the usual singer is singing Gore's parts and playing synths. I'm covering various synth parts and melodies with my bass. It's quite a cool way of doing things. We don't have enough synths or triggers to play everything like it was (nor do we have access to Depeche Mode's massive bank of sounds and samples) but we're piecing things together. Can't do much today until I've got my Streamer restrung though.

The best part is, there is nothing for the drummer to do! He can keep his 'sloppy' human time and we'll rely on the perfection of drum machines!

[Linus27]

Sounds cool mate.

[derrenleepoole]

Mmmmm... 5 string short scale Corvette

[bartelby]

[quote name='Chris2112' timestamp='1327410558' post='1510678']
Not a cover band, though we are planning on doing a few Depeche Mode covers. I'm singing Gahan's parts and the usual singer is singing Gore's parts and playing synths. I'm covering various synth parts and melodies with my bass. It's quite a cool way of doing things. We don't have enough synths or triggers to play everything like it was (nor do we have access to Depeche Mode's massive bank of sounds and samples) but we're piecing things together. Can't do much today until I've got my Streamer restrung though.

The best part is, there is nothing for the drummer to do! He can keep his 'sloppy' human time and we'll rely on the perfection of drum machines!
[/quote]

Sounds interesting.

A lot of the DM stuff is written on guitar then reworked into synth parts. Sounds like you're sort of going for somewhere in between their demo and studio versions.

[Dirk_Warwick]

[quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1327082078' post='1506235']
Dirk - great to see you on the site. Thanks for the input. Can I ask why the new standards you adhere to should cost the customer? Ethically the customer may feel a little better, but not financially.
[/quote]

Dear Musicman20,

Thanks for the warm welcome. Well, of course that depends on your personal attitude. We believe that there are many people out there who want to ensure that their instrument is manufactured sustainably and who are willing to pay for this certainty. On the other hand we ourselves are convinced that environment protection is worth a little extra effort and so Warwick will proceed. Last but not least this approach even makes sences economically if you think a few years further. Beeing independant in terms of energy can not be a mistake in the long run, just like the protection of the world's forests.

[quote name='Linus27' timestamp='1327082821' post='1506254']
Well, I have an December 2011 German made Streamer LX. The battery clip has snapped off in the first two weeks and the split precision pickups wobble so bad that I have had to take them out, wrap plumbers PTFE tape around the bolts and then re-screw them back into the brass slots to stop the wobble. I questioned this on the Warwick forum and it seems that i am not the only one who has had the wobbly pickups. This is on an £1800 bass that is brand new. Not sure I would call it a duff Warwick but its not the quality I was expecting for my £1800 and if I am totally honest, I am very dissapointed.
[/quote]

Hello Linus 27,

I'm sorry to read that you have issues with your instrument. Could you post the serial number of your bass as well as a photo of the mentioned parts, please? I have to say that we of course have an absolutely strict quality management and that the described issues have not come to our attention yet. We are convinced of the quality we offer and no instrument leaves the factory if it is not in a perfect condition.

Regards,

Dirk

[Chris2112]

[quote name='bartelby' timestamp='1327414438' post='1510806']
Sounds interesting.

A lot of the DM stuff is written on guitar then reworked into synth parts. Sounds like you're sort of going for somewhere in between their demo and studio versions.
[/quote]

Yeah, it's quite cool. Luckily Andy, the lad who is doing the synths and stuff is pretty handy so we've managed to get a few things cobbled together. And the Warwick sounds great for it, which is useful because I'm frequently jumping all over the board to get the best note for the part.