Advice..?

[aboyandhisbass]

I've been playing bass for a while now and I've been hoping to turn it into some sort of career.

I've been thinking about teaching bass, but for the past 10 years I've taught myself through learning tabs and learning song after song and I have NO idea where to start if I was to teach someone how to play. I have recently been looking at/learning some scales and also music notation to get an idea of what's what but other than that, I don't know where to go.

For those of you who have been taught bass or any instrument, how did they begin, what/how were you taught and for those who haven't had lessons, any advice on what skills to learn that would perhaps be a good skill to teach?

I hope you can help!

[JakeBrownBass]

You really should know your theory & reading IMO to be able to teach someone & make a living out of it.

[mike257]

Got to agree with Jake - although you don't neccesarily need massive theory knowledge to get by playing in a band, to teach somebody you need to be able to relate to them in clear terms what you/they are playing and why to allow them to develop an understanding of the instrument.

Music theory knowledge is a tool to help us explain and relate the principles of how the instrument works - if you can't explain it, how can you teach it?

[louisthebass]

[quote name='JakeBrownBass' timestamp='1332351762' post='1587181']
You really should know your theory & reading IMO to be able to teach someone & make a living out of it.
[/quote]

What the man said above - you really need those skills. No tab on pro gigs - it'll either be dots or a chord chart. Good people skills are also a must in professional gig and teaching situations.

[JakeBrownBass]

Also, most teachers learn how to teach and what approaches to use by taking things that their teachers taught them!

[seashell]

it doesn't sound as though you've quite got the level of theoretical experience to start teaching right away. But that shouldn't stop you planning to do it in the future. I'll give you a little bit of advice here based on my experiences as a current bass pupil and former careers adviser (so bear in mind anything I say here might be a bit out of date and you'll need to double check it - luckily that shouldn't be too hard what with 'tinternet and all!)

First off, have a look round to see if there are any courses in your area which could improve your theory and give you a teaching qualification at the same time. I have in mind something like this: [url="http://www.accesstomusic.co.uk/"]http://www.accesstomusic.co.uk/[/url] It's a level 3 course (ie roughly A level standard) and can be used as an access course to get you on to Uni. However if you don't take it further then it carries a teaching qualification (suitable for private lessons or to be a peripatetic teacher - wouldn't be enough to get you a job as music teacher in a school). There doesn't seem to be a course like this in Leicester, but research your local FE colleges - you might find something.

As a pupil, what impresses me about my teacher is this -[list]
[*]a wealth of experience performing and recording in different styles of music
[*]grade 8 exams plus a music degree (not saying you'd have to have all that, but some theoretical training would be pretty crucial I'd say)
[*]enthusiasm for lots of different genres of music, so he can tailor lessons to the individual student's interests
[*]ability to plan lessons, prepare materials, give appropriate feedback... ie all the 'teaching' skills
[*]the fact that he used to be in Napalm Death (OK, we can't all have that!! )
[/list]
He starts off by finding out what the student wants to get out of it .. eg playing for own pleasure, performing, working towards exams or whatever. Also roughly how much time the student wants to devote - regular lessons, refreshers now and then, one off masterclasses etc so he can plan ahead.
Also how the student likes to learn... prefer the theoretical approach or just blast in there and learn to play some tunes?

Good luck with it. You might need to invest a bit of time getting there but I hope you'll find it rewarding in the end.

Edited March 21, 2012 by seashell

[Lfalex v1.1]

[quote name='JakeBrownBass' timestamp='1332352404' post='1587201']
Also, most teachers learn how to teach and what approaches to use by taking things that their teachers taught them!
[/quote]

By my own admission, I am not a good student, but the (only, so bad was the experience) "teacher" I had was awful.
Sure, he could play.
Sure, he could read & knew his theory
But he was [u]not[/u] a good teacher.

[Doddy]

[quote name='seashell' timestamp='1332354997' post='1587259']
[*]grade 8 exams plus a music degree (not saying you'd have to have all that, but some theoretical training would be pretty crucial I'd say)
[/quote]

I'll be honest about this point....I know a ton of players and teachers with degree's and grades who
I consider to be pretty poor. I think it's more important to find a teacher who knows this stuff and is
out there doing it. Experience,for me,wins over certificates.

For me,I would discount any teacher who uses tablature predominantly and who bases the lessons
around teaching songs.There is nothing wrong with interspersing songs in the lessons and using them
to reinforce examples,but not as the primary focus.I'd expect a teacher to be able to read and write
music.....there is no point teaching something and not being able to write it down,as chances are that the
student will have forgotten it by the time they get home and you will have forgotten it by the next lesson.
I'd also expect the teacher to know some theory-not necessarily the more advanced stuff(although
that helps) but at the very least major/minor scales,pentatonics and maybe some basic modal scales,
and a knowledge of chord tones.
There are also the intangibles like personality and how you conduct the lessons.Are you able to convey
the information clearly and patiently?

[leftybassman392]

As has been said above, different teachers will bring specific strengths and weaknesses to the party, although any teacher worth the name should know music and should know the instrument(s) they teach. Having said that the one thing all good teachers share is the ability to teach (sounds obvious when you say it like that, but you'd be surprised) - and yes, it is a different skillset from any musical talents you may have. It's not enough to be a good (or even great) player. Students don't turn up just to gape at your brilliance and hope it will somehow 'inspire' them - not if they have any sense.

As others have also said (and with all due respect), from your OP it doesn't sound to me (an ex-tutor) like you're ready for it yet. Not to say you shouldn't - just that you need to get some things sorted first.

Edited March 21, 2012 by leftybassman392

[JakeBrownBass]

[quote name='Lfalex v1.1' timestamp='1332355631' post='1587273']


By my own admission, I am not a good student, but the (only, so bad was the experience) "teacher" I had was awful.
Sure, he could play.
Sure, he could read & knew his theory
But he was [u]not[/u] a good teacher.
[/quote]

You are always going to get teachers like that, but if you feel that, don't go back.

[JTUK]

[quote name='Doddy' timestamp='1332359854' post='1587353']
I'll be honest about this point....I know a ton of players and teachers with degree's and grades who
I consider to be pretty poor. I think it's more important to find a teacher who knows this stuff and is
out there doing it. Experience,for me,wins over certificates.

For me,I would discount any teacher who uses tablature predominantly and who bases the lessons
around teaching songs.There is nothing wrong with interspersing songs in the lessons and using them
to reinforce examples,but not as the primary focus.I'd expect a teacher to be able to read and write
music.....there is no point teaching something and not being able to write it down,as chances are that the
student will have forgotten it by the time they get home and you will have forgotten it by the next lesson.
I'd also expect the teacher to know some theory-not necessarily the more advanced stuff(although
that helps) but at the very least major/minor scales,pentatonics and maybe some basic modal scales,
and a knowledge of chord tones.
There are also the intangibles like personality and how you conduct the lessons.Are you able to convey
the information clearly and patiently?
[/quote]

agree.

[aboyandhisbass]

Hey guys, thanks a ton for all of your advice. I'm the sort of person that likes to jump straight into ideas but all of your feedback has given me a better idea of what I should be doing to improve myself as a musicians first, than just diving in at the deep end and making myself look unprofessional.

I too had lessons at the very beginning but all he did was send me away with some tabs and for £27 it really wasn't worth it. It didn't help that he also had about 5 other students at the same time all playing different instruments..

Any tips on any good theory books or websites I could look at/study? I'm not really in a position to go to college/uni so the internet/books are the best bet for the moment.

[JakeBrownBass]

[quote name='aboyandhisbass' timestamp='1332422335' post='1588063']
Hey guys, thanks a ton for all of your advice. I'm the sort of person that likes to jump straight into ideas but all of your feedback has given me a better idea of what I should be doing to improve myself as a musicians first, than just diving in at the deep end and making myself look unprofessional.

I too had lessons at the very beginning but all he did was send me away with some tabs and for £27 it really wasn't worth it. It didn't help that he also had about 5 other students at the same time all playing different instruments..

Any tips on any good theory books or websites I could look at/study? I'm not really in a position to go to college/uni so the internet/books are the best bet for the moment.
[/quote]

The guy you describe in that is not a teacher.

As for books, this will get you started.

http://basschat.co.uk/topic/168191-your-must-have-music-theory-books/

[seashell]

Reading some of these posts has made me realise how lucky I was to get a great teacher straight away. Especially as I found him by way of a bit of an error in the first place. The husband of a work colleague was having private guitar lessons at a local college, and recommended the place. So I googled it and signed up for lessons. Only months later did I realise that I was actually going to a comepletely different college to the one this chap had recommended!

@ the OP - I'm sure one of our more knowledgeable members will get back to you about on line resources soon. There might be some tips if you go to the Theory forums on here as well.

[Doddy]

Books and websites are great,but if you are serious about this you should really look at getting
some lessons yourself. I'm not being patronising here....I make a living as a musician and I still
take lessons when I can.
The reason I'd take lessons is that you are getting instant feedback as to if you are doing things
correctly or not. Take reading for example-sure you can learn it from a book/online but it is easy
to think that you are playing something correctly for ages when you're not.You can't beat the
feedback of being corrected instantly. You don't want to be learning something incorrectly and then
teaching it to someone else...that's just bad form.
Also,the Internet is a great source of material but unfortunately there is no sh*t filter so you get
a lot of bad 'lessons',so it takes time to actually find the good stuff.

[Fat Rich]

[quote name='aboyandhisbass' timestamp='1332422335' post='1588063']
Hey guys, thanks a ton for all of your advice. I'm the sort of person that likes to jump straight into ideas but all of your feedback has given me a better idea of what I should be doing to improve myself as a musicians first, than just diving in at the deep end and making myself look unprofessional.

I too had lessons at the very beginning but all he did was send me away with some tabs and for £27 it really wasn't worth it. It didn't help that he also had about 5 other students at the same time all playing different instruments..

Any tips on any good theory books or websites I could look at/study? I'm not really in a position to go to college/uni so the internet/books are the best bet for the moment.
[/quote]

I just did a google search for "online bass lesssons" and got pages full... most I've never heard of (and some I definitely don't like the look of!) but it's worth checking out [url="http://scottsbasslessons.com/"]http://scottsbasslessons.com/[/url] he's also on Basschat and is probably the kind of teaching level you should be aspiring to, although it might take a while to get there. There's also The Major's bootcamp right here: [url="http://basschat.co.uk/topic/74284-the-majors-bass-boot-camp-session-index-1-36/"]http://basschat.co.u...ion-index-1-36/[/url]

I've found learning theory with a view to teaching it to someone else is a great way of getting it to stick, basically everything you learn from any source see if you can find a way of explaining it in a simpler way. Think of new examples that demonstrate the theory or technique, also maybe songs that you already play that make learning fun. It won't prepare you for the occasional leftfield question from a student that make your brain zigzag for a few seconds but that just comes with experience.

You may need to expand your musical horizons too, for example I now have no idea what kids these days are listening to and they may have no interest in the kind of stuff I play

Good luck!

Edit: Doddy's way ahead of me, as usual!

Edited March 22, 2012 by Fat Rich

[louisthebass]

Another disciple of Scotts Bass lessons here - definitely one of the best bass teachers on YouTube at the moment, and an absolutely top bloke. Stuart Clayton's books are also really good.

If your budget will stretch, find a really good bass teacher in your area, and get a few lessons with them. Don't be afraid to quiz them a little bit beforehand on how & what they teach, as it's beneficial to both parties in the long run.

[aboyandhisbass]

I never really expected this kind of response, it's great! You've all helped out a great deal and I plan on studying for a while before I even think about teaching.

I'll be sure to check out all of the things you've suggested and keep an eye on this and the other threads you recommended too.

Thanks again!