Not sure the Markbass LMIII is for me.

[hamfist]

As a "recent returner" to bass I wasn't really aware of what was on the market but, after a little research, I ended up buying a new LMIII a short while ago to enable to get into gigging on bass again. It seemed well thought of and well made.
Anyway, I'm really not sure that I have bought the right amp for me.

I now play in a wedding covers band, but am looking for a fairly "rocky", slightly overdriven, mid-heavy tone for most of it. I would find it difficult naming artists whose tone I would like to emulate , but something very similar to this .... [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ed8NBPmits[/media] , as the band (and my personal tastes) tend to sway towards a pretty punchy, aggressive sound, definately with some OD in it.

I'm pretty sure that the J bass I have is the right bass. I have been through a few OD's in the last few weeks (as I didn't realise just how clean the LMIII is). An ODB-3 (gone), a Hartke Bass Attack (gone), and an EBS Multidrive and DHA VT1 EQ. Both of which I am impressed with. Been through a few cabs too. Ended up with two Tc electronics BC210's, which seem to have a very good "bang for buck" ratio. I like them a lot.

So, anyway, it's the amp that I really think has been a poor choice for me. I want more control (and boost) in the mids than this amp gives me. I just think the Markbass low and high mid frequencies (360 and 800 Hz) for their control knobs are not to my tastes. I suspect its also in the 500-600 Hz range that I want some control. Also the sheer clean-ness of the amp is not good for me.

I have an Ashdown ABM500 coming in the post tomorrow, which I will give a good audition to. But what else could you good BC'ers suggest ? We're talking amps, pedals and maybe even cabs and basses.

I want punchy attack, very flexible mids control and a nice understated background overdrive going on.

BC ... please help me.

Edited February 21, 2012 by hamfist

[Muzz]

Oddly, this'll be the second time today I've typed this, but I used to have a LMIII, and ended up putting a Sansamp/BDI21 in front of it to get an Ampeggy/drive tone, and then I bought a TC Classic (and then a RH450, for the bells and whistles, which are great - there's nothing out there which will do all the RH450 will do in one box) and sold the LMIII and the pedals straight away. The RH450 has frequency controls for the Bass, Low Mid, etc, so there's lots to play with, but, as is being discussed currently, it's a low-mid voiced amp with a definite character that doesn't suit everybody (but then what does?). Having said that, it sounds like it might suit you. The BH500 apparently has the same tone circuits, but is a lot bigger, I've never tried one. Then again, I like the ABM heads (and the Spyder) too, so you might be good to go with that.

[hamfist]

[quote name='Muzz' timestamp='1329850760' post='1548559']
Then again, I like the ABM heads (and the Spyder) too, so you might be good to go with that.
[/quote]

Hmm interesting.
[quote name='Muzz' timestamp='1329850760' post='1548559']
Oddly, this'll be the second time today I've typed this, but I used to have a LMIII, and ended up putting a Sansamp/BDI21 in front of it to get an Ampeggy/drive tone, and then I bought a TC Classic (and then a RH450, for the bells and whistles, which are great - there's nothing out there which will do all the RH450 will do in one box) and sold the LMIII and the pedals straight away. The RH450 has frequency controls for the Bass, Low Mid, etc, so there's lots to play with, but, as is being discussed currently, it's a low-mid voiced amp with a definite character that doesn't suit everybody (but then what does?). Having said that, it sounds like it might suit you. The BH500 apparently has the same tone circuits, but is a lot bigger, I've never tried one. Then again, I like the ABM heads (and the Spyder) too, so you might be good to go with that.
[/quote]

Hmmm. Interesting. The RH450 has definately been on my radar. Just not sure that I'd like the rather compressed tones that the RH series seem to produce (according to popular www gossip). WOuld like to try one if possible though.
Oh, I forgot to mention, that I tried an Ashdown Spyder 550, and was thoroughly unimpressed at it's EQ inflexibility. The ABM's, on paper, have a LOT more flexibility.

[Muzz]

I don't hear much unwanted compression from the RH (there's a great compressor onboard, tho) - a low-mid bump, yes, but then that's great for me. Funny how that's become a very common view since the technical review of the amp came out (other than our own WoT, who actually had one ) when not many people were complaining before. The only way to tell would be to try one and let your ears decide - again, there's dozens of people over on TB bleating about the 'lack of power' issue when they've never even heard one, let alone gigged one...

Yeah, the Spyder's not got much range (neither had the Bass Terror - that's passive EQ for you), but for what it does, it does it very well indeed. One trick ponies sometimes work - I really don't look for a lot of flexibility in an amp (I never troubled the ABM for more than one sound, tbh) so it's not a biggie for me.

[Musicman20]

[quote name='hamfist' timestamp='1329851495' post='1548578'] Hmm interesting. Hmmm. Interesting. The RH450 has definately been on my radar. Just not sure that I'd like the rather compressed tones that the RH series seem to produce (according to popular www gossip). WOuld like to try one if possible though. Oh, I forgot to mention, that I tried an Ashdown Spyder 550, and was thoroughly unimpressed at it's EQ inflexibility. The ABM's, on paper, have a LOT more flexibility. [/quote]

If you want a rock n roll tone, normally this is due to the age old 'tube amps being pushed' which is exactly what the TC RH amps is all about. Basically, they are emulating an Ampeg SVT when its being pushed....but it can be clean or dirty.

[Lozz196]

I found the TC Classic 450 to have a very good middy overdriven sound - though it could clean up nicely.

Though what about checking the Ampeg SVT 7-PRO? Has to be a contender for this type of sound.

[JTUK]

I'd suggest you need a valve stage... even a decent hybrid with valve pre just to push the gain a bit.

My problem with the LM11 is that it is clean ..which is great for me...but then doesn't/can't hold those tones when pushed ..and since I play so lightly, I have to push amps a LOT.

Not a fan of putting a pre amp box in front of an amp tho...

[hamfist]

Great thoughts. THanks guys.

Hadn't thought of the AMpeg SVT 7 pro before. Judging by the available vids and the manual it seems to be clean also though ? Really ????.
ON a separate moan ..... it so pisses me off when people put out lengthy video reviews of amps and completely ignore the different gain variations available. Just because the reviewer doesn't like OD they assume no-one else is interested. GGrrrrrr.
SO is the AMpeg "gain" just input volume control to avoid nasty clipping (like in a LMIII) or can you use it to overdrive the 12AX7 somewhere in there ? I was expecting the latter TBH,

Also, if an RH450 comes up at the right time and right price I would definately give it a shot. Can't remember which video it was, but one of the RH450 youtube efforts seriously impressed me, which is not easy, as I'm a picky bu**er.

[skychaserhigh]

Keep the Markbass and use a Tech21 VT Bass pedal with it , instant Ampeg rock tone.

[Raggy]

[quote name='skychaserhigh' timestamp='1329899695' post='1549160']
Keep the Markbass and use a Tech21 VT Bass pedal with it , instant Ampeg rock tone.
[/quote]

This ^

If you want to go down the TC RH route, really try one out first, they are very marmite.

[chris_b]

My LM2 sounded pretty much like this but cleaner with the Lakland. If I had an LM3 I think my Pbass could get close to the sound on the video you posted.

I'd try the Sansamp or a Precision before you sell the amp.

[fretmeister]

Another vote for the Tech21 VT pedal.

I have a Hartke LH500 and use it with two Markbass Club 121 cabs. It's a clean rig. I like clean. The VT pedal really does turn it into a 2 channel rig.

As it happens I put the VT last in my signal chain, just before the amp. Then it is effectively the amp's preamp. Fuzzes and monster distortion etc go before it. Seems to work best that way.

[sk8]

I'd go for the VT Bass too.

[Gareth Hughes]

Or if you don't dig the Ampeg tone try the Tech 21 Leeds pedal, modeled after a Hiwatt head. I like it a lot - find it a lot clearer than the VT.

[dave_bass5]

Another vote for a Tech21 pedal in front of the LMIII. In my case i'd say a BDDI as that worked for me but i know the VT Bass offers more in the way of tone changing options.
I would say a MB F500 would do punchy attack, very flexible mids control but not the OD/distortion, then again i dont really have experience with much else. The GB Streamliner could do the punch and warm OD but i found the mid control to be pretty basic. Great tone though and there was a thickness to every note that ive not heard from a MB head.

[hamfist]

Update .....

..... THe Ashdown ABM500 EVO III arrived yesterday and, despite one little niggle, is instantly providing me with much more the sound I am looking for. I'm sure it's simply down to the EQ centres on the mid adjustment, of which the ABM is particularly flexible too. The key frequency I seem to like boosted is about 600-650Hz, of which there is a nice big dial on the ABM for. The LMIII lower mids is 360Hz, and the upper mids is 800Hz, which just doesn't get me what I'm looking for, however I twiddle them.

I was also able to rehearse the ABM with the band last night and, with myEBS multidrive on all night, I had a big smile on my face (literally !!! .... I looked like a bit of a mug to be honest). The drummer and guitarist both commented on how awesome the tone was.
Volume was fine, although I can tell that in real terms this amp doesn't put out quite the volume of the LMIII. It's close though, so no biggie for me.

The little niggle I mentioned earlier was a sort of quiet ground-type hum/buzz that there is over every note I play on the ABM. The LMIII simply does not have this as it is so clean with so little background, or unwanted, noise. A quality bit of kit. A real pleasure in fact. And Sooooo much lighter than the ABM. Such a pity it can't quite get me where I want to go.
Anyway, in real terms though, as soon as I start playing properly I simply don't notice the hum/buzz on the ABM as it is really quite quiet. Just a bit annoying for a bedroom geek, but fine in a band, in the real world.

So ultimately the ABM is a keeper for me. I will be experimenting a bit further with pedals/compressors etc for OD sounds but ultimately this amp does what I want an amp to do and has the EQ flexibility that I am looking for. Can't wait to put it through my "big cab rig" (2 x TC Electronic BC210's) at the gig on saturday.

So anyone looking for an almost new, mint, LMIII ... keep an eye out on the for sale forum !

Edited February 23, 2012 by hamfist

[dave_bass5]

Good news then. I actually went from a ABM to a MB SA450 as i felt the ABM was quieter than the MAG i had come from, and i loved the low low end of the ABM and found the SA450 could get close to that, but the LMII couldnt, due to the fixed freq's.

[hamfist]

[quote name='dave_bass5' timestamp='1329987744' post='1550737']
... and i loved the low low end of the ABM and found the SA450 could get close to that, but the LMII couldnt, due to the fixed freq's.
[/quote]

I don't know if the LM3 is different ot the LM2 in this respect, but there was never any problem with lows with the LM3. Seemed to have just as much as the ABM (through my basses/cabs etc, etc !).

But, yes thanks , a great result for me in the end !

[dave_bass5]

Sorry, what i meant was adjustable low end, as in EQ. The LMI/III are pretty sparse in that respect, although it seems most people dont use the EQ much anyway.

[Flex]

I have recently aquired a vba400 + vbc412 and it blows away anthing else I have had.... Not a light rig but is totally manageable. The sound even blew our drummer away.. That says something... Can't recommend it anough, smooth or full on drive at all volumes and great value 2nd hand if you can find one. Nothing like the pure valve setup to cut through and has mid frequency selector too. If you get the chance to try one... Go for it and see what I mean

Edited February 24, 2012 by Flex

[hamfist]

[quote name='Flex' timestamp='1330123181' post='1553224']
I have recently aquired a vba400 + vbc412 and it blows away anthing else I have had.... Not a light rig but is totally manageable. The sound even blew our drummer away.. That says something... Can't recommend it anough, smooth or full on drive at all volumes and great value 2nd hand if you can find one. Nothing like the pure valve setup to cut through and has mid frequency selector too. If you get the chance to try one... Go for it and see what I mean
[/quote]

Interestingly, the VBA400 weighs precisely 12.4 times the weight of the LM3. And at also more than 3 X the price they are not really comparable products. However, I appreciate your love of the Marshall. It's not an amp I have even been aware of before.
However, as an "older" guy with a dodgy shoulder, sadly I suspect the VBA will never get on to my list of potential purchases.

[Prime_BASS]

I think this has been missed.

Genz Benz streamliner. 600 watt will do you nicely.

While personally the single mid control I found limiting, it should do what you want it do. the knob can be set at 600hz which will suit you (if thats really what you want)

The inherent 'flat' sound(knobs at 12) is very phat sounding, it features a similar tone stack as found on the OTB Fender bassman heads. Although (IIRC) it's active to a lot stronger when boosting. The lows a little boosted around the 80-100hz area, very punching, and the highs are boosted (in the 12 o clcok position)

Also the input stage is the traditional, as in it doesn't clip. the cliping light comes on when you are clipping the power stage. Because of this you get the lovely inbetween tones of clean and dirty. It will do very clean (not quiet hi-fi) and extremely dirty.

It's also massively loud.
In fact I sold my 900w to Shep. [url="http://www.sheponbass.co.uk/amplification/"]http://www.sheponbass.co.uk/amplification/[/url]
Only because I really like my LMtube, and I don't need two amps. If I needed a new amp i would definitly look at getting one of these.

[Flex]

To add to the Streamliner. I also have this amp 900w version, keep it as my backup and yes it rocks too, Just I payed more for the Genz Benz new than what I did for the complete Marshall setup second hand and it blows the streamliner away.

[jackers]

if you are digging the abm sound but don't like carrying around the extra weight, then might I suggest the Ashdown MiBass. I am loving mine, and it's tone shaping ability is amazing, so many possibilities

I would also recommend the Genz Shuttles and Streamliners, fantastic amps.

[hamfist]

THanks for all your suggestions.

Despite never actually playing a Genz, there's something that just hasn't appealed to me on every clip that I've ever heard of them.

To be honest, the ABM I now have ticks pretty much every box for me. Although heavier than the LM3, it's still easily a one hand lift, which is pretty much the key for me.

So, I'm not really looking for another amp. Although I have to admit I just bought cccy's GK 700RB II from the forum. It was a great deal, and it's an amp I have really been wanting to try out. It may not oust the ABM from my affections but at least I'll have ticked it off the list. But, who knows, it might bowl me over, and there might be an almost new ABM for sale imminently !!! The GK will have to be pretty special for that to happen though !

Edited February 25, 2012 by hamfist