EdwardHimself Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 (edited) I thought I would make a thread to discuss what is possibly even more contreversial in the guitar world than 5 string basses to us bassists. That's right, 7 string guitars and ERGs (Extended Range Guitars, much like ERBs but in guitar form). I have just bought a new guitar, a 7 string shecter diamond omen extreme. I'm just starting on 7 strings so I figured I'd get something that is not the cheapest but not really expensive either. I used my sister's camera to take these photos, hence the pink socks (don't get too excited ) I was planning on tuning this down to G, hence why I wanted a guitar with a slightly longer scale length (about 67 cm) but I'm not entirely sure what is happening now I realised that one of my other guitars was totally buggered. Edited February 23, 2012 by EdwardHimself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AttitudeCastle Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 How is it? I've been tempted by one of the same! Good thread mate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 (edited) [quote name='AttitudeCastle' timestamp='1329938870' post='1550138'] How is it? I've been tempted by one of the same! Good thread mate! [/quote] It is pretty good so far, I like the feel of it, although I need to set it up properly though first. The previous owner had the action so low, it could practically crawl under a rattlesnake! I think the pickups are possibly a bit muddy. Edited February 22, 2012 by EdwardHimself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBobTTD Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 That looks luscious! I've been interested in seven and eight stringed guitars for a while but can't find any around me to play with and nobody I know has one. There is some great music being made with them. Animals as Leaders is my current favourite and the only new music that has interested me in years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I'm having a guitar/bass hybrid built by Alan at AC Guitars. It [i]was [/i]going to be a 8 string fanned fret Charlie hunter style guitar, but difficulties with hardware (******* ABM) is prompting a possible change in direction to a single scale length 8 string. That will also prompt a change in electronics to a single pickup system rather than the split one we were envisaging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charic Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 [quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1329989571' post='1550769'] I'm having a guitar/bass hybrid built by Alan at AC Guitars. It [i]was [/i]going to be a 8 string fanned fret Charlie hunter style guitar, but difficulties with hardware (******* ABM) is prompting a possible change in direction to a single scale length 8 string. That will also prompt a change in electronics to a single pickup system rather than the split one we were envisaging. [/quote] Look forward to hearing about this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I'm happy to talk about it! The core concept is to have a 'total instrument' - one that has the range of a guitar AND a bass, that I can use for playing bass or playing guitar. This was originally going to be as a Charlie hunter fanned fret 8 string, with separate pickups for bass and guitar sides. Would've been tuned EAD/ADGBE, so bottom three strings are the strings of the bass, top 6 strings are guitar in drop D. However, this requires individual bridge saddles, three bass, five guitar. Problem? ABM suck serious ass at following through on delivery times. We're broaching the 5-6 month mark for waiting for just a few bridge units. I'm not in any rush, but it seems like this could go on indefinitely. So, had a rethink this week and started browsing Conklin's website. You can see they do quite a lot of 8 strings with just a single scale length, so it's clearly doable. I'd tune it EADGCFAD, so becomes more an extended range guitar than a hybrid. Hipshot make 8 string bridges. Alan is talking with them to do a custom toploading bridge (no string through - I love the toploading slot bridges for ease of restringing). It'd be 14mm spacing between the E A and D strings on the bass side, 13mm spacing between the middle D G and C strings, then 12mm between the highest C F A and D strings. Still discussing this with the Hipshot workshop guy. Scale length is TBC, but it's likely to be between 26" and 28". It's a question of whether I want this to be more of an extended range bass or extended range guitar concept. Probably going to opt for nearer the 26" mark for playability in the guitar register. That way I have the option to be able to tune it a fourth higher (i.e. ADGCFBbDG) if I wanted. Instead of split pickup system it'll be a normal pickup system, humbuckers, 3 way toggle switch, volume and tone. We're exploring the possibility of having separate windings for bass and guitar to allow separate outputs, but with that sort of spacing we're probably pushing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 That's really annoying. Can you not get some individual saddle type bridges? [quote name='JimBobTTD' timestamp='1329983179' post='1550657'] That looks luscious! I've been interested in seven and eight stringed guitars for a while but can't find any around me to play with and nobody I know has one. There is some great music being made with them. Animals as Leaders is my current favourite and the only new music that has interested me in years. [/quote] Well I had to take a bit of a punt on this one, not even dawsons had a single 7 string guitar in stock so I just went with this one off ebay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 That's what we've been waiting for! It seems not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Is Black Machine still producing? I remember having a go on the guy from Cry For Silence's 8 stringer and it really was a stunning piece of work! Truckstop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcgraham Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Yea I believe black machine are still producing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velvetkevorkian Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I'm still very much enjoying my own Omen Extreme 7 which I got about 6 weeks ago, although I'm a pretty terrible guitarist. I saw a post on sevenstring.org from a chap who tuned his 27" scale (the Schecters should be 26.5") E Bb E Bb E Bb E, where the low E is the same as a bass guitar low E and high E is the same as a normal guitar high E- quite fancy giving that a shot. If I had €1400 to spare I'd totally buy [url="http://www.ranguitars.com/ran_models/crusher-ff8"]this Ran[/url] though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velvetkevorkian Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 [quote name='Truckstop' timestamp='1329996239' post='1550940'] Is Black Machine still producing? I remember having a go on the guy from Cry For Silence's 8 stringer and it really was a stunning piece of work! Truckstop [/quote] They are pretty special looking. Very difficult to get a spot on the waiting list apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) [quote name='velvetkevorkian' timestamp='1330018932' post='1551585'] I'm still very much enjoying my own Omen Extreme 7 which I got about 6 weeks ago, although I'm a pretty terrible guitarist. I saw a post on sevenstring.org from a chap who tuned his 27" scale (the Schecters should be 26.5") E Bb E Bb E Bb E, where the low E is the same as a bass guitar low E and high E is the same as a normal guitar high E- quite fancy giving that a shot. [/quote] Cool stuff! I did tune it down to G. It means I can play songs in drop C on the top 6 strings or tune it up to D and play in drop G. I have literally got the heaviest string they had in stock at the shop in order to get the right tension on the G, but I do like heavy strings so I guess if you're not in requirement of such high tension then it might go down to E (64). Edited February 23, 2012 by EdwardHimself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velvetkevorkian Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Heh, I tried drop A with the strings on it (10s with a .058 B I think) and that was pretty wobbly. If I do try it it will have to be a special order set, possibly a mix of bass and guitar strings- the guy uses something insane like a .090 for the bottom string. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHimself Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 [quote name='velvetkevorkian' timestamp='1330020091' post='1551613'] Heh, I tried drop A with the strings on it (10s with a .058 B I think) and that was pretty wobbly. If I do try it it will have to be a special order set, possibly a mix of bass and guitar strings- the guy uses something insane like a .090 for the bottom string. [/quote] You would probably have to mod the guitar to get a bass string in there, or just have the ball ends sit out of the end of the ferrule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AttitudeCastle Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 [quote name='mcgraham' timestamp='1329998644' post='1551016'] Yea I believe black machine are still producing. [/quote] Not at the moment, the guy is taking a year out before getting a team together to produce stuff on some kind of scale! I'm thinking about importing an Agile 8 string, but funds keep getting beaten back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truckstop Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 [quote name='velvetkevorkian' timestamp='1330018994' post='1551588'] They are pretty special looking. Very difficult to get a spot on the waiting list apparently. [/quote] Yeah I remember hearing somewhere that you had to prove your worth so to speak before he'd build you one. The guitarist in my first ever band managed to get one made for him. He was 16 at the time and quite the prodigy! Truckstop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftybassman392 Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Speaking of tunings, has anyone thought of tuning from low B in fourths right the way across (effectively giving you the same sequence as a 7-string bass..... I think....)? I've never had a 7 stringer, but did have one of my guitars setup in fourths for a while (C on 2nd, F on 1st string). Although you have to rethink all the chord shapes, the scales - and hence melodic sequences - are much more logical. In fact I think I'll give it another go. Hmmm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velvetkevorkian Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 No, I keep my 7 string bass tuned BEADGBE to match the guitar instead. All 4ths is tempting though, just for the ease of transposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBobTTD Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 [quote name='velvetkevorkian' timestamp='1330253160' post='1554535'] No, I keep my 7 string bass tuned BEADGBE to match the guitar instead. All 4ths is tempting though, just for the ease of transposition. [/quote] Have you tried any other tunings? Like F#BEADGC or similar? I'm sorry for going off topic a bit. On topic, I managed to borrow a seven string guitar. Nice. The B is good. I am still working it out, but it seems good so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velvetkevorkian Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I've not, for a few reasons: -buying sets of strings is expensive, and I like Elixirs which are even more expensive. -I don't think I would make enough use of it musically. I don't use the low B all that often -I have neither the money nor the inclination to invest a lot of time and effort in getting a rig that's capable of it- most of the gigs I've played use borrowed/shared amps, and I have zero interest in the insane gear whoring that goes on in the ams section of the forum. Still, never say never... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBobTTD Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Thanks for the answer. I asked as I have a 6-string but I don't really use the C and was thinking of making it F#-G. I also don't have an amp that would handle it (at least, that is one of the reasons why I haven't done it yet) and doubt I would use it much. I've been listening to music made with 8 string guitars recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leftybassman392 Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 I'm having trouble thinking of a situation in which you'd even use an F# at that frequency. The low B is at around 31 Hz, which puts the F# below it at around 23Hz. The lower limit of most people's hearing is at around 20 Hz! Not to mention the difficulty of building an instrument that can resolve it properly, or the kind of cabinet you'd need to have any useful output at that frequency. Am I missing something here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimBobTTD Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 No, you're not missing anything. It is not practical, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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