LukeFRC Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Drink fair trade? Do you use endangered illegal woods in your bass build? Ivory nut? fur strap? with blood diamond detailing? put together by slaves in some sweat shop? [b]Given that 40% of the worlds cobalt is from the DR congo, and the ethical issues surrounding it, would you buy the new cobalt strings from Ernie Ball?[/b] on the flip side Warwick has just released a bass with FSC approved wood from sustainable managed forests so it's not all bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I have no idea about how they made them, where they source it from, etc, but I would buy them. Bear in mind I have no problem with the other ethics you mentioned, but that's just me. Sometimes I just don't have time to worry about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted January 19, 2012 Author Share Posted January 19, 2012 [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1327009456' post='1505295'] I have no idea about how they made them, where they source it from, etc, but I would buy them. Bear in mind I have no problem with the other ethics you mentioned, but that's just me. Sometimes I just don't have time to worry about it. [/quote] http://www.opanarise.com/Articles/congo.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skankdelvar Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I've always avoided Ernie Ball because the guitar strings are sh*t. But this might change my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sibob Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 http://www.fbbcustom.com/ Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Musicman20 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Doesn't it state the cobalt is also in phone mobile batteries?! Seems we are all guilty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EssentialTension Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 [quote name='Musicman20' timestamp='1327010682' post='1505317'] Doesn't it state the cobalt is also in phone mobile batteries?! Seems we are all guilty. [/quote] In computers too I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRBboy Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I believe that cobalt is in most electronic devices, and probably quite a few other things too. I'm not in any way condoning what's going on in the Congo, but there are other ethical and humanitarian issues which are just as big if not much bigger. There's a story on the news right now about child labour in the cotton industry in India. Is there any evidence that the cobalt being used by Ernie Ball isn't responsibly sourced? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jellyfish Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 I see it as the responsibility of the manufacturer (in this case, Ernie Ball) to be as fair trade as possible. I know it often means higher prices, but at the end of the day it's the quality of the product (in the case of bass strings, at least) that draw their customers to buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beer of the Bass Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Cobalt is also in Alnico magnets, which most of us will have in our pickups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftybassman392 Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Ethical debates like this are fraught with danger. The basic problem is one of ignorance. I don't mean people are stupid, but that it's not uncommon for the sources of certain resources to be all but untraceable. For example, I watched an item on the Beeb a little while ago about the use of child labour in cotton farming in India. It's clear that employers are using children as young as 10, quite openly and often without pay, in the cotton fields. By the time the processed cotton reaches the big textile plants in places like Mumbai however (where work conditions are immeasurably better), it's pretty much impossible to trace the source of the cotton being used. Western companies buying this cotton insist they do not do trade with sources involved in this practice, but the honest answer is that for the most part they don't have a clue one way or the other. So what do we, the consumers, do? Hope that the cotton clothing we use has been produced ethically, and buy it anyway? Refuse to use cotton in case it might not be from ethical sources? Trust the retail industry to be telling the truth about their sourcing practices? Investigate every item we plan to buy just to make sure? Or do we stick our fingers in our ears, sing LALALA and carry on as before? Much as we like to consider ourselves enlightened and articulate and caring, my worry is that most of us will take this last option. Edited January 19, 2012 by leftybassman392 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Personally, when I have a choice to do so, I will not endorse irresponsibly sourced products. So, I choose to buy responsibly sourced coffee, clothing, chocolate etc etc when there's a choice and whenever it's practicable. When it comes to buying a computer with cobalt batteries and copper wiring it's hard to be a responsible consumer, but when given the choice between a product that may or may not be made from conflict/slave resources and another product that probably isn't, for me it's an easy choice! Anyway, strings make hardly any difference to your sound anyway, right? Truckstop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil.i.stein Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 [quote name='leftybassman392' timestamp='1327013058' post='1505377'] Ethical debates like this are fraught with danger. ...Or do we stick our fingers in our ears, sing LALALA and carry on as before? [/quote] spot on. we would all have to cancel our bank accounts, stop paying tax, stop shopping in supermarkets, and basically live in the woods and hunt our own food if we want to be ethical. where do we start ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted January 19, 2012 Share Posted January 19, 2012 Maybe we should ask BC'er, Ethicsbasscat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) [size=4]I agree with phil.i.stein. We're all consumers. We're all using fossil fuel. We're all contributing to pollution and resource depletion. We perpetuate the capitalist system. By our actions we promote heavy industry, inequality, poverty. I used to agonise over all this, but it was very bad for my mental health. The worst thing we can do as far as the environment is concerned is to have kids. The best thing we can do is kill ourselves. Nature will ultimately kill us all anyway. Don't worry! Be happy! Exchange your life for money! Buy stuff you don't need! Drive your car! Use electricity! Play your bass! [/size][size=4] [/size] [size=4].[/size] Edited January 20, 2012 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris2112 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I'm not really bothered, to be honest. We've destroyed the world, effectively. Beyond rescue. I wouldn't buy them because I tend to avoid Ernie Ball stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBobTTD Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 We all buy things made in China. There is no avoiding unethical products nowadays, so I tend to let things like cobalt mining ethics slip by me. I am not proud of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essexbasscat Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) [quote name='Clarky' timestamp='1327016314' post='1505420'] Maybe we should ask BC'er, Ethicsbasscat? [/quote] How long you had that lisp Clarky ?? Thufferingthukatash !! Edited January 20, 2012 by essexbasscat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarky Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 [quote name='essexbasscat' timestamp='1327052767' post='1505591'] That lisp not sorted yet Clarky ?? Thufferingthukatash !! [/quote] At latht! Wath waiting for you to thpeak up Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham56 Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 If the gig paid enough. I live in Kent so it's not that far... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LukeFRC Posted January 20, 2012 Author Share Posted January 20, 2012 I think there is a difference though- a lot of the technology we use uses cobalt and other resources that are hard to get in an ethical way. Companies are working on ways of sourcing 'clean' versions, like non-conflict diamonds, and/or develop technology less dependant on these materials. To launch a new product that features as it's major selling point this controversial mineral- and not because we don't have other technology that works fine seems odd to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
essexbasscat Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 [quote name='Clarky' timestamp='1327052990' post='1505600'] At latht! Wath waiting for you to thpeak up Tom [/quote] Yeth, thtill here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor J Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 [quote name='JimBobTTD' timestamp='1327036561' post='1505492'] We all buy things made in China. There is no avoiding unethical products nowadays, so I tend to let things like cobalt mining ethics slip by me. I am not proud of this. [/quote]This. We're happy to ignore the shameful human rights violations in China as long as our ipods, iphones, TV's and other household electronics, which play such a major role in everybody's daily lives, remain nice and cheap so why would we care about the trifling little items. And our Classic Vibe Squiers too. That quality for so little money, does anyone really care about the lives of the poor bastards who made it? Not at that price, eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 [quote name='Doctor J' timestamp='1327057512' post='1505709'] And our Classic Vibe Squiers too. That quality for so little money, does anyone really care about the lives of the poor bastards who made it? Not at that price, eh? [/quote] No way! Let 'em sweat! I gotta have my Vibe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
risingson Posted January 20, 2012 Share Posted January 20, 2012 I honestly don't know enough about it to really have an opinion on it, but I would say that consumers who buy products that have been made up of materials sourced from conflict areas or areas with human rights violations are largely unaware of what they're buying into. It should largely be the companies that we buy the products from making a real effort into sourcing materials, parts and labour fairly. Of course there is no excuse for ignorance either, and I think it should also be up to the individual to know more about these kinds of issues as well and to look into individual company ethics based on whether their products interest you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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