REDLAWMAN Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 I'm after a high-end, full-range 15" ceramic driver as a direct replacement in a front-ported cab'. I find the Eminence site quite confusing! Does anyone know if they make a LF ceramic driver in 4 Ohms configuration? If not, can someone tell me the best one that they make in 8 Ohms, please and whether that's the best driver out there, or whether some other manufacturer has a superior one? Also, if the original cab was 8 Ohms, is it still simply a question of taking out the old speaker and putting in the new one and job-done? Thanks guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balcro Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 (edited) There are more questions before we can give you advice. 15" 4ohm drivers aren't too common on the Eminence site. What do you mean by high-end and full-range? Presumably you mean "not a neodymium magnet". Is the original driver in the cabinet and if so, what are the markings on it? What power handling is required? Preferably from internal dimensions, what is the size of the cab. Balcro. Edited April 5, 2012 by Balcro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDLAWMAN Posted April 5, 2012 Author Share Posted April 5, 2012 (edited) I do: I want to emulate a 'vintage' tone, not dissimilar from my Berg' NV 412 (although, of course, in this single, front-ported configuration). Entirely happy with a relatively steep roll-off of the highs; looking for that smooth, warm, late 50's/early 60's thing. Current driver is replacement from original: an Eminence Delta LF 15" (500 W at 4 Ohms, I believe). I'm going to run it with a Littlemark, so 300 W at 8 or 500 at 4. I only thought of 4 Ohms so that I could liberate the maxiumum available power from my amp' and thereby attain greater max SPL and performance. As to internal dimensions, I'm unsure: it's a 'biggy' Fender cab from the 90's, perhaps a little smaller than an Ampeg 4X10. It doesn't have to be a scientific breakthrough or the greatest single cab in the world ever: I already have a Barefaced 'Big-Baby'. I just like this particular Fender cab to go with my Fender 'P's for the Rock 'n' Roll! Edited April 5, 2012 by REDLAWMAN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bremen Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 I wouldn't worry too much about getting the maximum power from your amp by using 4 ohms. The difference between 300 and 500W is 2.2dB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balcro Posted April 5, 2012 Share Posted April 5, 2012 Hello Redlawman, Obviously there are a few 4 ohm models about as I've just found this: - http://www.lean-business.co.uk/eshop/eminence-delta-15lf-4ohm-15-500watt-speaker-p-1199.html It should do the job. Apparently works best in an enclosure between 85 - 167 litres in volume. Don't expect a massive difference in volume by allowing the amp to double it's output. Maybe just a decibel or two at best. Balcro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDLAWMAN Posted April 5, 2012 Author Share Posted April 5, 2012 Thanks for that, Balcro, but that's what's in there now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balcro Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 Can't find anything which matches all your criteria in the general price bracket. If the speakers are more efficient they only tend to be either 8 ohms or have slightly lower overall power handling. There are a few loudspeakers available which are louder, but they're not obviously designed for bass guitar and are often over £200 each! The KappaPro 15a only appears to be available in 8 ohm versions, but it is very efficient in the 100Hz - 1kHz area. Just going by frequency response graphs alone it seems to be 4dB louder for a given input. However I can't vouch for it's tone. Why not send an e-mail direct to Eminence for their suggestions. They've previously responded to me in under 48 hours. Good luck. Balcro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 (edited) Lean are selling a 4-ohm 18sound *NEO* driver for £160 at the moment - the 15ND830 . It must be old stock because the 8-ohm version is £75 more. The direct link won't copy, but the site is at: http://www.lean-business.co.uk/eshop/. It's a bargain. I've never used it personally but the spec is right and 18sound speakers are state-of-the-art. Very few (if any) commercial bass cabs use a driver of this quality. Edited April 6, 2012 by stevie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 (edited) Sealed cab? Gogo gadget WinISD pro. Edit: Short summary: putting a state of the art driver into a not state of the art cab is a bad plan. Suitable driver for the cab is going to yield better results. Edited April 6, 2012 by Mr. Foxen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 [quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1333726600' post='1605806'] Sealed cab? Gogo gadget WinISD pro.[/quote] It's front ported. Redlawman actually mentions this twice. [quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1333726600' post='1605806'] Edit: Short summary: putting a state of the art driver into a not state of the art cab is a bad plan. Suitable driver for the cab is going to yield better results. [/quote] According to the manufacturer's specs, the driver I mentioned is recommended for a cab between 80 and 140 litres. The cab as described ("largish 15 smaller than an Ampeg 4x10") is within that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 That makes the port tuning important, and thus needing WinISD. If it is sealed, WinISD still applies but the cab volume reccomendation on the speaker spec actually becomes a useful spec without it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 If Redlawman is bothered about the tuning I'm sure he'll ask, but he hasn't done. He asked for a driver recommendation. And I think we can safely assume that Fender knows how to tune a bass guitar cab. Why make things more complicated than they need to be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 That is a very unsafe assumption. Can't make a recommendation without knowing the tuning, since a suitable tuning means suitable to a driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 (edited) It's unsafe to assume that Fender knows how to port a bass guitar cab? Just editing this, because I think I see where you are coming from now. Bass guitar cabs are all tuned to around 50Hz, give or take. There is a certain amount of wiggle room - tuning to 40 or 60Hz is not going to make that much difference. The tuning frequency is a characteristic of the cabinet - not the driver. So, when you change the driver, the cab tuning frequency doesn't change. As long as the driver is suitable for the cabinet size it will work. You can therefore fit a variety of different drivers to the same cab and they will all perform. They may sound different but you won't need to change the tuning unless the tuning was badly out in the first place. Edited April 6, 2012 by stevie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted April 6, 2012 Share Posted April 6, 2012 (edited) Indeed. See fenders pyramic cab. Not really working with the established cabinet design knowledge of the time. Ports on even fairly current cabs are often undersized, no point is chasing a high excursion quality driver if the port is going into turbulence before it has reached half excursion. EditL: Should probably note I mean the smaller ports might be adequate for the standard speaker loadout, but a premium speaker cab be choked by them. Edited April 6, 2012 by Mr. Foxen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevie Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 (edited) That all makes sense but it's a separate issue to driver choice. The cabinet should have the equivalent of two ports 4" in diameter. By the same token, jack inputs should ideally be changed for Speakons and the cabinet should be damped and braced at its weakest points. But we're now into the realm of redesigning a cab without knowing anything about it. I'm a great believer in premium drivers. There's no point paying £100 for an adequate driver when you can get a great driver for just £60 more. The Eminence Legend CB158 would work. It's £90 but it's not a patch on the 18sound (and not available in 4 ohms anyway). Still, it is better than the Delta 15LF, although that wouldn't be hard. Edited April 7, 2012 by stevie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDLAWMAN Posted April 7, 2012 Author Share Posted April 7, 2012 Thanks very much Balcro & Stevie; very much appreciated. I'll drop Eminence a line as you suggest. Mr Foxen: if I didn't know better, I'd think you have a crush on me. You seem to have made commenting on all of my posts your raison d'etre...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discreet Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 (edited) [quote name='bremen' timestamp='1333632707' post='1604567'] [color=#282828][font=helvetica, arial, sans-serif]I wouldn't worry about getting the maximum power from your amp. [/font][/color]The difference between 300 and 500W is 2.2dB.[/quote] [quote name='Mr. Foxen' timestamp='1333726600' post='1605806'] ...putting a state of the art driver into a not state of the art cab is a bad plan... [/quote] I would broadly agree with the above statements. Edited April 7, 2012 by discreet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 [quote name='REDLAWMAN' timestamp='1333805502' post='1606751'] Thanks very much Balcro & Stevie; very much appreciated. I'll drop Eminence a line as you suggest. Mr Foxen: if I didn't know better, I'd think you have a crush on me. You seem to have made commenting on all of my posts your raison d'etre...... [/quote] You appear to have a lot of money, an a desire for valve amps. I have a lot of valve amps and a desire for money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDLAWMAN Posted April 7, 2012 Author Share Posted April 7, 2012 Why didn't you just say so, silly....!! In which case, I'll have one of your B-15's, please... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Foxen Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Don't really keep toy amps in stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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