mentalextra Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 [i]I recently converted a fretted Yamaha to fretless. Got it off Gumtree for nothing. Seriously underrated guitars in my opinion. Made all the sweeter if you dont pay much for it. It makes all the right noises and is a pleasure to own. But, as far as fretless goes, I will get another.[/i] [i]Fret lines are not high on my priority list. [/i][i]In my current financial position. 1 = price, 2 = sound, 3 = fretlines! When I win the lottery my priority list will be 1 = sound, 2 = sound, 3 = fretlines [/i] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kerley Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 I prefer no fretlines as I also found I didn't use/need them. Although I didn't find them distracting as wasn't looking at them anyway. For me it is purely a muscle memory thing, your hand/fingers get to know the positions just as they do the frets. Just need to know the positions a bit more accurately that is all with no frets to save you. Plus, the main reason I prefer no fretlines - it looks cooler (can't find a smiley to denote shallowness otherwise would have put one in) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo4652 Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 There is a 3rd option; An unlined fretless with a full set of fret markers along the top edge of the fingerboard that only you can see. Some fretless Stingrays have this. You could get an unlined fretless and pay a luthier to put accurate position lines along the top edge of the neck, like this; [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/165526-cheap-but-decent-starter-fretless-sold/page__p__1504679__hl__cheap%20fretless__fromsearch__1#entry1504679"]http://basschat.co.uk/topic/165526-cheap-but-decent-starter-fretless-sold/page__p__1504679__hl__cheap%20fretless__fromsearch__1#entry1504679[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MB1 Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 The Yamaha RBX270F is a great bass and can be found dirt cheap used. MB1. I'll second that emotion! they do an Active (lined fretless) version check that one out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRBboy Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 I don't really see the problem with lines, it can help you get to grips with a fretless if you're not used to it, and when you get to the stage where you don't need to look at the fretboard it's irrelevant whether you've got lines or not. As for the whole asthetics thing........ maybe I'm not image conscious enough! FWIW I've had both, and as a pretty inexperienced fretless player, I found that I did have more confidence playing the lined one. It's not like I was looking at it all the time, but if I ever doubted my intonation I could have a quick look (depends what the gig is, but it's sometimes hard to tell if it's you or someone else out of tune!) The lined one I had was a Yamaha BB614 fretless, and I was amazed by how good it was! I put some black nylon tapewounds on it and it sounded great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry_B Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='redstriper' timestamp='1329741356' post='1546513'] Fret lines make a big difference to me as someone who looks at what their playing - check out Jaco on youtube and you will see he spends most of his time peering at his lined fingerboard. If you don't look, or if you are blind it makes no difference, but if you use your eyes, why not have the lines? I disagree with the stabiliser analogy and I don't see how fret lines can be misleading or distracting, particularly if you are used to a fretted bass. I've never heard of anyone selling a lined fretless bass in favour of an unlined one because they found it distracting. [/quote] It depends on whether your natural playing style is to play in the middle of a fret when playing a fretted bass. If you do that with a lined fretless, you may have problems. It's actually easier to have no lines and use the dot markers on the top of the neck telling you where the important 'frets' lie. That way you don't have to look over your bass neck slightly when playing. You just look at the dots, if you need to. I'm saying this simply because people can tend to have a certain amount of trepidation at the thought of no lines, which is undeserved. It can also tend to make you a bit anxious about playing to start with, which doesn't help. And from personal I tend to think it's a better exercise to chuck yourself in at the deep end and go for it. I started playing an unlined fretless about a year after I started playing bass, just to see if it was doable. It was. If I try to play lined fretlesses nowadays, it seems like too much hard work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry_B Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='RhysP' timestamp='1329743517' post='1546558'] There's a lot of snobbery over the whole lined fretless thing - some people seem to think it's not a "real" fretless if it's got lines or you're cheating, or other such tedious bollocks. Go with whatever you're comfortable with. [/quote] Yep, definitely (to both points). But I think there's also a valid point to saying 'Don't worry about playing a lined one', which was a concern of the OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry_B Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 It's just people expressing their personal preference and advice, remember - no need to take it the wrong way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRBboy Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 [quote name='Jerry_B' timestamp='1329760327' post='1546910'] It depends on whether your natural playing style is to play in the middle of a fret when playing a fretted bass. If you do that with a lined fretless, you may have problems. [/quote] To me, this is exactly why lines make it easier. Playing a fretted bass, you can get away without perfect fingering without affecting the pitch. The lines on a lined fretless tell you exactly where to put your finger for correct intonation; you just have to get used to pitting your finger ON the line instead of behind it. I found, when I first picked up a fretless, that a root/octave stretch felt a bit further because you have to be right on the note. I really don't think that having a lined fretless has any detrimental effect on your technique. As I said before, you don't HAVE to look at the fretboard, and once you get used to a fretless you almost certainly won't very often, but it just might help you out to start with and help develop a more accurate muscle memory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretlesswestone Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 I'm selling a fretless Westone Thunder 1A in Black. Excellent condition. £200 ONO. Excellent beginner fretless bass! http://basschat.co.uk/topic/168722-fretless-westone-thunder-1a-for-sale/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry_B Posted February 20, 2012 Share Posted February 20, 2012 (edited) [quote name='TRBboy' timestamp='1329773240' post='1547216'] To me, this is exactly why lines make it easier. Playing a fretted bass, you can get away without perfect fingering without affecting the pitch. The lines on a lined fretless tell you exactly where to put your finger for correct intonation; you just have to get used to pitting your finger ON the line instead of behind it. I found, when I first picked up a fretless, that a root/octave stretch felt a bit further because you have to be right on the note. I really don't think that having a lined fretless has any detrimental effect on your technique. As I said before, you don't HAVE to look at the fretboard, and once you get used to a fretless you almost certainly won't very often, but it just might help you out to start with and help develop a more accurate muscle memory. [/quote] All true, of course. The point is really that the OP seemed somewhat daunted by the concept of an unlined fretless. Myself and others have tried in our own way to point out that going down the unlined route isn't at all tricky. Technique and trying to get absolute perfect pitch is a slightly different matter, as there may be a whole raft of seperate opinion about that WRT playing a fretless Edited February 20, 2012 by Jerry_B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redstriper Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 [quote name='Jerry_B' timestamp='1329764236' post='1546978'] It's just people expressing their personal preference and advice, remember - no need to take it the wrong way [/quote] Sorry man, I didn't mean to be rude - it's just my warped SOH. I'll delete the post and shut up now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jigster Posted February 21, 2012 Author Share Posted February 21, 2012 hi guys has been an interesting read - i see the issue totally with the UNlined camp, but still unsure as to my natural abilities to intonate without lines - with an unlimited budget i'd go the unlined route and give it a shot. we'll see Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ead Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Please let us know what you end up with so we can all sleep more easily in our beds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jigster Posted February 21, 2012 Author Share Posted February 21, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry_B Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 [quote name='Jigster' timestamp='1329813434' post='1547622'] hi guys has been an interesting read - i see the issue totally with the UNlined camp, but still unsure as to my natural abilities to intonate without lines - with an unlimited budget i'd go the unlined route and give it a shot. we'll see [/quote] Cool. From the get-go, don't get too obsessive about absolutely spot-on intonation. It tends to cramp the learning processes, IMHO. Just relax into it and slowly let your brain go into a slightly different bass playing gear After a while, it will satrt to feel like a natural way of thinking about playing, and then after that you don't really think about it at all and it boils down to feel, hearing, and muscle memory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davehux Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 What you need is to have a lined and an unlined one and see how you get on. By an amazing coincidence, I have a pair for sale at the moment [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/168758-fancy-a-fretless-or-two-westone-thunder-iii-yamaha-bb404f/"]http://basschat.co.uk/topic/168758-fancy-a-fretless-or-two-westone-thunder-iii-yamaha-bb404f/[/url] Keep the one you like and flog the other - it'll be the best £400 you ever spent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megallica Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I've seen a few lined fretless Roadsters on ebay in the last 12 months. Also a Yamaha RBX 800F or was it a RBX 800AF? My first half decent fretless was an active Warwick Rockbass although that was unlined. Also just buy a cheap bass and defret it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pierreganseman Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 the cheap gary willis bass.... works for him... should work for ya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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